Aco4bn187inf Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Even after playing CMBB for years, I still see things I've never seen before. Today I had a buttoned PSW222 killed by a Maxim MG from the front at 173 metres. I knew he was being fired upon by an infantry contact, but there were no signs of it being an ATR or ampulomet, and there was no DSHK sound effect on the battlefield. So I figured why worry about it? Wrong answer. First one then another crew member is hit, and the third bails out. At the end of the game the MG had the 222 listed as his kill. The funny thing is, I've never seen a (supposedly) lowly Maxim do that before. Is this a bit surprising to anyone else out there? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 IIRC - somebody correct me if I'm wrong - the crew of an AFV will automatically abandon the vehicle if it suffers two or more crew casualties. Odds are against two getting killed before they can button up - I've never seen that happen from small arms fire myself, but evidently it can. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 7.62/7.92 MGs kill light vehicles just fine in CMx1. The MG42 shredders M3 halftracks pretty good, too. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bitchen frizzy Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 [Cut] Opening post says the PSW was buttoned. Never mind. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Doesn't matter that it was buttoned - it's an open topped vehicle!! "Buttoned" in this context means that the crew is "heads down" but you can still get bullets in the top!! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aco4bn187inf Posted February 28, 2007 Author Share Posted February 28, 2007 Yep, I have always depended on the German MG's to take out light vehicles- but now it appears that the Russians can do a bit of the same thing with their own MG's. I would guess the Maxim has a shorter lethal range than MG34 or 42, of course, and possibly a lesser chance to cause damage per burst. The 8mm turret armor of the PSW222 would be the weak spot here. Next time I do a Russian defense I will try to get similar results. Previously I would never have bothered to fire a Maxim at a buttoned AC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aco4bn187inf Posted February 28, 2007 Author Share Posted February 28, 2007 Stalin's Organist- Your idea sounded possible, so I just did a casual test against PSW 231's and 232's. They are not open topped, and their rear and side armor is comparable to the turret of the 222. i.e. 8mm at 35 degrees. I fired about 3 maxims each at 5 vehicles at about 135m, from the side and rear. The vehicles were buttoned from the start. The result- within about 4 seconds, a 232 goes to 'bailing out' status, without crew casualties! After 2 minutes I quit the test, as the Maxims were knocking out, causing crew casualties, panicking and routing the AC's. Conclusion- the Maxim is definitely shooting right through the armor! 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aco4bn187inf Posted February 28, 2007 Author Share Posted February 28, 2007 Getting a bit obsessive- I just did the same test at 200m range. Takes longer to hurt the vehicles, but two of five are knocked out after two minutes, and another is routed after three minutes. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted February 28, 2007 Share Posted February 28, 2007 Originally posted by Aco4bn187inf: Is this a bit surprising to anyone else out there? No. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kettler Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 As shown here, German HMGs also can kill tanks! http://www.fewgoodmen.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1151&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 Regards, John Kettler 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 deleted per user request 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McIvan Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 I think there would be a reasonable chance that the first and all subsequent bullets would go stright through 1cm of plate, if they hit it at close to 90 degrees. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted March 1, 2007 Share Posted March 1, 2007 deleted per user request 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas Posted March 2, 2007 Share Posted March 2, 2007 All this is pretty irrelevant to Real Life. In Real Life machine-guns were issued AP rounds, which in the German case could IIRC go through 8+mm of armour plate, depending on the distance. The German approach was to make their light armour SmK proof (SmK is the German abbreviation for the AP munition). This is the reason for the heavy sloping of the armour on their HTs, and also on the SPWs. But there are of course areas where the plate is not heavily angled, and where, at shorter distance, the armour is not always going to be sufficient. Especially the 231 which only had 5mm minimum armour is going to be an endangered species. The worst performers in this regard are of course the US HTs, who have no angle on their armour, and armour that is not SmK proof to start with. There's a reason they were called 'Purple Heart Boxes'. All the best Andreas 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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