Mobilization when city is taken

[Aryaman]

What happens if at the start of the CTA scenario a city in which a unit is going to be mobilized is taken by the enemy before that? That is possible, for instance, for the Russian III Corps mobilized in Grodno, the city can be taken by the Germans before it is mobilized. Is the III Corps still mobilized in another city or is it lost?

[Strategiclayabout]

Hi Aryaman ,

- Those units have their deployment "suspended" if their arriving tile is captured by the enemy. You need to retake it to get your free corps. It will appear next turn on an empty adjacent tile to the town if the original one is still occupied by one of your unit.

- One thing you can check if you know unit numbers like II corps (Grodno) or VI corps (Bialystok): as long as they are "suspended" they are listed in the russian corps production window.

- Not sure what happens if you buy one while it is "suspended" though, will have to try it with hotseat...

[Bill101]

Hi

The engine should allow the unit to be deployed at a nearby resource, so the unit is not lost but merely diverted from its intended location.

[Strategiclayabout]

Hi Bill ,

Running WWI break 1.02 CTA start with hotseat

- Thanks for your answer, then I'm missing something or there is something wrong because the VI russian corps scheduled to pop at Bialystok on turn 2 is nowhere to be found if Germans capture the town before it appears (pic1).

* II russian corps pops in Grodno as usual on turn 2 (pic2).

* Nothing for Russia in Entente deployment window on turn 2 (pic3).

* VI corps still buyable in russian infantry corps production window (pic4).

* I let the hotseat run for some more turns thinking there may be some delay but no.

- As I said above the corps is still hanging on somewhere since it appears once your retake Bialystok.

Hope it will help clear things.

[Bill101]

Yes it does thanks, and I will have to look into this further.

In terms of the unit name still being available in the purchase screen, scripted unit names are always available until the unit deploys.

[Bill101]

We've been looking into this some more and as the two Russian units arrive by script, by taking their destination locations, it is preventing them from arriving.

Changing them so that they arrive in the Production Queue, designated to arrive at the same locations, would fix the problem of their non-appearance, as the Russians would still be able to deploy them nearby if they lost these towns.

However, while I'm happy to make that change, a necessary one given what you've explained, I wonder if it's the whole answer.

The question is, if those Russian units were still to arrive nearby, how useful to the Germans would this bold advance on Grodno and Bialystok be?

If it's 50/50, then I'll just fix the unit non-arrival issue.

But if it's a very useful move for the Germans to do, even with the problem fixed, then perhaps a different solution is in order.

For instance, we could have a Russian Corps start the game at Bialystok, so that the German cavalry can't just march in unopposed, but the Corps could be at strength 5 so that it isn't yet fully mobilized.

Russia could be given some extra MPPs to compensate for having to reinforce the unit.

Please let me know what you think.

Thanks!

Bill

[Strategiclayabout]

Hi Bill ,

Playing WWI break 1.02 CTA hotseat.

- Thanks for your work, not losing two "unborn" corps on turn 1 will already help Russia. However, you're right saying the problem isn't limited to that. With the ability to deploy several units at start where he wants (especially the two cavalry units) CP player can put Russia in a very difficult position on turn 1:

Bialystok, Grodno and Vilna are in range and all of three can fall with average combat rolls (pic 1).

- Once you've destroyed that corps blocking the road north of Grodno, it's a free ride on Russians back. Even with 5 supply, it's easy to cut/threaten polish railroads next turn (pic 2). When Russians move units to the north, Austrians will have a chance for a pincer move towards Kovel, trapping several armies. Russians will have tno choice o retreat to Bielorussia or Ukraine if CP keep pushing. Don't even talk about the probable loss of Kovno and/or Rennenkampf HQ in the following turns .

- That move is close to an exploit though you can say german units deploying there on turn 1 won't be somewhere else. In an ongoing mirror game, we both advanced in the Grodno-Vilna area and Russia is already in bad shape. Poland evacuated at the start of 1915 in one, forces stretched to death on a Warsaw-Bialystok-Grodno-Vilna line in the other (Russia had to terminate all starting research to operate troops on turn 1).

- I'm not sure what solution is best, reduced corps as you say or maybe (reduced ?) detachments at start on those 3 tiles to prevent an early capture and let corps arrive as scheduled ? We can also look at AI being given two more corps around Kovno at start, usually forcing German players to be a bit more cautious in this area.

Hope it will help your thinking .

[Aryaman]

Is the OOB historical?

[Strategiclayabout]

Hi Aryaman ,

- If you mean my deployment in the pics above, no it isn't historical because most units should have been deployed in the West, except for one cavalry I think.

- Otherwise, about units names ingame I find it pretty accurate if you look at Tannenberg order of battle:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_battle_at_Tannenberg_%281914%29

You'll find more or less the same german fortress detachments/divisions and russian corps for 1st and 2nd army (like the II and VI ones we discussed above).

[Bill101]

Thanks, this does help and I'll do what I can to address the issue.

I don't want to prevent strategic possibilities arising from a different, and bold, deployment, but certainly the risks need to be balanced.