Tiger Posted January 11, 2001 Share Posted January 11, 2001 Playing a QB last night I had the strange occurence of a Panther tank of mine hunting forward towards a ridgeline with a small house on his left, with an addtional hunt command added to the end of the first to get into proper postion. There's a Cromwell about 200m down the slope on the other side. Enemy infantry (Poles) have advanced against my left flank and are 490-500+m away from this panther on its left and behind, across a small valley. Start the turn: Panther (unbuttoned) aquires infantry to his extreme left rear flank at 498m and rotates turrent to engage, while moving forward in short bits (does not hull rotate). Fires only turrent mg at infantry 498m away (prob why it didnt bother to hull rotate). Turn ends, not yet at crest of ridge, Panther turrent back-assedwards Ok so next orders I cancel the panther's infantry target, change his first hunt forward command to move forward by clicking on his hunt waypoint and pressing the spacebar, switching the hunt to "move". Watch the next turn replay. Same as before. Panther immediately targets this infantry squad now 496m away, slowly creeps forward, never fires its main gun. Turn ends, just on the ridgetop, Cromwell just out of LOS, my Panther turrent faced backwards towards the infantry still. There's still a tiny bit of the first move order left in addtion to the original second hunt order. Except the move order I had just changed to the previous orders phase is now positively a hunt command, with the second hunt command still tacked on. This explains why my Panther re-aquired the infantry a second time. The first hunt command I changed to a move seems to have switched back to hunt, or I'm seeing things. Possibilities: 1) changing the tanks move order while there's a second command (like hunt) attached causes the modified move order to be ignored. 2) I thought I changed the first hunt command to a move but didn't, 3) A tank will execute it's second and subsequent commands over their first commands given when enemy in sight (498m away in this case), executing the second hunt command, ignoring the changed hunt to move command. This had a happy ending though as next turn even when coming into los of the Cromwell with it's turrent backassedwards, the Cromwell took no notice and my Panther aligned turrent and hull and took out the Cromwell with a side upper hull shot with its second shot. It's the parts in between that were vexing. Something else that puzzels me: Same game I had a 75mm AT gun take out 2 vehicles early on that had haphazardly charged over the ridgeline of my defensive position. I hitched it up to a halftrack and displaced it to a location behind some trees 130m behind the previous location. As anticiapted enemy mortar fire lands all around the previous position, but strangely centered on my halftrack w/ towed gun's new location. I move my track w/ gun in tow to a new location next turn another 100m behind this second place and after a turn of feeling like I had gotten it away, enemy arty again falls right on top of my track and crew, killing both. I had the uncomfortable feeling that AI artillery can track it's target no matter where it moves, which would make any attempt to try to do so pointless. Any experiences with this/thoughts? All of the original, first second and third postions of track and towed 75mm were behind a ridge, woods, and it was raining, no hill on the enemy side was higher than the ridgeline, enemy infantry on left flank were similiarly obscured by rises in elevation to these points. Any thoughts/ideas welcome. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juju Posted January 11, 2001 Share Posted January 11, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Tiger: I had the uncomfortable feeling that AI artillery can track it's target no matter where it moves, which would make any attempt to try to do so pointless. Any experiences with this/thoughts John<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> As a matter of fact I saw something similar (though a lot weirder) some months ago. It probably has no relation to what happened here but I'll tell you anyway: I was playing an operation where one of my AT guns got shelled by arty in the last turn of a scenario. It managed to survive. In the next scenario I left it where it was, but hid it. Sure enough, very soon (turn two) artillery comes falling down and knocks the gun out. My gun could have been spotted, but I didn't buy that really. So I started the scenario over 4 times, placing the gun in a different place each time. on three occasions it was absolutely guaranteed to be out of LOS of ANY other unit, even friendlies. all four times it was shelled and killed in the second turn. Weirdest thing I ever saw in CM. ------------------ I prefer an enemy who's willing to die for his country. That way both him and me have the same aim in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted January 11, 2001 Share Posted January 11, 2001 Juju, what happened in the first time you played the second scenario is pretty logical. Think about it: you're fighting, you see an AT gun, you call arty on it, then the battle ends. Unless you have proof that that AT gun is no longer there, won't you call arty on the location in the hopes that you'll hit it? As for the "replayed second scenario and moved the gun around" I can't explain that. When you say "absolutely guaranteed out of LOS," how are you guaranteeing this? Is the gun in a place where it cannot see ANYWHERE else on the map? Remember the rule: "If you can see him, he might be able to see you." Tiger, you say you changed the tank's next waypoint to MOVE. Are you sure that there were no earlier outstanding waypoints? I've had times when I simply don't see a waypoint that the tank is right on top of, and then I wonder why, in the next turn, the tank seems to be disregarding the orders I gave. Do you have a save file of this, or can you re-create it? If so, you should probably send it to somebody at BTS. DjB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted January 11, 2001 Share Posted January 11, 2001 Well, if the arty is onboard mortar fire from a mortar team that is direct firing at you, then yes, it will follow you around. ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juju Posted January 11, 2001 Share Posted January 11, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Doug Beman: Juju, what happened in the first time you played the second scenario is pretty logical. (...) As for the "replayed second scenario and moved the gun around" I can't explain that. When you say "absolutely guaranteed out of LOS," how are you guaranteeing this? Is the gun in a place where it cannot see ANYWHERE else on the map? Remember the rule: "If you can see him, he might be able to see you." DjB<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You're right Doug, about the first time. I wanted to be sure however. Call me stubborn. That's why I set up the four testcases. "Guaranteed out of LOS" means being in a small depression at the rear edge of the map with a view of less than 40 or so meters in any direction and being hundreds of meters from the nearest friendly unit and/or setup line. Or being in the middle of a depression in a large patch of woods, yet again way behind the front line. Trust me, I tried 4 times and I'm pretty sure about it. My only regret afterwards was that I didn't 'save the save' to be able to prove this. ------------------ I prefer an enemy who's willing to die for his country. That way both him and me have the same aim in mind. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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