fritzthemoose

where does this one come from? </font>

wow </font>

where does this one come from?

CMx1 LOS had more abstraction than Cmx2... If CMx1 LOS was fine, CMx2 LOS should be top notch when the bug will be patch. </font>

frankly i am not sure about the potential because at the moment it is not clear, at least not for me, how many of the problems are simply bugs that can be solved or design things that cannot be solved or at least not easily Steve admitted in one post that some of the LOS LOF problems can be solved some not because of the abstraction in the engine. he did however not say which one are which. it might be similar with other things but i have not found anything about it from BFC. But lets stick with the LOS LOF thing. If they cannot solve the shooting through walls or solid ground or eg spotting through walls and solid ground there is no way they can get 9 in my opinion. If things like that can be solved then maybe.

they of course dont go into rt and wego, but judge it simply from what it is right now. so yes in my opinion 6.5 to 7 is fair

Featured Articles - 13 On File Average Ratio: 69.0% - (61.8%) Site Profile GameSpot 8/10/2007 4.5 out of 10 45.0% Site Profile GameZone 8/2/2007 8 out of 10 80.0% Site Profile Eurogamer 7/31/2007 5 out of 10 50.0% Site Profile Worth Playing 7/29/2007 9.5 out of 10 95.0% Site Profile Game Industry News 7/28/2007 3.5 out of 5 70.0% Site Profile Jolt Online Gaming UK 7/27/2007 7.3 out of 10 73.0% Site Profile Ace Gamez 7/19/2007 7 out of 10 70.0% http://www.gamerankings.com/htmlpages2/930381.asp

now thats a reply full of facts lol and an eternal statement for freedom of speach. great values indeed something to pass on to the next generation

All I can do is honestly advise you to start looking for a substitute. Noted! The choice, however, means you will never buy another Combat Mission game for a VERY long time because the LOS abstraction will remain for the life of the CMx2 engine. Noted!

KID? Yeah, I'm a 28 year old kid with more combat experience than you will ever have. Instead of manning a desk, dreaming about panzers and playing war with cardboard counters I'm actually out there firing rounds in anger at the enemies of my country... </font>

[/qb]

just a few thought on the above. i think we can all agree that no AI is capable of simulating all the different logical decisions based on intelligence, experience, training and so on every singel soldier from the least jarhead in the unit up to the commander has to do more or less every second. if we agree on that the result for a computer based game is micormanaging because there is only one who can to logical decisions based on intelligence experience........ meaning the player. he has to do it for all the men, units troops.... under his command. even then u are dependend on the ai to make some decisions. however, the more information u give the AI to better and more realistic it will performe. Do give that information u need tools and features. Easy to read 3D landscape to determin the terrain. a tool to investigate the terrain in detail. a tool the tell units where to to and what to do when they get there. a tool on how to behave when in a position and so on. that leaves the ai with fairly few decisions to make. mainly hit kill and spotting calculations but those are not based on logical thinking but on tables. which target to engage first base don danger and hit kill probability again mainly tables. of course there are some other things but if u have those and build in some self preservation features u have an AI that does not screw up too much to bear. For doing that u basically need time which means a turn based game. which then means that those players who are able or willing to spend more time on a turn or those who have more experience and knowledge will most likely win. Of course there are people who dont like that style of play. So what u do is reduce the time available. the best way to do that is RT. Of course u depend much more on AI then which will screw up much more but then again that applies to both sides and levesl the playing field. in such a game the guy who knows the menu strukture better has an advantage. also the one with a bigger screen or better resolution because he will see a larger part of the battlefield. a faster comp helps too. bottom line is that in such a game the one who can give more information to the AI meaning more clicks will win because the AI will perform better and he will have a better control over his unit.

currently I fear CMSF is a sinking ship. I found 4 reviews so far and all are from bad to worse. Nobody who reads a review before buying will get CMSF. Lots of people who try the demo before buying will not get it either i guess. Most of those who like the old CM will not get it or if they already got it will not buy the add-ons. The typical RT guy might get the basic game but not the add-ons. By the time the add-ons are around and the bugs are ironed out there is another newer cooler RT game out by somebody. So unless BTC pulls an amazing rabbit out of the hat very soon they might be in trouble

The review is spot on and has the same trend like the other 2 reviews I have found and read. Bottom line and this is also supported by the comments u read in several forums CMSF is not nearly good enough to rival other RT games already on the market. Hence if u like RT u find several better games on the shelves. CMSF is a hughe step backwards if u like WEGO. Hence if u like WEGO the old CM series is the much better and cheaper option.

was trying to figure it out worked once so far but dont know why. as soon as i delete soemthing in the old post its gone

sorry dont get that. registered today and this is my first post

[/qb]

Take your choice with regard to choosing another company's game but there is no game made even to this day that I'm aware of that's comparable to CM. And that is the sad fact of it all, who can replace BFC? [/QB]

Could not avoid the mandatory draft here in Austria but was lucky to get a not fit for combat duty rating. Which is good However was unlucky enough to get a fit for admin duty rating. Which is bad. :mad: So as a good soldier I cut my losses and looked for another strategy Let some time pass and then before I had to report for service I told them that my eyesight deteriorated even more since the draft. So I got an appointment for a redraft and had to spend another 2 days in the barracks which was bad :mad: However, a eye specialist who is a friend briefed me well enough to get my eyesight result to a not fit for military service level which is good So mission accomplished

First of all welcome to the community and second, have you never heard of the word 'you'? [Wink] Sorry for the u but that comes from realtime chatting while playing WEGO not enough time for proper things Whether it's a good marketing ploy or not including the name 'Combat Mission' in the title of the game will naturally make people compare or assume it's going to be similar to the original CM. Thats what I meant. It helped them push sales which is for sure good for them but then they should not be surprised that some out there feel deceived If this games flops and they lose a bundle I'm sure all here will care as BFC are only a small company and can't afford a flop and I doubt any other games will ever see the light of day. Thats what is called the risk running a business. They made the decision to more or less abandon their current CM customer base and tap into a new one. A new one they expect more business from. Although I am one of the CM group I dont have hard feelings because of that. Would probably do the same if my market anyalizys shows the potential. But then again they have to take the FLAK if it backfires. Even if the company goes bust. Yes some games might not see the light but whats the problem. There are lots of RT games out there to choose from and some other company will fill the void. As for CM it does not matter either thats history anyway. As for the bugs that's not doing BFC any favours obviously but that's another story and I've already commented on this in another thread. Exactly. They will fix them soon enough but at the current state it just does not look professional.

Having really great fun reading through all the whining moaning and defending that is going on here I could not hold myself to post my 2 cents too We have 3 types of people here the CMSF haters, lovers and battlefront who is trying their best in damage control. First a word to the haters: Suck it up and get a hold on it. Yes CMSF has nothing to do with CM except the name. Yes it is a RT clickfest with, currently, lots of flaws. Yes it will never be part of my or your harddrive. Yes I do feel your pain, your disapointment and frustration. But hey its a GAME not more and not less. Whats the point of pitching around that the new car has nothing in common with the old train :confused: This game is not CM it was never meant to be CM and it will never be CM. This game was designed for a different target customer group. Thats a business decision from battlefront. I good one or bad one i dont know and i dont care. If they earn a bundle with it great for them but still will not bring me CM back. If they loose a bundle great who cares will not bring me CM back either. Secondly to the defenders: Please stop being annoyed that there are people out there who dont like what u like. I know its hard if that happens makes u feel stupid that u like it and stupid we are not right. So we have to defend it no matter what rationalize it no matter what. As for battlefront. I do understand, being a marketing executive myself why u named it CM knowing very well that it is not. But dont be surprised that some people dont really like it and feel deceived. If u release a game with lots of bugs for whatever reason dont be surprised if people complain. In the end it was u who gave them the ammunition in not getting rid of the bugs. As for the game. The graphics is very very good but in my opinion there are RT games out there with at least as good one and they are not brand new. As for the menu structure, yes u can get used to it after some time but there are games out there where it does not take so long to get used to it. As for the AI what do u expect? AI is like military intelligence an oximoron. So thats why I never ever play against the computer but only against humans. The AI in the CM WEGO system is as much intelligence I can suffer from a game. Or maybe its not so unrealistic at all in the end. I mean what intelligence do u expect from someone whos aim in live is to commit suicide. Or on the other hand from someone who gives up his family, his house, his pool, Steak dinners, baseball, air condition and volunteers to go to a good forsaken desert where everybody hates him and his chances of getting killed are pretty good. As for realism. Please stop using this word. A GAME and especially a WARGAME can and should never be realistic. A game is supposed to be fun and realism is not fun especially when it comes to war. Oh yes we dont send the M1 but the M48 instead because otherwise the Syrian T-72 stands no chance it it would not be fair to the Syrians. Heck if u can win a truly realistic wargame why do u need officers training or a military academy. Anybody can do it anyway. As for RT. Please stop illusioning yourslef that RT means realism. Thats why u train human beings to be a soldier because they are supposed to make intelligent and logical decision on their own based on their experience, judgement and their cognotive capabilities. Not because the commander is micromanaging every single move of every single soldier in his unit. And thats why some people dont like and never will like RT. Look at it from that point of view. Some people love soccer. U can get the rules within a few minutes and then get instant action wether in a stadium as a spectator or in your backyard as a player. You dont need 100 of pages of manuals. U dont need ages to set up the pitch. U get instant and fun action. They dont mind that there is a lack of strategy or tactics in the game due to the fact that the general/manager cannot communicate with his soldiers/players for the most part of the game. He is pointing them into a general direction and then their own intellignce, which by the way is for the most part not much higher then the one of the AI (sorry for the hit I could not resits ). Then there are people who love baseball. They dont mind reading to page after page of rules, stats and advice. They like to outsmart their oponnent before the even start playing. They dont want and need action. Therefore, they dont mind the batter fixing his gloves shoes belt... before even touching a bat. Then scratching his balls after which he has to fix is gloves, shoes, belt.... again. Then if being lucky and getting a hit making a dash for 1B which takes something between 6 and 20 seconds before stopping for a chat with the 1B man or the 1B coach while the manager, the pitcher and the catcher are trying to figure out how to outsmarkt the next hitter. Who then has to fix his gloves, shoes...... scratch his balls of c ourse before thouching a bat :mad: The bottome line is having fun. So if u have fun with CMSF great if u have it with CM great.