The Commissar

I've had several instances when my men would come upon a hidden squad which opend up on them, but instead of doing the sencible thing, they would first hit the ground, and then get up and keep on walking to wherever I might have sent them before. I could understand if the fire came from far away, but I'm talking close quarter combat here! I had a turn when my men were moving past a bush which happent to be infected with hiden Germans. So the germans open up on my poor dim-witted squad, but instead of fighting back, they keep on moving stubbornly. If this is a bug, I hope BTS puts it on thier list for the next patch, and if it intended, please show me anyone who would ignore the big German pummeling down on him with the butt of a gun, and continue trying to move to an intended location. I wish there could be some control over the situation, like telling your men to "move at any cost" or to stop and return fire when fired upon. ------------------ "...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Being a Ruski myself, I can't wait for this game. Tiger, Yes, the JS2 was slightly inferior to the mighty Tiger, but what about the JS3? Will these mighty tanks be included by the way, since it is somewhat debatable whether they actually saw use? Looking at it from any side of any country, Hitler was the main "bad guy", even though Stalin closely followed. Interestingly enough, Stalin killed more innocent people then Hitler did with all his rounding up of Jews. War could have been won much easier if Stalin didn't decide to kill most of his generals. I can "connect" with Zhukov, my favorite Gen of the war. That, and a few of my great-grand parents served and died in the multitude of the Eastern Front battles. ------------------ "...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Lo and behold, mortals, a new God of CM MODS has emergeth upon ye! Great job Fox, with all these excellent mods from all these great hard-working people makes me wish CM would allow ALL the mods to be used randomly! That would be a great feature for CM 2, wouldn't you agree? ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back" [This message has been edited by The Commissar (edited 08-21-2000).]

Well Dirtweasel, your men's problem is indeed rodent related, but the rodent in question is far from your ordinary hamster. It is with great sadness that I must inform you, your men have picked up one of those god-awful Pokemon. I believe the mouse-like yellow one by the name of Pikachu often makes a similar sound - "Pika-Pika". I should know, since one of my younger siblings likes these abominations of an Anime show, and insist on running around the house screaming "Pika-Pika" at the top oh his little lungs. Anyway, if this is the case, I suggest you run your infected squad into clear LOS of the nearest nearby Sherman, flamethrower squad, or 150mm mortar fire. The more painful thier demise, the better. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Wow, I just read the C-net review and apparently, Mr. Walker (the reviewer) thought the graphics which he says "aren't to par with Ground Control" and the lack of TCP/IP are to blame for the bad score. Hmm...pretty sights over gameplay bias, maybe? He also mentioned that "since there isn't a TCP/IP option, players should be content to play against their motherboard", which means he ALSO doesn't realise there's that PBEM option included. What can I say - C-net is and never will be a good reviewer mag (they gave bad reviews to several games for nothing other then "not top of the line graphics"). I would e-mail them to show my concern, but I've done that before and had no responce. Guess that proves them as what they are - a bunch of fools who can't look beyond graphics. What a pity it is then that many people will listen to their review and decode CM isn't worht it for the bad grade they gave it. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Well, games genres that don't appeal to most people do die out. I didn't like wargames at all until I saw CM. I thought the ugly icons on even uglier maps were boring and stupid. For a boardgame 20 years ago, it would be perfectly acceptable, but I think CM finally did the right thing by opening up the collective eyes of wargamers everywhere by showing what COULD be done with current technology. How wargames can be some of the greatest games ever if they only got some life pumped into them with good looks and sounds, and a new engine. Since the gaming world revolves around one company copying off another, let's hope that CM will make the suits believe this genre can bring them cash. Sure, most of the clones produced in result will be hackneyed excuses for a wargame, but some are bound to be classics in their own right. Thank you BTS for (hopefully) bringing wargames back from the dead! ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back" [This message has been edited by The Commissar (edited 08-18-2000).]

Some info you might not have known - David mentioned dangerous missions. Do you know WHY the Sub encountered problems? Let me post some information which was broadcasted on Russian news programs: First off, it was as much a military planning blunder as one of the crew. The Kursk was on a training mission. For reasons I know not, the training area of the ocean was only 100 metres deep (maybe they were passing through the area). The Kursk apparently was passing close to some civilian ship, and to avoid it, decided to dive rapidly (again, for reasons I don't know). So, considering the Kursk is 150 metres long (they showed Russian footage of the Kurs when it was first built, it is GIGANTIC), the sub hit the Ocean floor and apparently a few torpedos exploded. There you have it, or at least what was fed to Russian audiences. Russia's politicians are crooked, every single last one of them. Since the break up of the USSR, Russian economy has gone haywire. Putin did clean up some, by throwing in jail a few of the rich buiseness men who were pretty much controlling and exploiting the economy. Of course, in this case he let his reputation take a big hit. I'm interested although admitedly not very eager to see where the situation goes from there. Speaking as one who still has relatives in Russia, I do not wish to see them in more trouble then they already are in. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Heya guys, I have encountered a problem in most of my PBEM games which is taking a heavy toll on the lives of my men. This mostly occurs in forests, but sometimes in open areas too. In open areas however, I take care to move my men only with covering fire present, while in forested areas this isn't possible. So I am moving a platoon through a forest, and suddenly gun fire opens. Instead of doing the sensible thing by hitting the dirt and returning fire, my squads walk on past and often take heavy casualties because of this. I tried all manners of moving, from crawling to sneaking, yet nothing works. Is this a gltich, or is there a command I can issue to make my men return fire when fired upon instead of moving on as if nothing is happening? I hope someone can help me with this problem. Thanks In advance! ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Howard, you mentioned action in CC that you did not see in CM. You used the tank appearing out of no where as an example. Obviously, you have not played enough CM if you did not see more exciting things happen here! In fact, I find CM quite a bit more exciting and challenging then CC. Thanks to the 60 second real time action turn, the action unfolds before your eyes and if something goes wrong, you are stuck with your decision. Many a times have I ran a platoon into a forest only to have it massacred from all sides by hiden enemy troops. I've ridden a tank over a hill and had it fried by a flame thrower. I've had moments so gripping that CC couldn't even dream of. I know, because I played CC. The best cure for your case, Mr. Howard, is to play CM more. Take me as a (rather poor ) example: I played the 4 single player games many times, and got tired of them. Then, I discovered the multiplayer option of the demo, and right now enjoying 6 games of PBEM with different opponents! Believe me, I am getting action by the truck-load, and I don't regret the quasi-turn-based CM engine one little bit! Just face the fact Mr. Howard: (and I'll spell it out for you so no more people have to post countless posts in this topic) BTS WILL NOT, I REPEAT, WILL NOT MAKE CM REAL TIME. BTS DOES NOT CARE TO APPEAL TO STONED TEENAGERS WHO REGULARLY PLAY STARCRAFT AND AOE. BTS IS CONCERNED WITH REALISM AND FUN, NOT WITH ENDLESS CLICK-FESTS. BTS WILL CONTINUE TO IMPROVE THEIR ENGINE, BUT WILL NEVER EVER MAKE IT REAL TIME. YOUR POINTS HAVE BEEN THROUGHLY DISCUSSED MANY TIME OVER BY MANY PEOPLE WHO HAVE BEEN HERE LONGER THEN ME AND YOU BOTH COMBINED. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH ME, OR WITH OTHERS, YOU ARE WELCOME TO. HOWEVER, PLEASE DO NOT WASTE FORUM SPACE AND OUR TIME DOING SO. That is all. Enjoy CM, and feel free to engage in conversations with us CM fans on things related to the CM that IS, not the CM that ISN'T. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Being Russian myself, I cannot blame Jochen for his strong feelings. It is something all Russian people have felt for a long time now, but unfortunately un-able to do anything about it. Russia throughout its long history has been well known for its low value of human life. In the time of the Czars where cities would be built on the dead bodies of the millions of working serfs that were forced to build them, to WW2 with it's "wave of bodies" tactics employed for almost a year by commanders. It's still in effect now, and I believe it will be for a long time yet, unfortunately. As strange as it might seem to outsiders however, Russian people have come to accept it as their duty and are still very patriotic towards their homeland. Well, my salutes go off to the poor sailors on the downed Kursk. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Fellows, fellows, let's not resort to childish "he started it!" posts! Our friend Mr. Howard was a bit confused why CM was not done the way CC was. I will have to admit that being a long time CC fan myself, at first I too asked myself the same questions Mr. Howard did. Then, I downloaded the demo, read the FAQ and studied this fine example of a mssg. board to come to the conclusion it wasn't possible. If Mr. Howard has not done so yet, give him the chance to do so. Don't mock or insult him, there's no need for it. If he does proper research, and still maintains his stance, then he does not properly understand what is involved in making playable and realistic war games. In this worst case scenario, we should forget him and simply not post in responce to this topic. Now, I am sure it has not come to this and will not come to this. I suggest Mr. Howard does research and understands our posts. Simplicity in itself, eh? Just remeber, cussing and acting like 5 year olds in a sandbox gets you no where, especially considering most of you are more then 4 times that age. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Howard, Let me start off by saying that I too, am a long time CC and other RTS game fan. Well, by "other RTS" I mean Myth and Shogun, which IMHO are half a million times as intelligent as AoK or its predecessor. That's a topic for another forum however, so I'll get to my point: In RTS, the winner is ultimately who clicks the fastest. It doesn't matter how good of a grasp you have on the strategic or tactical situation if your opponent is able to make all his troops run circles around you by clicking 2000+ times a minute. Is it really fair for someone who cannot do this? No. Now, let's look at the point you brought up: It was possible in AoE and AoK and they sold kagillions of copies. True. Then again, Howard, AoE is not even half as complexed as CM. In AoE, you select your big horde of soldiers, and you send them at the enemy. Whoever has a bigger horde, wins! Believe me, I know, because I used to play AoE about 3 years back. Now, in CM on the other hand, not only must you think about the best positions to move your men to, but also about covering fire for your men, and if your men will be in danger in those positions. Only then, can you start moving them. Even this is slow however. You must right click on a squad, select the option, and then drag a line to your desired location. In real life, all you would have to do is Radio the Platoon leader and yell "Squad #1 to Hill 213!" From there on, the Platoon Leader would be earning his pay by positioning his men accordingly. CC accomplished this, but as it was pointed out to you already by many others, CM not only had much smaller scale battles, but also it's physics and AI were not to par with those of CM. So you are given a choice Howard: 1) You sacrifice depth, intelligence, and planning for large scale rea time. 2) You only play out small scale combats with only a platoon or two as in CC. 3) You wait 5 years until computers become powerful enough to process all this in real time, and act as your subordinates of your force, leaving you largely out of the action. As you can see, a combination is simply not possible. I used to despise turn based games, but when I played CM, all that changed. Here's hoping you end up feeling the same way about this wonderful game. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

You know you played too much CM when... You're in jail for attempted murder because one of your friends declared "turn-based games are boring" after you tried to get him hooked on CM. You insist your friend drives your Beetle while you stick your upper body out of the sun-roof with a pan on your head, declaring that's where Tank-commanders belong. You form a CM Militia and raid Computer stores because "the bastards wouldn't give BTS a chance!" ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Hello guys, I've seen lots of you mention Rommel's book called "Infantry Tactics". Looking around all the internet book sites however, all I saw was Rommel's book called "Infantry Attacks". Is this the same book, or am I just not getting any luck with finding "Infantry Tactics"? Thanks in advance! ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Russo tanks comunicated with flags, right? So, if a Russian tank is in view of it's commander (whether he is infantry or a fellow tanker) and is unbottoned, then the tank moves like normal with no communication penalties. If the tank is forced to button, nothing can be done to tell it to unbutton unless of course it can see its commander out of the gunner's or driver's views. If it cannot see the commander, the tank will continue to fire but will only unbutton when it deems it safe. In veteran tankers, this would be as soon as possible, while with Green tankers this might tank a while. Thus, be careful about buttoning your T-34's You think this could work? I'd like to see how BTS handles it. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back" [This message has been edited by The Commissar (edited 08-17-2000).]

*sigh* I'm not going to step into this mess you made, Mr. Johnson. I will however, attempt to put a stop to it: Do you have any means of taking revenge on the evil, scheming Russian government? Are you the president of the United States, head of the UN, or even a measely Head of War Dept.? No? I didn't think so. Here you are though, preaching to us about just how bad Russians are, how badly they are treating the Chechens, and that something should be done about it. Ok, grab an AK-47 (you can buy one for under $100 in countries sorrounding Russia), put some camo on, and head on over to Chechnia. There, you can join the rebel forces and get shot by some Russian soldier. You get your "revenge", the forum is back to normal with you gone, and everyone is happy. I feel I must throw in a bit about why Russians are not yet WINNING the war as they should be doing considering their strenght. They are fighting guerillas. This is similar to what happent to the US fighting Vietnam. You CANNOT fight Guerillas with regular military tactics! Yet they do. "Let's send in a few tanks and have our boys ride them all in the open!" Stupid. To fight guerillas, you must use similar tactics, IMHO. I am no military expert (although I hope to be one day), but I think the Russians would get much better results if they used scouting Guerilla parties to locate rebel concentrations and then bombard those concentrations to hell with tactical missiles, or at least to sorround them and destroy them with heavy weapon fire. As it is now, progress will be slow and bloody, which is unfprtunate considering just how much easier the Russians could handle this situation. BTW: Would you care to give me the link for this Chechen rebel site? Im very interested to seeing what they have on there. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

On the subject of Kursk, I just finished watching the Russian news program, and they mentioned the fact that the crew have not yet used any of the several ways they could of escaped from the submarine in their condition. Although I am no submariner, and thus do not know which methods are possible to escape, I will not make hasty conclusions that they have to work. What I do think is that if the escape pods (or whatever) are in working order as they should be, the crew cannot get to them. This might mean the crew are already dead, or incapacitated. If there was an explosion in the Kursk, this is very much likely the case. Mr Johnson, I do not want to get into an argument with you. However, I do take offense at what you said in your first post. Forgive my foolish Russian ignorance, but when a bunch of rebel terrorists from some country the USA is waring with decide to blow up a few building filled with innocent civilians as a start to a war, I will see how you react. The Chechens wanted "freedom", yet they have been doing nothing but stealing from Russia for years. They have drilled holes in a pipeline and stole precious fuels. Now they want independence (for who knows what) and to declare their independence, they kill a few hundred civilians. I do not think there are any case of genocide there Mr. Johnson. A war is a war, and casualties are taken. If a country attacks another country openly using a terrorist act, it is as good a reason to fight a war as if the other country formeley declared war. It is easy to point fingers Mr. Johnson when you only know half the story. Please find out more before you start accusing those nasty no-good Russians of killing those poor, harmless little Chechens. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Wow...this is serious! I do love US news programs - who cares about silly things like sunken submarines when we can run more "Survivor" stories! I hope they have it on in the evening news, so I can find out more details about this tragedy. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back" [This message has been edited by The Commissar (edited 08-16-2000).]

I have an idea: maybe, for the next game of CM (or the one after) BTS can include the option to buy camoflauge for your armor. This would somewhat limit the visibility of the armor at longer ranges, but would not make the tank invisible. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Forgive my idiocy...but is this a recent event or one which happent in recent history?

That's an excellent point David, and one I did not consider! Then again, I never knew that battles got so big as to include thousands of men. Well, better get the game and find out then. Jeff, I think picking off men from a sqaud as it takes casualites is a pretty safe thing to do. Doesn't require too much coding I should think. And distinguishing between teams...well, once clicked upon it gives the unit info, and since the game is turn based you can take all the time you want id'ing units. Morale effects are harder of course...I'm not sure how hard it is to prog a man or two cowering away from the rest of their unit or things of that sort, so I won't pretend I have a solution to this. Thanks for your replies, everyone! ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Heya guys, I know this is just a nitpick of mine (and I'm sure several others as well) but it sometimes bothers me (when I'm not madly involved in the action) that a squad is represented by only 3 men at most. Yes, I know it has no real effect on the game play. What it DOES have an effect on is the "coolness factor". Nobody can disagree - CM is one of the most realistic and intense wargames, no, games out there. There is something very very cool about watching a squad's positions being punded by artillery with the trench cam. Or a tank battle with one of the combatants exploding into a flaming wreck. Or a close and bloody forest fighting with enemy squads leaping out as if from nowhere, grenades flying in all directions. Or..well, you get the idea. This would all be enhanced with realistic proportions of units, and the much heralded "coolness factor" would go through the roof. Now, I know the reasons for it being the way it is. CM was started 3 years ago, made to work on older machines, using 4MB video cards. So my question is this - would it not be possible to increase the number of men along with the graphics of CM with processor speeds going over 1Ghz and Video crads like the GeForce about? Just a question, if it can't be done it can't be done. I still love the game and I am busy recommending it to everyone I know. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

::shameless plug for no good reason:: How bout that Military Library CD they have right here at Battlefront? ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

Why are so many of the alleged "grognards" like Gerbiltoy ( )say killing off prisoners is "unrealistic"? It was done all the time, as many have pointed out already. In a desperate battle, when you need every man you have to fight the enemy and there aren't any minefileds around, I would shoot my POW's. I say "I would" because I don't have the game yet. Obviously, if I was low on ammo, had extra manpower, and there were no minefileds in sight, I would let the prisoners live. Otherwise, it's the old "pistol to the head" for 'em. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"

How about the "Military Reference Library" CD they have right here ar Battlefront? It has over a hundred manuals covering all aspects of tactics with different military branches, from Infantry to Armor and I think even to Air. I'm going to get my own copy as soon as I get the money, along with the "Combat Leader's Field Guide" which was previously mentioned in this thread. ------------------ ...Every position, every meter of Soviet soil must be defended to the last drop of blood..." - Segment from Order 227 "Not a step back"