manchildstein (ii)

bad news... 4 stugs were lost on turn 15, and not a single sherman. also, photopoint wants 29.95 now... that's all for tonight... andy

now _that_ (turn 13) was a movie!! too bad i lost so many troops. well, all but one of the paras' sneak orders was abandoned, so it looks like my entire force is bogged on the 'bocage.' i've removed the sneak for that last para. the stugs aren't in contact but should be this turn... 03-14.jpg andy

ok... turn 13... the crawling motorized units have made contact. the squads got out in front of the lmgs and have taken casualties. the squads under fire have been given 'stop' orders. the squads not yet under fire have been given 'move' orders, and the lmgs have all been given 'move' orders. the platoon hqs are 'stopped' just behind the 'bocage.' the stugs are going to hunt up to the bocage, each with a 30-second pause. the 2 crack stugs have a 45-second pause, and 2 laggard stugs have no pause. the paras are finally moving out. they're going to move 'fast' to the bocage, then sneak into the tree (woods) patches in the neighboring orchard. this has got to be my best chance yet of winning this one... 03-13.jpg andy

turn 12: on turn 11, the stugs got out in front of the main picket line, but it didn't cost me. interestingly, no contact has been made yet. the para pzks have been given 45-second delays as they are getting ahead of the crawling motorized units. the idea is that they will crest the bocage at the same moment as the motorized battalion. the para platoons are still hanging back, waiting another turn or two before they move out. the last of the hmg 42s and cocos from the trucks are unloading this turn and hopefully most of them will also crest the bocage at the right moment. the photo is 03-12.jpg andy

ok.. there are some captures from this 3rd battle at www.photopoint.com the account is andyth@qwest.net 03-setup... shows the setup 03-01 shows the first turn moves...there is enough width in this field to have the motorized companies advancing in a picket line, so by the time the order is completed the company in the back will be in the center, while the other two companies are on the left and right flanks. the fallschirmjagers are going to be right behind them, in a second, 'shockwave picket line.' 03-04 shows the vehicles' move orders, following up behind the infantry. 03-11 shows the beginning of the 'attack.' the motorized companies are crawling to the 'bocage' while the panzerschrecks from the para battalion sneak up with them, the para company commanders sneaking up behind. the stugs are hunting up in support of the motorized units. it seems too early to move the para squads up, but next turn or the turn after they will execute a 'move' or 'sneak' order and 'vault' past the motorized units who should then be established in the 'bocage.' hopefully this attack is the type of concentrated punch i'll need to get eventually get through to 'la Billonnerie.' one thing which needs to happen is that it has to develop and end quickly, so my units can maintain movement and avoid getting bogged in a heavy barrage. andy

ok.. check that... i've decided to set the entire force up in its assault formation. then it will just require basically a huge group move to get them into a point near contact. the paras were moved back to the s edge of the board. then two companies of motorized with their supporting stugs were moved ahead of the paras. the 3rd company of motorized was moved into a line between the other two formations. so it's: M-M (m=motorized) __M PPP (p=fallschirmjager) a main road is on the right. this contrasts with the broad attack of the last attempt, which was: MMMPPP keep in mind that this kind of plan only has any chance of success against the ai; against a human i don't think the germans would stand any kind of chance in this scenario. as a matter of fact, against a human this one would quickly turn into an american attack!! nonetheless, the germans are ready to "go!" again. note: why i like to play against the ai... well, for starters, defects in my tactics such as driblets instead of mass - in other words ill coordination of troops so the attacks go off piecemeal - become apparent. also, there is the convenience. a player can sit there and hit 'go!' at leisure, and take as little or as much time as wanted on a given turn, plus there is the ability to play a scenario one day, then leave it there for a couple of weeks. so the entire idea behind these 'ai-based' scenarios is to provide a sometime 'cmbonaught' such as myself a chance to hone attacking skills in a convenient manner. finally, i really like these huge scenarios and to be honest, they would be a bit unwieldy in pbem/tcpip. so even if you never play a huge scenario yourself, hopefully with these aars (and sometimes photos) you can vicariously enjoy actions such as this with its 90 dedicated mg units, 14 stugs, 18 motorized squads, 20-some fallschirmjagers; and on the american side, 17 green shermans and 6 companies of crack para/glider troops. andy [ 08-18-2001: Message edited by: manchildstein II ] [ 08-18-2001: Message edited by: manchildstein II ]

well perhaps that's what i get when i design an attack at roughly 5:8 (5000:8000) odds. if nothing else, the first two playings of this scenario have shown that those fanatical green ss units are - if nothing else - good at being eliminated. ok... here we go again... game 3 (game 2 against version 2.0). again the u.s. will be in the default setup. since i know the defensive setups fairly well, once again i will attack in a straightforward manner. this time i'm going back to the attack route from game 1, but with better organization. here is the plan: starting with default setup, spend the first 5 turns or so shifting the motorized units and supporting stugs until they're in the field on the right, out in front of the fallschirmjagers (paras). once that depth is established, move the entire formation forward. once contact is anticipated, crawl the motorized battalion forward while the paras sneak past them, into the american positions, in a leapfrog manner. if the timing is right, the motorized battalion will provide withering fire support as the paras move ahead to engage in close combat with the defenders. hopefully the 6 hmg42s will be in good position at the right moment. here we go... andy

ok.. after 14 turns i've called off the attack. a ceasefire showed 439 german casualties to 100 american. 379 german survivors to over 1100 american. granted, some americans were way off on the flanks, but i have serious doubts that any of my troops would have reached the victory flags atop hill 30 (la billonnerie). even though the opponent is the ai, this method of play can help someone sharpen their attack 'skills.' for instance, i've learned that it's important to somehow integrate the hmg42s into the attack, and on a low-los board such as this it is difficult. one problem was with the stugs supporting the motorized infantry. again, at these short ranges those american bazzes were murderous. the ai is a pretty good FO commander. i was caught in two separate barrages. one fun thing about the battle was - at least for a short while - hearing all of the mgs going off. in the end though it was again the massed casuatly markers of motorized squads and lmgs lining the 'hedgerow.' i have to figure some way 'through' or 'around' that outcome. next, i will go back to an in-depth attack and try to send everything once again at a single sector. if the front line can be pierced, at least a run can then be made for the defenses of la billonnerie. andy

well after 12 turns this attack appears to be faring no better than the last one. artillery is falling toward the center now. a stug on the far left was lost to a sherman it didn't see. damn (can i say that?) the paras on the right are just now crawling into contact. if the entire attack had been along a more narrow axis, things might be looking better right about now. andy

well we took out 2 shermans but lost 3 stugs that turn. 1 stug is without gun. a part of the german line on the left was ripped open. in its place are a dead platoon hq, motorized squad, and 2 lmgs. the crack stug in the center took out a 2nd sherman just ahead of the paras on the inside right. this could be an opportunity of sorts. the two 81mm FOs attached to battalion will call in fire around that opening. on the left flank, there is an interesting situation where a stug and a sherman are within 40 meters of each other but cannot see through the 'hedgerow.' on the right the paras are about to attempt approaching the berm/hedgerow this turn. the motorized battalion's mg42s are unloading from trucks and setting up just behind the main line. the picture, gvb12.jpg shows things as they are on the left side just after turn 11. the two dead shermans on the para side of the line are just out of the picture on the near (s) side. andy

ok... turn 11 moves are in... now to hit 'go!' i wish the lmgs could use a 'sneak' move. as it is, from the early contact on turn 8 the troops on the left have been crawling to the main scattered tree ('hedgerow') line. on the right, the german paras are hesitant to cross over the 'bocage' without armored support. this turn, pzks attached to the cocos will move forward. previously, the squads moved into scattered tree patches ahead of their platoon hqs. on the left, a full-blown firefight is in effect. those extra 45 lmg 42s sure are useful. the main american barrage is dropping behind my most forward positions at the end of the line. i will put pictures up on photopoint as i go along. this turn, the pictures are gvb11.jpg and gvb11w. the 'w' in the latter stands for 'the view down the line from the west.' andy

has anyone ever spent all their vehicle points on spw 250/9s as germans? i did that once and when my opponent caught sight of the 'spw 250/9 deluge' he quit. i don't blame him but thought it would have been interesting. once, i bought all kubelwagens, towing 20mm aa and 75mm recoilless. my 'gamey' opponent had air support, and on turn 1 his airstrike waxed nearly my entire force, there bunched in a corner with none of the guns dismounted. andy

ok... after some playtesting and further feedback, i've released 2.0. it appears that 1.0 was a tad difficult. so in 2.0, the german recon elements are gone, and in their place are enough trucks (6) to carry the hmgs and cocos around, and an additional 45 lmg 42s, for a total of 126 mgs in the motorized battalion. again the way i arrived at this massive number of mgs was in looking at an oob for the 17th, and noticing it showed 1008 mgs for the division. i added the combined 6 battalions of the 37th and 38th panzergrenadier regiments, plus the recon and pioneer battalions, and came up with 8 'mg-using battalions.' dividing 1008/8 gives 126. so now a platoon of motorized has 2 squads and 9 lmg 42s, representing '2 mg squads.' making each platoon 38 men plus an hq also helps reflect a shortage of cadre which the division is reported to have suffered from. the companies have 3 hmg 42s. the american setup zones are improved so if someone really liked this scenario, they could probably play it against both the default and free setup on the part of the ai. ok... i've also expanded the german setup zone so an attacker could move in depth along a narrow axis. aar: but in this aar, i'm attacking out of the default setup, across two fields rather than just the one attempted last time. i'm basically moving straight forward to contact from the default setup positions. the fallschirmjagers (paratroops) are on the right, and the motorized battalion on the left. there is a raised row of scattered trees ('hedgerow') separating them as they move 'north.' the ground-pounders started 'move' orders and by the end of turn 8 were within about 60 meters of the raised scattered trees lining the north side of the two fields. contact was first made then. it was on about turn 3 that i gave 'move' orders to the stugs, and all of the units meshed up nicely by the end of turn 8, right there at the point of first contact. at one point, the trucks had to be switched from 'move' to 'fast' orders in order to finally catch up. it's turn 11 and they're just now arriving on the line... they must be careful with all of the ami stugs and bazzes around. fighting has gotten pretty intense, particularly on the motorized infantry side (left). on the far left and right of these neighboring fields, they are separated from the main, n/s-running roads by rows of woods. the only entrance points for vehicles are small sections of road leading to the farmhouses and such. the reason i mention this is that, on the left i started losing stugs to 'side' hits before i realized that a sherman had snuck through the road opening on my far left. on that flank i re-routed a remaining stug to reverse and headed hard left to meet the sherman face to face. this was dicey because the stug is unescorted by infantry. somehow though that sherman over there got taken out. some other stug must have gotten it. in the center of the attack, on the row of scattered trees between the two fields, i've got a crack stug creeping forward, trying to provide help to the paras on the right. that stug has taken out a sherman and has another one in its sights. both sides have lost about 3 tanks/stugs. the american artillery is already raining in, and unlike last game it is on the far left of my line. 105 and 75 started falling simultaneously. this is rather impressive on the AI's part as i know the FOs were set up way back (default setup here) but somehow the AI moved them forward quickly and they've called in fire. it appears also that the artillery barrage is arriving sooner in this game than it did in the last. in any event, brimming with confidence at the addition of 45 lmgs and the extension of the game to 60 turns, i'm now engaged aginst probably 3 to 4 companies of crack american paras along the line from left to right. we'll have to see what happens. it's turn 11 and i might just have a chance. oh, this time i didn't raise the experience of the amis. the paras are already all crack (except for the 'jt bass squad' which is elite). the 17 american shermans are all green. those crack shermans (+3 experience) 'ate my lunch' last time. i'll put some screen captures on photopoint.com (andyth@qwest.net) andy

ok... a screen shot from after turn 17... hopefully this will work: [edit] naw it didn't work. anyway, i gave that one up after turn 20 and re-designed it a bit. i'm now playing the new version and will post an aar sometime later. suffice it to say that the attack was shattered not by 3 companies, but by less than 2 companies of u.s. airborne/glider troops. i added 45 more machineguns to the german side and raised it to 60 turns so hopefully they will have a chance. andy [ 08-17-2001: Message edited by: manchildstein II ]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by PondScum: It's not +3 on the AI itself, it's +3 on the AI's unit experience levels, i.e. you've maxed out all its units to "elite" status. For the FOs, this only affects their arrival time.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> but don't the units still say "crack" even though they've been maxed to elite? anyway, turns 16-18: first, about the stug IVs: they have 51 rounds of he and 12 of ap apiece. ok.. some of the mg42s were lagging behind so the trucks picked them up. a few others jumped onto 2 stugs. when i replay this one i'll have to load the trucks up with them at the start. so contact has been made at the hedgerow... unfortunately, the attack was not properly coordinated, so about 1/3 of my force was engaged before the other 2/3 had even arrived. turns 16-18 saw a lot of hard fighting, and at least 4 shermans were taken out. on the other hand, at least 5 or 6 stugs have been lost, and the attack has bogged down where the 2/3 of the force arrived late on the left. on the right, the platoons have burst through, and a stug is making its way up through the former american positions, surrounded by motorized and paratroop squads. 3 spw 250/9s are in support there. on the left, i abandoned the stug support there and backed them off the line, where they are now moving over to the right where they will assist. the bottom line is this: the attack already appears to be faltering. for all of the progress made on the right, the americans are holding firm in the opposite field on the left. many casualties have been taken, and to top it all off, american 75mm and 105mm artillery is dropping in on the right... just where things were so promising only a few turns ago. so although the americans are shattered there, i have very little to follow up with. many of my squads are stuck under the barrage. i doubt that they will get out in any good order. i'll give it a few more turns and see what happens. for the time being though it appears as though 3 american companies supported by 7 shermans have fatally blunted the assault...

ok... for the attacking german forces, we have the remnants of "horst trebe's" 3rd fallschirmjager (paratroop) battalion, 6th regiment. i believe the 6th regiment was from the 2nd paratroop division, but that the other two regiments were not in normandy at the time. anyway, this battalion had evacuated carentan the day before, and is now under command of the 17th ss 'gvb' (gotz von berlichtingen) panzergrenadier division. now from what i can tell, the 17th should have been called 'motorized' rather than 'panzergrenadier, as they had no armored spws, but instead were transported by truck and bicycle. they had a battalion of stugs, and represented here is a company of stug IVs in support of the attack. there are 14; 3 platoons x 4 (all 12 Green) + 2 command stugs (both Crack). the 3rd battalion of paratroopers is down about 25% or so in strength. the german motorized troopers represent one of the battalions of the 37th panzergrenadier regiment (the 17th ss had 2 such regiments, the 37th and 38th). it seems the 37th was the one involved in this particular attack. so the germans have a battalion hq and 3 companies. research indicates that the 17th ss had 1008 machineguns on hand for the normandy battles. that's a lot of mgs! i gave this battalion 81 of them, but even so i'll bet they're underrepresented here. my calculations figured about 125 mgs per battalion (1008 divided by 8 (6 (37th and 38th) + 1 (recon) + 1 (pioneers)). so the platoons here are 2 motorized squads, + 4 LMGs. Each Company HQ has 3 MG 42s with it. ammo: all squads, paratrooper or motorized have 60 ammo. somewhere it mentions that the 17th had no 'panzerfausts until july' so here those are taken away, and no panzerschrecks given. the paratroopers have a good amount of both. since the paratroopers are well-stocked with at weapons on what amounts to a low-visibility mapboard, the stugs ostensibly support the anti-tank-weaponless motorized infantry. ok... the LMGs have 37 ammo each, and the HMGs 142. all units are maxed out in small arms ammo. so this makes the MG units just that much more valuable to aid in the attack. all paratroopers are Crack, and the motorized squads, leaders, and supporting MGs are mostly green, with veteran, crack, and elite mixed in. the scenario briefing goes into a bit more detail on this. finally, there is a 'recon platoon' made up of 2 trucks, 3 spw 250/9, 2 spw 251/9, 1 motorized squad, and 1 platoon hq. i always have to find a way to mix in some gunned spws... the 37th and 38th regiments did share a recon company (outside of the divisional recon battalion), so this 'platoon' represents elements from that. the battle: the setup zone is shallow, so it is tough to put a lot of units into depth. i scan the terrain and - as the designer - try to forget how the americans are set up. i'm playing default american setup with them at +3 experience. i decide that the default german setup is too thin and wide and opt for a 'fisted schwerpunkt' approach. i set them up in some depth, moving all units from the right side of the road into la billionnare into the orchard to the left of that road. units on the far right are moved further left. still, the setup zone doesn't allow for drastic depth in my formation. so instead, turn 1 has all units from the left moving at an angle, forward and right ('ne') while the other units move straight ahead. the plan is to get all units into the first major field to the left of the earlier-mentioned road through la billonare. by about turn 5 or 10 the whole thing has turned into a major 'cluster****' (cf). still, eadch platoon has its commander nearby, even though the companies and platoons are highly intermingled. the whole thing resembles a sort of giant, unorganized, 'bounding overwatch.' so i'm thinking, where might those americans be? i didn't set them up there did i? there on the northern (n) edge of this large field? nah... they must be further back... how am i ever going to get to that town in 45 turns? this is boring.... turn 15... contact!!! i'd forgotten exactly where i'd placed the americans. they were there on the other side of the 'hedgerow' at the northern end of the field. on turn 14 the right side of my advancing forces had met a squad or two and a couple of machineguns. i thought, 'oh the computer must have moved the shermans away...' bzzzt. wrong answer again. by turn 15 i've got 3 toasted stugs and 1 toasted spw 251/9, and there are at least 3 shermans in that field. ok... this is where the rubber hits the road. almost my entire force is nearby or straddling that hedgerow into the field where the americans are. this turn i will give detailed orders and a platoon or 2 will either charge or sneak into every known american troop position. meanwhile my remaining stugs will (hopefully simultaneously) cross over/through the hedgerow and engage the shermans there all at once. a note on why i'm using scattered trees for hedgerow: ok... it's tough for me to believe that the americans had 'hedgehogs' on all of their tanks by the 13th of june. it's equally tough for me to believe that no german armor could get through them. my understanding was that the german armor could get through them, but only by exposing their bellies in a major way, going over them. so here i'm using scattered trees, raised 1 or 2 levels above the terrain on either side, to represent hedgerows. i like the effect, both visually and on movement/combat. i will post more as the battle progresses. this next turn should be interesting. one other thing for me to keep in mind is that, if my troops 'lollygag' then they could be in a world of hurt in their 'compressed' state should the u.s. artillery start raining in. in an earlier version of this scenario, in a similar situation i lost about 2 companies of motorized infantry to such a barrage. i'm beginning to think that the +3 experience on the ai commander makes the artillery murder. andy

My AAR (possible spoiler info further down): Ok, this mapboard is designed after some maps i found on a u.s. 101st airborne site. this particular section was taken from maps for 12 and 13 of june, 1944. the one from the 12th had better detail in some ways, so it was referred to, even though the one from the 13th reflected the actual date of the 17th ss' counterattack. so first of all, i took a section of map from the battle map of the 13th. i checked a mile in the scale indicator, and it was 161 pixels on my machine. i cut a piece from the map itself, 161 pixels across each way. the cmbo map here is 1600x1600 meters so i figure that corresponds pretty closely with 1x1 miles. oh... first before cutting the piece out of the map from the 13th, i rotated the map 45 degrees so the arrow depicting the 'axis of the german attack' pointed due north. so 'north' on the game map is really 'northwest' in terms of the map from the 101st site. ok... it looks like battalions from the 501st and 502nd american paratroop brigades were both there along the axis of the attack. from what i could gather, elements of the 2nd armored (cca?) were also there that day. american defenders: 6 companies of either u.s. glider or paratroopers (a combination); all Crack; add in 17 shermans (3 platoon plus 2 command tanks; a "Company" of tanks) so 6 companies of crack airborne supported by 17 shermans. throw in a battalion commander, 2x75mm FO, 2x105mm FO, and 2x37mm AT + 2x57mm AT. That is the entire defending force. They're basically on a perimeter around the town of 'la billionnarre' at the northeastern part of the map. the approaches to the town around the right side and left rear are blocked - at least to vehicles - by 'fingers of marsh and woods' which extened out into the mapboard. thus the germans will best attack into a 'funnel' formed by the twin roads leading to carentan (itself off board). one of these roads leads down the right (e) side and passes through la billonnarre at the top of 'hill 30.' the other road runs into the map from the left (w) side and exits to the w of la billonnarre, at about the center of the rear (n) map edge. next: the german troops, setup, and first 15 turns.

at 58 points, this is the best buy for an assault gun in the game. the problem is, only a thousand or so were built, so buying them all the time is kind of 'gamey.' not only that, but most of their action was in an indirect fire role (75mm FO). andy

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by JasonC: I also think all the turretless German AFVs are underpriced, relative bargains. Especially the Hetzer and StuH, but also the Marders, StuG, Nashorn, and Jadgpanzer. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> my favorite is the StuG IV with its 63 ammo loadout...only 90 points for green... andy

i have sent it to the two of you. it should be really tough. try it in default setup and see how it goes. andy

oops... weather conditions: overcast, dry, dawn andy

Name and Location: "South of Carentan" Version Number: 1.0 Editor Version: 1.12 Date: 13 June 1944 Game Type: Axis Attack Based On: Historical Length: 45 Turns Map: Huge (1600x1600m) Conditions: Raining, Wet Play First As: Axis against Computer Description: Elements of 37th Panzergrenadier Regiment, 17th SS Panzergrenadier Division, supported by StuGs and Paratroopers from 3rd Battalion, 6th Fallschirmjager Regiment, attack elements of U.S. 82nd and 101st Airborne, supported by tanks from 2nd Armored Division. 5228:8532 German:U.S. points. Author: Andy Thomas If you're interested in a tough attack against the AI, try this one. Andy