Dar Posted June 28, 2000 Share Posted June 28, 2000 <h2>Possible Spoiler for Villers-Bocage scenario!</h2> Noted last night when I was playing Villers-Bocage scenario that I captured an English squad that remained at "Routed!" status after capture. They would not accept any orders in that state, and remained fixed in that one spot for the duration of the scenario. I can't give any consistent repro steps. However, the squad was being suppressed in the house nearest the crossroads where the lone Tiger starts the game by that same Tiger during Turn 10. When Turn 11 began and the German reinforcements magically appear all around the house and crossroads area, it surrendered. So I'm wondering if the sudden appearance of extra enemies that weren't there in the previous turn caused some sort of glitch or race condition causing the unit surrendered without updating its status? Dar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug Beman Posted June 29, 2000 Share Posted June 29, 2000 Uh, Dar, one of the ordained effects of being Routed! is that they don't accept orders and either run wildly or hug the dirt for dear life. Additionally, the ! means that they take a long long time to get un-Routed, and will quickly go back to Routed! in the presence of enemies. I think the sudden appearance of overwhelming enemy force is one thing that will make a unit crap its pants and hold up its hands. DjB 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted June 29, 2000 Share Posted June 29, 2000 Hey! I love that little realistic feature. Those guys were scared ****less! Just pointing a gun at them and ordering them to surrender and move 'East' is not going to work. It will take a few minutes for them to collect their wits. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dar Posted June 29, 2000 Author Share Posted June 29, 2000 Begging your pardon, but it seems to me that "Routed" is one of several morale stages on the path to surrendering, and not an actual state to experience after surrendering. Every other time I've taken prisoners, I was able to order them to move the turn after. Considering most units have to be persuaded rather severely to surrender, they were therefore likely to be in a "Broken" or "Routed" state immediately before surrendering. Additionally I fail to see how a captured unit is going to "calm down" from routed status--if "Routed" is a valid state for a captured unit--when there's an enemy SS PzGr squad in the same house and several Tigers less than 50m away. As I understand, enemy units in close proximity are not conducive to the morale of units that have been shaken up. And as far as realism, any prisoner that refuses to obey, "Los! Los! Mach schnell!" is going to get a bayonet in the ass to encourage him. Dar [This message has been edited by Dar (edited 06-28-2000).] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted June 29, 2000 Share Posted June 29, 2000 I see your point now DAR. PANICKED would be a more appropriate state perhaps. But maybe ROUTED in this instance is just a method of indicated that they are REALLY, REALLY PANICKED and won't be recovering any time soon. And that bayonette in the arse would only encourage them to 'dirty their draws' even more. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dar Posted June 29, 2000 Author Share Posted June 29, 2000 Well, after playing a little more last night, I took several units prisoner, and the very next turn I was able to order them to move back to my lines. I still claim that the immobile prisoners was a bug, albeit a fairly trivial one. Dar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moon Posted June 30, 2000 Share Posted June 30, 2000 Being SURRENDERED doesn't really exclude other unit states. If, for example, prisoners are shot at (be it harrassing artillery, an HE round gone astray or aimed fire), they are prone to the same suppressive states as any other unit in the game. It IS possible to rout an already captured unit - and this does indicate the off-chance that the unit (although maybe even guarded) might simply break and run for it. At the same time (as in the example above) it might mean that the unit is simply not going to do what you tell it: "shoot me, but I'm staying here! Mommmiiiiieeee!" In other words, I personally wouldn't call this a bug at all, quite to the contrary actually. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dar Posted June 30, 2000 Author Share Posted June 30, 2000 I still maintain it's a bug, but it's so trivial I don't expect it to get fixed. I've captured many units after putting them through some severe punishment, and everytime I've been able to order them to move to the rear on the turn after they were captured--except for this one time. That unit was not in any real danger for the rest of the game yet stayed "Routed" for the duration. Additionally, as I stated earlier, I don't see how a unit is going to calm down in close proximity to enemy units. Oh, well--unless Steve or Charles gives the authoritative answer, it's just a matter of conjecture. Dar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted June 30, 2000 Share Posted June 30, 2000 Dar: FWIW I have always been able to move my captured units on the next turn also, except the one time they were "PANICKED". They stayed in a state of panic for three or so turns. How long did YOUR units stay "ROUTED"? You say "until the end of the game." How long was that? Just trying to get a handle on the length of time you are talking about. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dar Posted June 30, 2000 Author Share Posted June 30, 2000 Scott: <h3>Possible Villers-Bocage Spoiler!</h3> Well, it was turn 11 when all the reinforcements showed up and the British squad surrendered--and they stayed routed 'til the end, which I believe was turn 30? If it's a bug, it's pretty minor. If not, it was just unusual to see it after ordering other captives around on the next turn. Oh, well! Dar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted June 30, 2000 Share Posted June 30, 2000 hmmm....19 turns/minutes does sound kinda long to remain "ROUTED" after becoming a POW. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Big Time Software Posted July 1, 2000 Share Posted July 1, 2000 Dar - this is fixed in the upcoming v1.03 patch. Charles 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Scott Clinton Posted July 1, 2000 Share Posted July 1, 2000 There yah go! I told you it was a bug. ------------------ Please note: The above is solely the opinion of 'The Grumbling Grognard' and reflects no one else's views but his own. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dar Posted July 5, 2000 Author Share Posted July 5, 2000 Woo hoo! Thanks, Charles! <--The Hardest Working Man in Show Biz! Dar 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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