Guest ciks Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 I wanted to play a Quickie as Defending 600pt Unrestricted force Germans, against Unrestricted Allies. Guess what did CM buy for me? Haa! 3 roadblocks 3 barbed vires 2 Vet 251/1 Halftracks 2 DaisyChain Mines 1 Anti-Tank mine patch 1 Anti Personell 2 Vet 81mm Mortars 1 Vet Stug III 1 Vet 75mm AT Gun AND NOT A SINGLE INFANTRY UNIT!!!! How I am supposed to fight with these? Anyhow, I'll try and maybe post some results later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gremlin Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 Time for 1.13? ------------------ New to Combat Mission? Visit CM Boot Camp at Combat Missions for tips. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoePrivate Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 I don't understand this. If you allow the computer to pick for you it's because you want the unexpected and a new challenge isn't it? If you have a pre-determined force make-up in mind already then why didn't you just manually choose it yourself?, instead of picking unrestricted computer selection and then complaining about what you received! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jd Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 Unrestricted is ........well unrestricted. Be careful of what you wish for!! Seems there would be no problem to letting the computer pick unrestricted for itself and conventionally for you if you choose not to pick your own. Either side can be set independently. Where's the problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lordfluffers Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 The new unrestricted setting is to allow people the freedom to play around with concepts, 'what ifs' etc. If you want to play a battle against the AI and not choose your units, then use the infantry, armour, motorised or combined arms settings. Of course you are not going to get a balanced or realistic force from the 'unrestricted' setting. Jesus, some people... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 I don't think our friend was complaining, to be honest. I found his post kinda funny. Would be interesting to see what the enemy has to go up against him with. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted February 9, 2001 Share Posted February 9, 2001 I could be wrong ofcourse, I was wrong once I believe, when I was twelve. But I wouldn't over estimate the AI's ability to reason in the abstract. That is to say, while I think CM's AI is pretty darn good at its task, and outshines most others in a similar line of business, it never-the-less is in the end the same thing that other AI's are, IMLOHO, a number cruncher. So, it's choosing this and that not based upon their abstract considerations of fighting abilities, though it may I suppose consider things like mobility and other preprogrammed values, but it is rather making judgements upon the weighted values as prescribed in the data base somewhere. And a string of barbed wire being worth (x) amount against a this or that worth (x) amount and the mobility of this or that thing against this or that other thing. At least, that is how I see it. And again, there is that potential, however remote that I could be wrong. ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 Unrestricted autopurchase is totally random. It's not meant to give you realistic troops OOB's and was added to allow greater freedom in player vs. player QB's. It is best utilized when you buy your own units. Now having said that, I have gotten some very challenging games using this setting against the AI. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Space Thing Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 ciks, That seemed a little alarming, so I went and tried to see what would happen to me. I used the same parameters that you supplied and this is what I got: 1 Pz IVH 1 50mm AT gun 1 250/7 HT (mortar carrier) 1 251/9 (75mm) 2 Anti-personnel mines 1 AT mines 1 Barbed wire 1 Road block 1 SMG platoon (with HQ) 1 MG42 HMG team 1 Panzerschreck team 1 81mm mortar team For a small 600 pt. game that seems OK with me. Everyone was veteran quality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Banshee Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 Originally posted by ciks: I wanted to play a Quickie as Defending 600pt Unrestricted force Germans, against Unrestricted Allies. Guess what did CM buy for me? Haa! 3 roadblocks 3 barbed vires 2 Vet 251/1 Halftracks 2 DaisyChain Mines 1 Anti-Tank mine patch 1 Anti Personell 2 Vet 81mm Mortars 1 Vet Stug III 1 Vet 75mm AT Gun AND NOT A SINGLE INFANTRY UNIT!!!! How I am supposed to fight with these? Anyhow, I'll try and maybe post some results later... Actually when I get a crappy purchase selection and terrain I always just use my imagination and pretend i'm a rear guard trying to do as much damage as possible to the enemy before I have to leave the map (trying to lose little to nothing in the process). It usually turns into a fun game. ------------------ Veni, vidi, panzerschrecki Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RudeLover Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 3 roadblocks 3 barbed vires 2 Vet 251/1 Halftracks 2 DaisyChain Mines 1 Anti-Tank mine patch 1 Anti Personell 2 Vet 81mm Mortars 1 Vet Stug III 1 Vet 75mm AT Gun If you do imagine the 'blocking action, then retreat' thing, you've got to think those two mortars will think seriously about dropping some friendly fire on the PaK so they can ride the halftracks home... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ales Dvorak Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 If its random its random, or what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sitting Duck Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 I simply <u>love</u> the completely random settings! ------------------ Steve of BTS - "With a company our size, every sale does in fact count (unlike every vote in certain assbackwards states )." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasoncawley@ameritech.net Posted February 10, 2001 Share Posted February 10, 2001 Rude-lover - Nope, the force is totally mechanized. 81mm mortars are teams. You can cram two of the suckers into one halftrack. I think that sounds like a fun blocking action indeed. You've got the gun and MGs on the Stug, plus 2 MG nests on the 'tracks, all armored and mobile. That can slow people down crossing open areas. When they cluster at some woods near a spot of open ground before crossing it, the mortars hit them for 2-3 minutes and then those are done, ammo expended. Send a 'track back to pick them up and exit to the rear. Can even drop them at the edge and come back, if you need the MG and the situation hasn't completely collapsed. The AT gun waits in an AT ambush, which you channel somebody to with the minefields and roadblocks. The one hidden AT minefield can also be part of that. You bag a tank or two. The StuG then covers the same area (newly revealed AT mine helps do that too), long enough to hitch the AT gun and evacuate it with the other track. (If the AT ambush happens first, the mortars can help this difficult operation with their handful of smoke rounds, too). The StuG is crawling in reverse before the onrushing hordes as the scene closes - LOL. Set yourself a challenge like getting all the men off and bagging so-and-so much material (casualties or vehicles). In VP terms, the other guy will probably win from objectives, but there is no reason you couldn't come out ahead in pure casualty terms. It is a pure "ambush and fall-back" defense... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest ciks Posted February 12, 2001 Share Posted February 12, 2001 OK, here I am again! I wasn't complaining nor requesting a fix (i think some of you guys are so used to such stupid requests, that you seem to see them where they aren't) No offence, off course. Unrestricted autopurchase is totally random. It's not meant to give you realistic troops OOB's and was added to allow greater freedom in player vs. player QB's. Thanks Madmatt, that fully explains it. Now back to the battle. Computer had 2 Cromvels VI, 2 Engineer Platoons, 2 or 3 MMG cariers, 1 Humber Scout car, and some support weapons (PIATs, 2inch mortars off course, and VickersMG), all Veteran. It ended up with a Draw (AI had experience 3), only because engineers cleared the Daisy-Chains and i got Cromvel on my flank taking out AT Gun and mortar. My StuG survived till turn 19 of 20, and was finally taken out by PIAT from some 180m (that was PIATs last shell as i checked after the battle, rrrr). Anyway, despite not winning this i think Unrestricted Force is a small nice feature making a game more fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted February 12, 2001 Share Posted February 12, 2001 Hi Guys, Just for you info, the unrestricted option was put in by Charles for use primarily in Human vs Human battles where both sides are purchasing their units. This was due to some people being unhappy with being forced to purchase units from certain categories, and was not designed to allow for the AI to purchase units. If you wish to have your units purchased by the AI, Id recommend using one of the restricted for battle... Dan PS : Hehe, I just noticed Matt answered, but I may as well leave my comment here too. [This message has been edited by KwazyDog (edited 02-12-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hans Posted February 12, 2001 Share Posted February 12, 2001 Hey I LOVE unrestricted. Like the gentleman above I like to imagine that is what I have been left to defend with or to make a desperate counter-attack.....makes you come up with some imaginative things. With a 300 point unrestricted I had an enormously interesting fight between my defending forces. 2 Brits PIATs some obstacles/mines and a Daimler vs a force of 1 Stug, some HTs and mixed infantry. The Daimler was taken out quickly but the German AFV force drove into a minefield and was picked off one by one by (the luckiest)PIAT gunner in the world. What happened to the German Infantry? Ran into a mine field and then by an odd IA thought process tried to move to the battle field by moving thru barbed wire, roadblock then another AP minefield, overlooked by a mean and hostile Daimler crew....never quite got there! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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