What Caliber is the MG42HMG & MG42LMG?

[lcm1947]

I have played this game for a year now and just realized that I don't even know what caliber these two German machine guns are. Would someone be so kind as to educate me? The main reason I'm asking is that it seems to me that both these guns are much more powerful or at least more effective than the American MG's and since the American MG's shoot the powerful 30/06 I really can't see that the 7mm Mauser which is what I was thinking they shot is that much better if even better at all. Now it may be that they are just a better MG overall and I was also hoping that someone would bring that up when answering this post. Anybody know? :confused:

[gatpr]

They are both 7.92 mm.

[David Aitken]

The MG42 light and heavy are the same gun in different configurations. The MG42 fires the 7.92mm x 57mm Mauser cartridge. Its power is derived from its rate of fire, 1200 rounds per minute, as opposed to the 450 of the Vickers and 500 of the Browning M1919 and M2HB.

[dragonwagon]

They both are 7.92mm .

Both weapons are they same ,the only difference being the way they are set up. The hvy. being mounted on a tri pod and belt fed. Where as the Lt. MG being drum fed and had a by-pod instead.

[xerxes]

So if my lmg runs over to the foxhole where my hmg team was wasted a couple of minutes ago then it should be able to use the tripod and the left over ammo & belts and become a hmg.

I'm going to try that next game.

- xerxes

[WWB]

Not quite Xerxes. If you have ever seen one of the tripods, you can tell how involved it would be to mount the gun on it.

WWB

[Moon]

Xerxes, CM does not allow to reman guns/HMGs/mortars.

[xerxes]

I forgot the

- xerxes

[Freak]

What Caliber is the MG42HMG & MG42LMG?

To answer the question, the MG42 HMG and LMG are .0312 caliber. (7.92mm)

[L.Tankersley]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Freak:

What Caliber is the MG42HMG & MG42LMG?

To answer the question, the MG42 HMG and LMG are .0312 caliber. (7.92mm)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

To correctly answer the question, the MG43 HMG and LMG are .312 caliber (7.92mm).

[ 08-10-2001: Message edited by: L.Tankersley ]

[Freak]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by L.Tankersley:

To correctly answer the question, the MG43 HMG and LMG are .312 caliber (7.92mm). ;p<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Woops how'd that get in there? Doh!

Thanks L. Tankersley.

[Shandorf]

Here is everything you want to know about the 7.92x57mm cartridge.

This cartridge was used by the german Mauser Karabiner 98K, Gewehr 41, 43 and numerous other rifles as well as in aircraft, vehicle and infantry machine guns. As the german standard rifle cartridge it was called Infanteriepatrone 7,9mm ("infantry cartridge"), also known as the 7,9mm - Militärpatrone ("military cartridge") or as Mauser - Standardmunition 7,92x 57 (Mauser as the weapon company that introduced the ammo for its famous 98K rifle; 7.92mm is the calibre and 57mm the length of the casing (not the chamber as in the US); also, in germany a bore's caliber is measured from land to land). The total production of this cartridge during WW II was 10,475 million (that is over ten billion). Sometimes, esp. among angloamericans, it is also referred to as 8 mm Mauser.

The fired projectile of the Infanteriepatrone had a typical initial energy E0 of 3,700 Joule (sS - projectile of 12.8g at a V0 of 760m/s) but could reach initial energies of over 4,500 Joule (some V-Patronen) depending on the concrete ammunition type and firing weapon.

Between 80 and 90 % of all 7,9mm ammunition produced was of the 7,9 sS (sS for schweres Spitzgeschoss = "heavy pointed bullet") type; the complete cartridge weighed 27g, it was 80.6 mm long and contained 2.7g of gunpowder; the projectile weighed 12.8 g and was 35mm long. When fired from a MG34 or MG42 (as well as from the other rifles using the cartridge) it had a typical V0 of 755 m/s. The regular sS projectile had the following penetration performance: 85cm of dry pine wood at 100m, 65cm at 400m, 45cm at 800m and 10cm at 1,800m; 10mm of iron at 300m, 7mm at 550m; 5mm of steel at 100m; 3mm at 600m.

The second most used type was the SmK (Spitzgeschoss mit Kern = "pointed bullet with core") bullet that measured 37.2mm, weighed 11.5 g and contained a hardened steel core (about 8% of all produced 7.9mm rounds).

Another type was the SmK L'spur (L'spur = Leuchtspur = "bright trace" = "tracer") bullet that was the previous type combined with a tracer that burned for 800 to 900 m (a little less numerous than the SmK). In the picture at right a soldier is seen preparing a 7.92mm ammunition belt for a machine gun (presumably adding tracers at every seventh round).

The lS (leichtes Spitzgeschoss = "light pointed bullet") which had an aluminum core and therefore weighed only 5.5g which resulted in a higher speed of V0 = 925 m/s but of course also in a shortened total range (the bullet was used mainly in the air defense role; about 4-7% of the total production), the lS-L'Spur which with a length of 37.2mm and a weight of 6.1g was again the tracer version of the lS (less than 1% of total production).

A version produced mainly for use with the MG 17 as aircraft armament was the so-called V-Patrone which had an increased powder charge that increased the V0 by 15%. This ammunition type was available with the PmK projectile ("Phosphor mit Stahlkern" = "phosphor with steel core") or with the B ("Beobachtung" = "Observation") projectile contained a little phosphor and exploded upon impact, the latter ammunition type was also known as the B-Patrone and was used as an incendiary round; both types are not counted in the 7,9mm production

.

The final and most interesting (for our purposes) bullet type was the SmK(H). The H stood for Hartkern (hardened core), this was the armor piercing version of the 7,9mm Infanteriepatrone. The projectile had a length of only 28.2mm, weighed 12.5 g and contained a tungsten core that was 22.5 mm long. The propellant gunpowder of the shell was increased to 3.6 g. The bullet had a penetration power of almost 20mm of plain steel at a range of 500m (90° impact angle). However, production of this ammunition type ceased in March 1942 because of an acute shortage of tungsten; still, SmK(H) cartridges continued to be issued to the troops as late as February 1943. while it was still inproduction, this ammo type accounted for 1 to 2 % of the production of 7,9mm Infanteriepatronen.

When the machine guns used the normal sS ammunition they achieved an armor penetration of up to 10mm and more at close ranges. Now, on to the machine guns themselves. Development of the german machine guns went towards a general purpose machine gun, therewith abandoning the differentiation hitherto between light machine guns carried around by the assaulting infantry and heavy machine guns that were intended as stationary support weapons. First developments in this direction were the MG 29 and the MG 30. The latter was not accepted by the german armed forces but by the austrian army; therefore, after austria became part of the third reich, the Wehrmacht eventually had this weapon too. It was also produced during WW II in a small production run for the finnish forces. Another development by the companies Mauser and Metallwarenfabrik Kreuzlingen led to the LMG 32 that formed the basis for the MG 34.

That should do it.

Jeff

[lcm1947]

Well, I guess I know now. Thank all who answered and Shandorf- don't be a showoff. No that was great, thanks.

[Måkjager]

The question that actually has me bothered is why the Geramns never(?) employed the MG131 as a ground support weapon like the US HMG .5

This weapon which was used in Luftwaffe aircraft had a calibre of 13mm.....very close to the Allied 12.7mm HM~G.

Does anybody have any thoughts ?

Was it due to the tactical employment of the Geramn squad which placed more on mobility than firepower ?

regards

Måkjager ( hic*)

[Herr Jung]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by M?jager:

The question that actually has me bothered is why the Geramns never(?) employed the MG131 as a ground support weapon like the US HMG .5

M?jager ( hic*)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Probably because of the doctrine and logistics. Germans stressed standardization of ammunition even though they ended up with a whole mixture of weaponry. 7.92 X 57 mm ammuntion was the standard Infanteriepatrone for K98k, G41/43, MG34/42, ZB26/30, FG42, etc. The 9mm pistol round was used for P08/38, MP38/40, etc. So it was a huge task to take on the 7.92 Kurz development and supply for Stg44 as well as other calibers for the ground role. There are accounts that the heavier MGs were indeed used for the ground role as the war progressed on. Germans did seem to have this 'machine gun fetish' and the mindset was that the new universal machine guns (i.e., MG34/42) could do all the jobs with the high rate of fire and sophisticated tripod mounting for long range accuracy and effect. This belief could have been so strong that they felt they didn't really need to introduce different caliber machine guns which lacked mobility and would put strain on the logistics (except for specialized roles). Maybe they preferred to go with more portable MGs along with the combined arms and seizing of the initiative. Anti-vehicle work could be achieved with AT guns, FLAKs, etc.

My question to others is: how does the German 7.92 X 57 mm round compare to others such as the US .30-06 (7.62 x xx mm) and the British .303 and the Nato 7.62 X 51 mm? In simple terms please. My understanding is that the Nato round owes much to the German round which produced less smoke and all the rounds are pretty much comparable in terms of performance.

Herr Jung