Are there any plans to release more 'on-map' artillery models in future modules/vehicle packs?

[Odin]

I'm looking forward to the release of CMFB and would like to know if there any plans to release more (non-SPG) 'on-map' artillery pieces as part of future modules/vehicles packs? I'd love to see pieces like the 120mm mortar, the British 25pdr, and German 105mm included in the game and put to good use by scenario and campaign designers. The impending release of FB reminded me of a story an old friend told me a few months back. He grew up during the Second World War and his dad served in the Royal Artillery, fighting in Normandy and the Ardennes (amazingly his father was also old enough to be conscripted at the end of WWI). He recounted a story his father told him about how during the Ardennes offensive German armour broke through the American lines a few miles ahead of his unit which forced the 25 pounders he was serving on to engage the Germans with direct fire as GIs came streaming back into the rear. It's an amazing story but not an abnormal one, and situations like this could make for interesting CM scenarios. I know Sextons, Wespes, Priests etc are available, but if we can have  rare 'funnies' and converted French armour why not a few more famous bits of arty?  

[Michael Emrys]

Another reason to have them, though perhaps not as relevant to this stage of the war, would be to be able to model situations where the armor has broken though the front and is running amok among the enemy artillery park.

Michael

[MikeyD]

CMBN module & battle pack have cool artillery & guns on French chassis', but most of them got left behind in Normandy so would be outside the scope of the Bulge. The sole exception is Sdkfz 151 Marder I.
There originally were 'technical difficulties' coding-wise in trying to get mounted weapons to have indirect fire capability. But that hurdle may have been cleared with the introduction of on-vehicle HT mortars doing indirect fire. So maybe we could see interesting developments in the future in that regard. 
I think one problem with using higher power cannons for indirect fire is you very quickly exceed the dimensions of most game maps range-wise. In CMFI the Italians have the odd little 47/32 cannon that was both anti-tank gun and indirect fire artillery. Except the HE round had such a flat trajectory that the round could barely clear an intervening wall doing indirect fire. I vaguely recall in Beta they briefly had indirect fire 88 Flaks but again the flat trajectory made that completely useless.

[Odin]

3 minutes ago, MikeyD said:

CMBN module & battle pack have cool artillery & guns on French chassis', but most of them got left behind in Normandy so would be outside the scope of the Bulge. The sole exception is Sdkfz 151 Marder I.
There originally were 'technical difficulties' coding-wise in trying to get mounted weapons to have indirect fire capability. But that hurdle may have been cleared with the introduction of on-vehicle HT mortars doing indirect fire. So maybe we could see interesting developments in the future in that regard. 
I think one problem with using higher power cannons for indirect fire is you very quickly exceed the dimensions of most game maps range-wise. In CMFI the Italians have the odd little 47/32 cannon that was both anti-tank gun and indirect fire artillery. Except the HE round had such a flat trajectory that the round could barely clear an intervening wall doing indirect fire. I vaguely recall in Beta they briefly had indirect fire 88 Flaks but again the flat trajectory made that completely useless.

 

Thanks for the quick response Mickey, it isn't so much the ability for SPGs to provide indirect 'on-map' fire I was interested in (although that would also be cool. I have used on-map 150mm and 75mm infantry guns for those purposes in Kohlenlau's CM-PzC Ortona campaign). What I'd really like to see are models created for medium calibre artillery pieces such as the 105mm and 25pdr so they can be used in scenarios for direct fire purposes (and possibly on-map indirect fire in monster scenarios  such as those used by Koh in CM-PzC Ortona)

[JonS]

1 hour ago, Odin said:

He recounted a story his father told him about how during the Ardennes offensive German armour broke through the American lines a few miles ahead of his unit which forced the 25 pounders he was serving on to engage the Germans with direct fire as GIs came streaming back into the rear. It's an amazing story but not an abnormal one

Actually, by that stage of the war it's a HIGHLY abnormal situation. It did become de rigueur for those fine gentlemen of the RA field artillery to rescue their lesser comrades in the infantry and armoured branches on a regular basis, but that was in the Western Desert, and had largely fallen out of fashion again by the end of 1942. I know of only 2 or 3 occurrences of RA field artillery direct firing unexpectedly and of necessity in NWE. I'd be interested to know more about the action your friends father was in - do you know which unit he served with? Even knowing which division would narrow it down quite a lot.

Edited April 6, 2016 by JonS

[Michael Emrys]

Just as an aside, in the early stages of the Korean war a battery of American 105s fired over open sights at attacking NK armor before they ran out of ammo and had to spike their guns.

Michael

[panzersaurkrautwerfer]

7 minutes ago, Michael Emrys said:

Just as an aside, in the early stages of the Korean war a battery of American 105s fired over open sights at attacking NK armor before they ran out of ammo and had to spike their guns.

Michael

True, but that was the absolutely deplorable TF Smith incident and wasn't exactly the norm.

[AttorneyAtWar]

Just now, panzersaurkrautwerfer said:

True, but that was the absolutely deplorable TF Smith incident and wasn't exactly the norm.

Reading about TF Smith is infuriating.

"Hey guys don't shoot at the North Koreans ok? once they see us (US troops) there going to turn right around!

Edited April 6, 2016 by Raptorx7

[Odin]

15 minutes ago, JonS said:

Actually, by that stage of the war it's a HIGHLY abnormal situation. It did become de rigueur for those fine gentlemen of the RA field artillery to rescue their lesser comrades in the infantry and armoured branches on a regular basis, but that was in the Western Desert, and had largely fallen out of fashion again by the end of 1942. I know of only 2 or 3 occurrences of RA field artillery direct firing unexpectedly and of necessity in NWE. I'd be interested to know more about the action your friends father was in - do you know which unit he served with? Even knowing which division would narrow it down quite a lot.

 

I don't know which unit he was in, I'll ask him next time I see him. 

Re firing over open sights, sorry I should say I didn't mean just to refer just to the Allied artillery in Western Europe in 44/45, I was also thinking of German units in the West as well as German and Soviets units on the Eastern Front, where armoured thrusts into the enemy rear (if you'll excuse the pun) were perphaps more commonplace. Although I will admit that I'm going off anecdotes.

[BletchleyGeek]

2 hours ago, Odin said:

I don't know which unit he was in, I'll ask him next time I see him. 

Re firing over open sights, sorry I should say I didn't mean just to refer just to the Allied artillery in Western Europe in 44/45, I was also thinking of German units in the West as well as German and Soviets units on the Eastern Front, where armoured thrusts into the enemy rear (if you'll excuse the pun) were perphaps more commonplace. Although I will admit that I'm going off anecdotes.

In the case of the Red Army, their 76mm field guns were used often on a direct fire role... but it was more about overcoming the shortcomings of the rather crude systems available to coordinate cooperation between the arms than killing German armour. The almost ubiquitous 45mm gun was quite good at defeating the armour Germany used when it used to break through Soviet lines in 1941 and 1942.

Edited April 6, 2016 by BletchleyGeek