Lee Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 I always laugh when people say that CM would be so much better real-time. In case some have not noticed, CM is turn-based for good reasons. A.) It is impossible to command battles on the scale of CM in real-time with any kind of intelligence. There are simply too many units in your average battle to ever have that work. B.) You could never do the super sophisticated combat calculations in CM in real-time, because no PC could keep up with them and the 3D graphics. CM, in fact, would be a terrible wargame if it were real-time. Not to mention completely unplayable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NL_Oxcart: <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I downloaded the new demo yesterday (In the hope that maybe I would like it better). I have played each of the demo scenario's two times, (One as each side) but I still don't like the game. Can you people tell me whether the demo is or is not representative of the game? Thanks in advance... That is the gold demo. Meaning, it's based on the final code. If you don't like that, odds are very low you will like the full game. Also, what is it that you like about combat mission that makes it a better game to you than CC. Above all else, I HATE ALL "clickfest" games. And to me, that's all the CC series is. Click here, point there, try to click faster than the computer can. No other kind of game format is more annoying to me. Hell, Im surprised the CC series doesn't have you building factories so you can build more "rocket tanks". Ugh. The historical innacuracies in the CC series are well documented and make a mockery of WWII. The rocket tanks in CC4 are just beyond ridiculous in how they run around engaging armor. Ugh. How feasible is it to make a Pacific mod, Vietnam mod, etc... Simply put, it's not possible to make such mods in CM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Oxcart, glad the map maker was of use to you Ok, for me, here is a list of what draws me to CM personally over say CC3, which was the last CC I played. Please no one take this as a CC flame, its not. * Realism - especially in armour combat. If you dont know the mechanics behind it you may not really realise the detail there is in there. For instance if your tank is shooting at a vehicle that is on a 27 degree angle off of being a straight on to you the shell may bouce off the armour accordingly. All armour combat is measured in mm's and shells are meansure in m/sec instead of using 'simulated vahlues'.... * Infantry Combat - also is very realistically handled. * The turn based system - I like it Without it CM would be uncontrollable. I am playing an operation at the moment where I have 15 platoons (thats 45 squads) a couple of dozen MG's and PS's, 5 Stuggs, 2 Mk IV's, numerous AT guns, artey and bunkers. In a real time system this would just not be possable to control. I find the turn based orders and real time resolution a great compromise. * Operations - They are on one huge map that moves along as the battle progresses with all battle damage staying put, hehe. These honestly are VERY cool to play. I cant say in words how awesome these things are, just ask matt! Weve been fighting over a damn town for quite some time now. My guess would be that thus far there have been OVER 50 AFV's detsroyed and probably 100's of casulties! * PBEM - It allows you to play battles within your time constraints, hehe, which ermm I am finding I have more and more of Thats just a few Its 4:30 over here in Australia and its time for a beer, but Im happy to chat about more. As Ive said before, its each to their own. personally realism in a wargame is what i look for, but other people look for other things Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miles Teg Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Mr. Sabot, You are a liar and a fool. Here is what you wrote on the Ross board: <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>****Ill tell you what is going on... I posted a message on the CM board this eve and it was quickly taken down by their moderators. Bull****...I think it had maybe one word you could call a "cuss" word. It wasnt even very confrontational. I just gave them a taste of their own medicine...and they couldnt take it. They can come here and debate with us, but we cant go there. *shakes head* My user name and ID there are probably banned now. Not that I care, the place reeks of self-stroking jugheads. Just go read some of the lame posts from their teenage contingent. ****Actually, Im sick of the whole debate. If you cant convince a chimp that a banana tastes good...well you got a dumb chimp. I dont know...we dont have Bunny to kick around anymore...maybe the CMers should come over more often <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest KwazyDog Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 * Oh, and it comes with a fully featured map editor so I dont have to write one Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kevin Peltz Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Oxcart: What you saw in the Gold Demo is what the real deal will be like. The data is locked but the colour tiles can be revamped. I played CC and it wasn't for me, CM is. But this is an apples and oranges thing- I don't think it is fair to compare the games. To each his own. You will either like CM or you won't, but that doesn't make anyone less of a person if they don't. I think it is a good thing that there are still enough of this genre around that people have a choice. I don't like realtime games simply because I am either not fast enough, or clever enough to play them well. This is my fault, not the game's. Can't do flight sims for the same reason. CM gives me the time to think over what I am doing. I may still get it wrong, but at least it was premeditated! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt B M Deleted Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 F*!# them! Just as long as I get my game, I'll be happy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JeffRaider Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Ummm. . . Nice work, Capt. . . I guess. . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JWorthing Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 The thing I hated about CC3 (i like CC2) was that I'd have a guy with a flamethrower (who was part of a squad) stuck in the back all the time when I obviously needed him in the front. But, NO! You try to rearrange the squad by clicking here and there, here and there, but by the time he's in front with the ft half the squad is dead. It was frustrating. In Cm, no problem. All guns are accounted for and fausts shoot independently. marvelous!! I got real red for CC3 and liked it but the AI was weak, the feel was weak, and for such a big map, it was hard to tell what was going on in the full picture. Plus, only 15 units? The best part of the game is trying to come up with authentic sounding russian names. The thing I love about CM is the feel. I remember reading beta (or alpha) AAR's and was absolutely amazed. It felt like an actual battle. "Stop the reinforcements from relieving the besieged town." "Hold the town until reinforcements arrived!" If I remember correctly, the reinforcements were on the other side of the map, not like the ones in CE or VOT, where they just pop out. I'm lucky because I'm pretty much new to wargaming, not like some of the other guys here. I didn't have to wait for a game like this for however long. I just waited for a year. (i've learned a lot of interesting ww2 facts on this forum which is a bonus.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
THumpre Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Ah, the Capt. Never fails to disappoint, does he? ------------------ No matter where you go, there you are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xyphorus Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 THumpre, I second you on that thought; Cpt Manieri, could you just say something adult for once, or just be quiet. You are behaving like an annoying "little bug" that you are. Karl Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rollstoy Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Dear Capt. Manieri, or whoever! Maybe you realize that your first post on this thread is now used against this board on other forums! And then you top it with a ****ing 'you know I was just kidding!' message! Great! Thank you! You should also know that the original post was motivated by some people who go to the CC boards and attack CC in favor of CM. If you think for yourself, this makes A LOT of sense! Now both forums are ****ed up! Yours truly, Thomm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phandaal Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by NL_Oxcart: Also, what is it that you like about combat mission that makes it a better game to you than CC. Whatever this is, I have not found it yet but I would be interested to know what to look for NL_Oxcart (A hooked CC player who is nonetheless willing to give CM a nice big juicy chance)<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> As for the demo representing the game, I think it would be safe to assume it will. If you don't like the demo I would advise you not to spend money on the game. Of course you could buy it and if you don't like it mail it to me! The reason I like Combat Mission (sounds like the start of an Essay) is that it is turned based. I loved Panzer General I,II,III because I could look over the battlefield and plan a sound strategy. It also gives you a chance to sit back and remember all those WWII movies you watched as a kid. I remember the books I've read on WWII combat and CM comes very close to the descriptions of combat described in those books. With turn based games you have time to study the strength and weaknesses of your enemy before committing troops to battle. Sure, it isn't REAL TIME, but I prefer the chess approach to wargames, versus the mad-click click click that I found in CC3 (which I still play occasionally). You really can't say CM is Turn-Based, becuase both player's instructions are carried out at the same time. So, in a sense it is real-time, but with a break to throw orders at your troops. I like the accurate detailing of the armor penetration, and the 3D landscape. I appreciate and respect the attitude of the developers Steve and Charles, because they listened to thier end-users. They are dedicated to correcting errors, and making CM as realistic as possible within the boundaries of a computer game. When I play CM I feel like I'm on a WWII battlefield. CM gives me a sense of how a battle would evolve in WWII. SPR was great for FX, but it gave us nothing about how the battles were fought company vs company. One more point. Once your done with your orders you have 60secs to observed the effects, here is some real tension and anxiety as you watch your troops carry out an action. Will it succeed, or will they be slaughtered by a ambushing platton in those houses? In Real-time you see the enemy once your first troops get near the houses. click stop..click move away! NOW THAT IS FAKE! No commander can issue orders like that in real life. If you ordered your troops to take houses, they will try and carry out your orders to the best of their ability. If they break, then they run. Granted, being able to sit and think about your next moves over 10 minutes is fakey too, but hell these are video games! There is always is going to be some compromise. I've been waiting for CM since I learned about video games. It is my favorite game and that is only after playing the demo (about 20 times). For What It's Worth Phandaal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phandaal Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Testing... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Screaming Demon Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Hi Sabot, If you are just doing this for revenge, then it is an unjust cause, on the TGN message board killmore was just trying to add the list of 3D wargames you mentioned, not to start a flame war. most of the people (including me) have copies of CC and have enjoyed them, hell, i even have the Vietnam mod. So get lost you ignorant fool, and can someone shut this thread down before more of them come and tell us about their real time and accurate squad represtation, cause we already know, maybe if Steve and Charles sold the rights of Combat Mission to Microsoft the whole world would know about CM too. Chas B. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cpt B M Deleted Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Dudes...when some douchebag attacks the forum, it will be met with an immediate action by me. Personally, I think CM represents CM. It's fans don't really represent it. It speaks for itself. The same reason when I go to Yankee Stadium. I don't like the fans...but I like baseball an that's all that matters. If someone really wanted to check out CM they'd look past crap on the forum and simplly enjoy the demo and the dynamics of the game. Blaming me for crap is blaming yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darstand Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 This is so Funny. I have really gotten a good laugh This Sabot guy go fishing with really weak bait and manages to pull up so serious whoopers. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted June 16, 2000 Share Posted June 16, 2000 Alright... time to close this up. And Sabot, as totally immature as you are, do not spread lies about how we manage this BBS. That is just too much. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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