aka_tom_w Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Now I hate to be alarmist about these things and this was only one incident... BUT.... I jsut played a QB and picked M18's (4) and greyhounds (4) in a 2000 point ME with the AI I was the yanks and the AI chose a KingTiger and some half tracks and a Puma for the germans OK .... I have 4 Hellcats so I'm thinking this should not be so hard BUT my Hellcats all had Tungsten rounds but REFUSED to fire them. From about 800 m One hellcat (hulldown) duked it out with the KT for about 2 tense minutes before getting a lucky Gun Hit on the monster. The KT (hull down on an elevated hill) had already toasted two hellcats and 2 greyhounds. So this one Hellcat is dualing head on at 800 m and it keeps firing round after round of AP and the damn thing is hoarding 5 (FIVE!) rounds of "t"! ANd the AP is bouncing off and/or breaking up! Finally since the KT was busy engaing other targets the Hellcat at about 800 m using reg AP finally (after the gun hit) gets a front turret penetration at weak spot K-KILL! and finally puts the damn thing out of my misery! SO anyone else? Why no tungsten use in this case? It was a Reg Hellcat and it had POSITIVELY Identified the monster as a KT? Curious? but not really alarmed just ticked it was not firing "t" after the first AP round bounced off. Any other comments? -tom w P.S. Long range and short range accuracy is NOW much improved there are IMHO ALOT more first shot hits at all ranges than before. I think this is more accurate more realistic and a GOOD thing in general BTW. [This message has been edited by aka_tom_w (edited 02-14-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanaka Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Just a quick idea...Maybe there isn't a much improvement in the penetration of high sloped upper hull/ turret KT armor using T ammo at that distance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 There might be *less* penetration in 1.12 since Charles fixed the slope modifier bug. Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 14, 2001 Author Share Posted February 14, 2001 Originally posted by Jeff Heidman: There might be *less* penetration in 1.12 since Charles fixed the slope modifier bug. Jeff Heidman Yeah, BUT.... you have to fire the Damn tungsten FIRST before the result of the hit gets modified by the slope of the armour it is striking. no? OR are you suggesting that the Tac AI for my Hellcat has "figured out" that firing tungsten against the sloped armour of the KT will be as ineffective as the reg AP so it doesn't "bother" to load the tungsten? I'm not talking about penetration, I have NO problem with reg AP rounds bounceing off the KT at 800 m. Thats great. but why didn't it fire even one tungsten round, if that bounced off or broke up that would be fine too, BUT to not even bother to "try" the tungsten was disappointing. -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jshandorf Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Didn't someone mention a problem with Allied vehicles not firing thier T rounds at german Tank Hunters over 500 meters? Jeff Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted February 14, 2001 Author Share Posted February 14, 2001 Originally posted by jshandorf: Didn't someone mention a problem with Allied vehicles not firing thier T rounds at german Tank Hunters over 500 meters? Jeff That would be news to me? Do you have a reference or the thread it was posted in? Are you refering to something some one reported in v1.12? I'm curious now Thanks -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Juardis Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Tom, how many rounds of AP did you have? There was a thread (week or two ago) that did a test and the conclusion was if you had 34 rounds or less of AP, then T would be fired. If 35 or above, then keep firing AP until get to 34, then fire T. I'm pretty sure that this was facing TDs like the JT. I'm also sure that it was in 1.10 ------------------ Jeff Abbott Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted February 14, 2001 Share Posted February 14, 2001 Tom the subject is Fire Test reveals New Bug It was by Berkut. Hope this helps ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Priest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vanir Posted February 15, 2001 Share Posted February 15, 2001 That bug seemed to go away in 1.12. Maybe its an occasional thing. Tom, can think of no reason why the Hellcat in your example should not have fired tungsten. It's true that with the new multipliers t ammo cannot penetrate the 50 degree sloped front hull, but the turret is only sloped at 10 degrees, and can be penetrated by t at 800m but not AP. Note that the KT turret slope has a "c" next to it meaning its exact slope will vary from hit to hit. I wonder if this is confusing the TacAI making it think its chance of penetration with t is less than it is. ------------------ You've never heard music until you've heard the bleating of a gut-shot cesspooler. -Mark IV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abteilung Posted February 15, 2001 Share Posted February 15, 2001 Sub caliber ammunition loses kinetic energy far more rapidly over distance compare to APCBC. It may be that the game takes that into account when selecting ammo type. I am at work right now otherwise I'd fire up a QB to test different ranges versus ammo selection in reference to M18's facing KT's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lacky Posted February 15, 2001 Share Posted February 15, 2001 Originally posted by Juardis: ... if you had 34 rounds or less of AP, then T would be fired. If 35 or above, then keep firing AP until get to 34, then fire T. ... It's not only AP. Vehicles with large amounts of HE rounds will not fire hollow charges at enemy armor. I had five cromwell's duel mark IV's over the course of a game. Early in the game, the cromwell's would hit the Mark IV's with HE rounds. After several minutes of infantry blasting my cromwell's started to use their hollow rounds against the mark IV's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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