Kanonier Reichmann Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 I've just noticed that Daisy Chain mines aren't exactly 100% reliable in at least immobilising vehicles that travel over them. I'm currently playing a game where a shocked German halftrack reversed directly over a Daisy Chain mine with no ill effect. Then later on, another bleedin German halftrack must have gone right over another one of my Daisy Chain minefields as 2 overlapping fields side by side were set between a narrow bocage lane where this halftrack suddenly appeared. Has anyone else had similar experiences with these types of minefields? Perhaps halftracks are somehow immune to them & it may be a bug? Or is the simple explanation that there is a good chance that they will have no effect on vehicles but are only intended to discourage vehicles from going through them. Regards Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgars Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 I FEEL that light armored vehicles are less prone to a damage from Anti Tank mines. I am not aware of different technologies used in anti tank mines (and coded in the CM) but could it be that AT mines are more likely to destroy a TANK, not every Ford Explorer that drives over them? And another question: is usual Anti Tank minefield any different from Daisy Chains, apart from being invisible? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by ciks: And another question: is usual Anti Tank minefield any different from Daisy Chains, apart from being invisible?<hr></blockquote> They aren't always invisible. Indeed, my own experience has been that they tend to get spotted (at least 80% of the time, YMMV) as soon as any unit gets within 150 meters of them. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
edgars Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Michael emrys: They aren't always invisible. Indeed, my own experience has been that they tend to get spotted (at least 80% of the time, YMMV) as soon as any unit gets within 150 meters of them. Michael<hr></blockquote> I did a test regarding this once. There was a Daisy Chain and usual AT minefield side by side. I ran the "test" three times, with Ami infantry platoon advancing towards the mines from 300-400m distance, with engineer platoon, and finaly with sharpshooter. Daisy chain mines were allways spotted when units were some 200-250m away With usual AT mines no success at all. Units were sitting directly on top of mines, but failed to spot them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Conscript Bagger Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 One difference between daisychain and normal mines (both AT and AP) is that the "invisible" ones have a greater coverage area - they're about the size of one CM tile (20m on a side), while the daisychains are only wide enough to span a road. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by ciks: I ran the "test" three times...<hr></blockquote> Try running it about 50 more times. Then you might have some statistically interesting results. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mud Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 Another difference, if memory serves, is that engineers don't need demolition charges to clear daisy-chain mines -- only time. Hrmmm. It's definitely a WAG, but does the detonation probability have anything to do with ground pressure or nature of vehicle (wheeled / tracked)? Just speculating that a wheeled vehicle should have much less contact area with the road, and perhaps the probability of it actually hitting a mine (especially one that's clearly visible and that might therefore be somewhat avoidable by an alert driver?) is reduced. Might be relevant to know whether those HTs set off the mines, but were undamaged, or whether they managed to avoid 'em completely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cameroon Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by Mud: Hrmmm. It's definitely a WAG, but does the detonation probability have anything to do with ground pressure or nature of vehicle (wheeled / tracked)?<hr></blockquote> I can't say I've done any research to support this, but I've always thought that it was ground pressure based. It makes sense to me, because I wouldn't want my AT minefield to reveal itself when a jeep ran through it by destroying the jeep. I think I implied this because infantry won't set off an AT minefield, which only makes sense if the field is pressure sensitive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mud Posted October 29, 2001 Share Posted October 29, 2001 Probably. I don't have any references on, er, WWII-era landmines and their triggering mechanisms, though. Nowadays, what, maybe we could design largely plastic-shell mines with some kind of magnetic trigger for detecting the proximity of large quantities of ferrous metal. It'd surprise me if WWII-era landmines were that advanced (IOW, not just pressure-triggered), but *shrug*. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted October 30, 2001 Author Share Posted October 30, 2001 Well I can attest to the fact that AT mines DO explode when a Jeep travels over them but I haven't tried it with Daisy Chain mines as it's too hard to get them to move over them. As for halftracks, they do have a fair bit of track in contact with the ground (especially the German ones) and I would have thought that they would trigger AT & Daisy Chain minefields for sure... but apparently not, at least in my game. Regards Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricM Posted October 30, 2001 Share Posted October 30, 2001 OK I maybe wrong about what CMBO calls a Daisy Chain mine but I read in a book about the Battle of the Bulge that what the author called Daisy chain mines were mines somehow attached to each other that were dragged across a road. From what I remember it was for quick road blocks and worked best in a night defense position. When they were used during the daylight it was to cause the Germans to have to send out troops to clear them and slow down the armor. If this is what CMBO models then it would explain why they are so easily spoted. They are just sittin on top of the ground. Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
offtaskagain Posted October 30, 2001 Share Posted October 30, 2001 Daisy chain mines are a series of mines strung together and then laid across a road as already mentioned. They were sometimes command detonated or sometimes left just to delay the enemy, again as others have mentioned. AT mines certainly were somewhat pressure sensitive even back then, as AT mines required hundreds of pounds of pressure to detonate so some infantry squad won't set off the trap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fieldmarshall Posted October 30, 2001 Share Posted October 30, 2001 When I use Daisy Chain Mines I don't use them for destroying vehicles, but to keep them out of certain areas permanantly or to delay them until their engineers pop up. They should not be relied upon like normal mines but as a defense that can lure the enemy off an approach and into the sights of your gun barrels. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kingfish Posted October 30, 2001 Share Posted October 30, 2001 <blockquote>quote:</font><hr>Originally posted by EricM: OK I maybe wrong about what CMBO calls a Daisy Chain mine but I read in a book about the Battle of the Bulge that what the author called Daisy chain mines were mines somehow attached to each other that were dragged across a road. From what I remember it was for quick road blocks and worked best in a night defense position. When they were used during the daylight it was to cause the Germans to have to send out troops to clear them and slow down the armor. If this is what CMBO models then it would explain why they are so easily spoted. They are just sittin on top of the ground. Eric<hr></blockquote> You are correct. daisy chain mines Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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