Tiger vs. T-34/85?

[Cpl Carrot]

Ah but I have infantry. Changes the whole equation. Now stop dragging the thread off topic

[Andrew H.]

I think it's interesting to look at the Tiger vs. T-35/85 match up a little more historically, both by adding rarity and by giving crews an appropriate experience level. This gives you, in November '44, 10 green T-34/85s vs. two vet Tigers and one vet Tiger 2. I think that's an interesting matchup, and I think it gives the T-34's more of an edge...although they still have to be careful.

In general, though, I'm finding that picking green soviet tanks tends to be a good idea, as the extra tanks are usually more useful than fewer tanks with more experience. Although I don't believe that this works as well for the Germans, probably because, mid to late war, the soviets are always finding themselves in a situation where they can't hurt the Germans until they get close or flank, and having more tanks maximizes the chance that some tanks will survive.

I.e., it doesn't matter if you have crack or elite gunners in your T-34/85s if you are 1200 meters away from a Panther that is facing you.

On the other hand, for the Panther in that situation, you want to shoot as fast and as accurately as possible, before you can be flanked.

And even conscripts can hit another tank when the range is 200 meters or so.

[Nippy]

I.e., it doesn't matter if you have crack or elite gunners in your T-34/85s if you are 1200 meters away from a Panther that is facing you.

Save the Elite crews for the JS-2s. Those things lay down the hurt at over 1000m if given the chance.

On the other hand, for the Panther in that situation, you want to shoot as fast and as accurately as possible, before you can be flanked.

After running the "Nippy Challenge" with Panthers instead of Tigers, I have found a whole new respect for the Panther.

A T-34 can pop up, take a flank shot, and be back under cover before a Tiger can return fire. A Panther has a good change of getting one and maybe even 2 shots off at the T-34 before it hides again. With the Tiger, your grandchilderen will be collecting social security by the time it can face the target. The Panther, despite the slow turret, can slew the whole body of the tank to face the target in a matter of seconds.

Not to mention the Panther is faster, bogges less, and has a better/more accurate main gun. Also, platoon wise, you get 5 tanks instead of 4.

I was forced to use a 2 Tank JS-2 section to take out a platoon of Panthers after all my T-34/85s blundered into them and got killed. On the flip side, 1 JS-2 took out 3 Panthers. One kill was a +1,200m. You should have seen the look on my face:

*KABOOM*

"Crap, there is no way that shot will hit..."

*CRUNCH* 'Helfa! Helfa!'

:eek:

[Sergei]

Experience also affects the command delays. So green crews react more sluggishly than veterans, taking away some of the mobility advantage. This is a factor, if you want to out-maneuver the German Big Cat.

[Cpl Carrot]

Just finished a QB against the AI (cos I have no turns to do). I had 3 OT 34's against a Tiger. I manouved to its rear and did a shoot and scoot. The nasty thing took two rear hull pens and kept on going! When I popped out agian a few turns later, it took 2 more side hull pens and kept on going! :eek: I finally stopped it when I snuck a KV 85 up to it at a range of about 25m.

Based on that I would take the Tigers

[CombinedArms]

Originally posted by Cpl Carrot:

Just finished a QB against the AI (cos I have no turns to do). I had 3 OT 34's against a Tiger. I manouved to its rear and did a shoot and scoot. The nasty thing took two rear hull pens and kept on going! When I popped out agian a few turns later, it took 2 more side hull pens and kept on going! :eek: I finally stopped it when I snuck a KV 85 up to it at a range of about 25m.

Based on that I would take the Tigers

There's a critical mass issue here, too. One Tiger can't cover all of its own flanks, and might be vulnerable against 3 or more T34s, but four Tigers can fan out in a horseshoe formation and, in the right terrain, potentially cover all avenues of attack. But against the right cover they can't overwatch the whole battlefield. Again, I think it comes down to terrain--and assignment. E.g., if the Tigers have to attack they may be more vulnerable than if they're holding ground.

[Andrew H.]

Originally posted by Cpl Carrot:

Just finished a QB against the AI (cos I have no turns to do). I had 3 OT 34's against a Tiger. I manouved to its rear and did a shoot and scoot. The nasty thing took two rear hull pens and kept on going! When I popped out agian a few turns later, it took 2 more side hull pens and kept on going! :eek: I finally stopped it when I snuck a KV 85 up to it at a range of about 25m.

Based on that I would take the Tigers

Those are T-34/76s, though, not T-34/85s.