Apollo11 Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Hi all, I have one question for "Combat Mission" veterans/experts... How do you keep track of all your units? How are you absolutely sure that you really plotted move for every single unit that you have and that you didn't, somehow, overlooked one/few? Perhaps in CM2 there would be some "filter" that would help players and enable the quick an easy way to see for which unit(s) you already plotted your move and for which you didn't... Leo "Apollo11" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanco Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Hi Apollo 11, Man that's a tough one. I got the same problem. I ain't an expert but I can tell ya what I've read here. Some people hit the + and - buttons to scroll through all their troops, every turn. That's the only SURE way to not forget anyone, but I agree, it's a pain in the butt. There's been a lot of discussion about that already here. Me, I get around it by playing small battles for the most part. Another way is to break your guys up into Army Group A, B, C, etc. on the map and give each one a goal. You tend to remember better where each guy is that way, at least I do. But I still forget dudes from time to time. There are some other ideas, do a search on 'roster' to know more. Hope this helps. DeanCo-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
von Lucke Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Heh, heh --- sometimes I don't! But that's war --- sometimes commo fails and not everybody gets the word. In a Battalion sized battle, I'll usually plot moves with Unit Bases (shft- switched on, and with Show All Paths (shft-P) active --- that way if I miss someone, I'm more likely to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 You'll find a few tips of how to keep track of your units in the manual. Here is a short version: switch off trees (Shift-T) switch on unit bases (Shift- go to higher view level (3 or better yet 4) enlarge units visual scale (Shift-C) This usually helps to find ANYTHING. Often, it's not necessary to do all of the above steps. ------------------ "An hour has 60 minutes, each minute in action has a thousand dangers." - Karl-Heinz Gauch, CO 1st Panzerspähkompanie, 12th SS Panzerdivision Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grognerd_Fogman Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 The best way I found is to have the unit bases "on" and most importantly use "shift-P" to show all movement and/or targeting paths "on". ------------------ Thanks for Athskin! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Airborne Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Usually, I just know what my boys are doing. What I typically do, though, is to left-click and draw boxes in areas (esp trees, etc) to highlight and make sure I didn't miss anybody. The "bases" idea is great but I really haven't gotten in to using it.. This is fine for smaller games (which I usually play).. For the battalion size games you should probably take the advise from the other posters...Unfortunately, my pc won't handle the big ones. Man....I've got to upgrade. ------------------ Land Soft--Kill Quiet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 First thing you should do is organise your forces before you start. Lay out your men in their command order, then look at the terrain. Place your platoons in appropriate positions, then your support units. Then, once the battle is underway, you should remember where everyone is because you put them there for a reason. David ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 If anyone doesn't know about the dreaded roster, please read the following threads: Interface needs work. I want a roster, a roster !! Vote ! Roster War, ceasefire David ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo11 Posted August 26, 2000 Author Share Posted August 26, 2000 Hi all, Thanks for replaying! BTW, I am already using all things you listed: switch off trees (Shift-T) switch on unit bases (Shift- go to higher view level (3 or better yet 4) enlarge units visual scale (Shift-C) I just hoped that there is something better than good old step-by-step "+" and "-" going through all units... Also thanks for links to other interesting threads about this issue. Leo "Apollo11" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
L.Tankersley Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 You left one out, Apollo: use shift-P to turn on all movement paths (targetting paths, too, if you like). Then you can shift-C to blow everyone up to +4, and look for giant guys without colored lines coming from under them. Combine this with a methodical approach to issuing orders (e.g. work from left to right across your front) and I find I hardly ever miss anyone. (Of course, there was that one time where I forgot my company HQ during the setup phase, so when the battle started he was way over in the right rear corner when the rest of my force was on the left. But he showed up eventually...) ------------------ Leland J. Tankersley Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanco Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Ummm...the roster is by no means 'dreaded', David. The discussions are at times, but there are some of us (enough, from what I've read) who would welcome the addition of a roster. I assume you meant 'dreaded roster discussion', BTW. Just clarifying. DeanCo-- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
19 Echo Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Being methodical definitely helps. Sometimes I like to draw a quick sketch map, and note the locations of some of my important guys (FO's, HQ's) on it. I also use this to help plan my assault/defense. I don't have grease pencils and overlays yet, but I'm working on it. It can be annoying to cycle through a battalion's worth of units in the setup phase to find the FO's. But once I find them, I can usually keep track of them mentally. On the few occasions when I do lose track of someone (usually a bazooka or some other small team), I just chalk it up to FOW. There's always some poor schmuck who never gets the word. -- Mike Zeares Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisl Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 19 Echo: Being methodical definitely helps. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Yeah, I tend to keep them within (or near) C&C, and I mentally separate the battlefield into zones based on terrain, activity, and deployed units. I think it's uncommon to have the units scattered haphazardly. So typically in a battalion size battle or op I'll have 3 zones, and I'll have a mental picture of what is in each zone: zone 1: town with Company of engineers reinforced with 3 Shermans and a platoon of HTs, Zone 2: Central hill, Inf. Co. with 6 Shermans, two mortar HTs, etc. Zone 3: etc. Then when it's movement time I turn on movement paths and target lines, turn off trees, and go left to right through the zones, and making the detailed plans based on terrain etc. Typically I'll plot enough orders for several turns for units that haven't been engaged, and put waypoints at good stopping points so that I can just delete the extra lines and they'll stop somewhere relatively good without command delay. By doing this I can often look at an area, say to myself "all according to plan" and move on, since the orders are there and underway. I don't like to +- through them because it will move me haphazardly from zone to zone as I go through the support weapons and vehicles, and then I don't get as coherent a plan. I'll usually only use +- to select squads in a platoon that has gotten bunched up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greybeard 101st Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 I use the colored bases, and left click on each unit to double check their orders, before "go". I rarely miss anyone, although I always seem to forget about one of my 50cal men, cause they are so slow. The colored bases work well, but kind of take away from the realism. I just try to be very methodical in keeping track of everyone, and double, triple check their orders. ------------------ -kill 'em all and let God sort them out- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest *Captain Foobar* Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 Grognerd Fogman is right. Unti bases and movement paths are the key. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 deanco wrote: > Ummm...the roster is by no means 'dreaded', David. The discussions are at times, I meant the discussions. ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hakko Ichiu Posted August 26, 2000 Share Posted August 26, 2000 One other trick when dealing with large forces is to use Shift+V to turn vehicles invisible. That way, if you have infantry and vehicles in close proximity, you can find the infantry more easily. It's also an easy way to click on units that are passengers -- They will be suspended in mid-air. Just remember to turn vehicles back on when you're done or you'll wonder where all that fire is coming from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikeydz Posted August 27, 2000 Share Posted August 27, 2000 I've never had much of a problem, as long as my men are fighting withing thier command structure, as long as your thinking and using your men as platoon size units, instead of just clicking and using your squads individually. Of course I'll have some units move and act individually (ie a half squad as a scout, zook/schrek guy hunting a vechile, ect, but as long are you keep your squards in relative close proximity, then they are easier to manage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo11 Posted August 27, 2000 Author Share Posted August 27, 2000 Hi all, L.Tankersley wrote: > use shift-P to turn on all movement paths >(targetting paths, too, if you like). Yep... I forgot to mention that (although I was using it quite extensively)... This SHIFT+P is the only way to see movement and attack orders... Hakko Ichiu wrote: > One other trick when dealing with large forces is to use Shift+V > to turn vehicles invisible Thanks for this... it is especially useful for mounted units... Leo "Apollo11" P.S. I sincerely hope that some simplistic OOB is available in CM2 that would only serve as a reminder how many units you have and which would indicate if you moved/ordered the unit in question this turn or not. I completely agree that "Roster" is not for CM but such simplistic "OOB" IMHO is... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted August 27, 2000 Share Posted August 27, 2000 Apollo11 wrote: > I completely agree that "Roster" is not for CM but such simplistic "OOB" IMHO is... This is pretty much BTS's point of view. David ------------------ There's a splinter in your eye, and it reads REACT Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Michael emrys Posted August 28, 2000 Share Posted August 28, 2000 How about having the base of a unit change color (or shade/brightness of color) once it has been examined/given an order for the turn? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Apollo11 Posted August 28, 2000 Author Share Posted August 28, 2000 Hi all, David Aitken wrote: > > I completely agree that "Roster" is not > > for CM but such simplistic "OOB" IMHO > > is... > > This is pretty much BTS's point of view. There is one nice proverb: "From your mouth into God's ears!" I sincerely hope that it would be so... Leo "Apollo11" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted August 28, 2000 Share Posted August 28, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Apollo11: I have one question for "Combat Mission" veterans/experts... How are you absolutely sure that you really plotted move for every single unit that you have and that you didn't, somehow, overlooked one/few?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Simple: I'm not, and proud of it! This is what Clausewitz referrs to as "friction". The little things that turns every task into an effort and slow actions down. By not using the aforementioned options of highlighting and finding every single unit, sometimes you get the a-ha experience of; oh, I seem to have forgotten about this unit. Perhaps better let the others wait until this one catch up... This is a highly realistic way to simulate real battles. The more units you have the slower they will react (in average) to your orders. CM is good to simulate battles with about one infantry company or one tank platoon per player. If you use more than that things have a tendancy to get out of hands (C&C wise). When commanding a battalion I don't want to micro-manage the movement of every squad and team, but just give orders to my companies and watch the platoons act. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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