Slum battle highlights good and bad things about TacAI

[Guest]

I recently built a "slum" in the scenario editor. A massive, packed square kilometer of buildings, with blocks of crumbling apartment buildings and blocks of newer, more cramped single-story houses, criss-crossed with dirt roads, paths, and sewer trenches. (Also some nice piles of tires, debris, and IEDs of all shapes and sizes.) I'll post screens when I get a chance.

I packed the place with several hundred unconventional troops, posited that a platoon of Bradleys and a pair of M1s had been trapped on the wrong side of the slum, and set up three platoons of US infantry (one Stryker, two Bradley) and another pair of M1s as the rescue force. The infantry did the brunt of the work, of course.

The trapped units had to scrabble for cover in the business district, with their infantry scrambling to hold key buildings while the rescue force fought its way through the packed slum areas. It was a brutal, bitter battle, but I picked up some great AI highlights.

Pro:

1) A "trapped" squad of American troops, told to hunt into a building, proceeded to clear the first floor and hold it against successive waves of counterattackers at close range from all across its front 180. I didn't touch them all game, and they did fine.

2) A trio of American fire teams ordered to hunt into a pair of buildings appeared to stack up and went in guns blazing (!) and killed three enemy without taking casualties or needing intervention.

3) A pair of American rifle squads, told to hunt in successive bounds up one flank, covered an entire block, killed an MG team and a rifle team, and reached their objective without taking casualties or needing intervention (beyond getting them going again every couple minutes).

Con:

1) A "trapped" squad of Americans told to Quick move to the top floor of a tall building were all cut down -- from outside the building -- on their way up without bothering to stop or find cover.

(This also points out some potential oddities in the spotting and shooting calculations... who could spot them well enough to kill them all from a half a block away while they're running up a central stairwell?)

2) An American fire team told to hunt toward a two-story building stopped 20 meters from an enemy squad deployed at a building corner and didn't open fire. They just sat there, taking casualties, until I came along and got them out of it. (A team coming along to help them out did fly through the air from a 5-story building to the street, though, which was entertaining.)

3) An American MG team that spotted an enemy unit ran to the wrong side of the building they were on top of and consequently had no shot. I had to manually re-face them.

There was some more fun stuff (both positive and negative), but these were the highlights. Thought I'd share them.

The best thing about this, though, was that I had a fantastic time building and playing the scenario. I'm really looking forward to fixes for some of the oddities I've pointed out, as they can only enhance a great experience.

[Renaud]

Wow, great info, thanks.

[jomni]

Care to share the file?

[Guest]

I'd love to. I haven't set up objectives yet (I realized that about halfway through the mission) or anything to support the "story" other than imagination (although if you try to make a run for it with the trapped platoon you'll be cut to pieces). The American side has no orders, and the Syrian StratAI orders are very vague (basically, "you have the whole area to yourselves, ambush at will"). Each side has its priorities (including ammo and casualty constraints for the Americans).

If that still sounds good, though, sure I'll pass it along! Alternately I could take a couple nights and fix it up, but I think the current version is what I'll be "playing" for a while regardless.

Let me know.

[jomni]

Better tweak it first.

[Darkmath]

Hopefully, your scenario proves there is a StratAI and TacAI which works fine sometimes.

So, we can suppose the whole non AI exist whether the scenario design is flawed or some bugs (which makes QBs useless now) occurs.

I'm affraid but some scenario in CMSF seem to have a poor or bugged design (sorry for the designer ).

May I comment about this point:

"2) An American fire team told to hunt toward a two-story building stopped 20 meters from an enemy squad deployed at a building corner and didn't open fire. They just sat there, taking casualties, until I came along and got them out of it. "

Isn't it so because the house clearing is abstracted?

Like the fire team stay in an abstracted room or something.

[Guest]

Sorry that was unclear. Neither the Americans nor the Syrians were in a house. The Syrians were deployed at and fighting from behind a corner created by a building. The Americans were in the street.

As for the whole TacAI thing, I think the Hunt command works marginally well about 90% of the time, but most everything else seems off.

[mcitt]

Phil,

I would like to give it a try as is.

[Guest]

Cool. I'll put it up when I get home tonight (usually late PST).

Cheers.

[Guest]

mcitt -- mind if I email it to you? I've got to get a file sharing service set up.

Let me know.

[Roter Stern]

Interesting write up and observations!

I wouldn’t mind checking it out as well. Try http://www.mediafire.com/ - seems like a pretty straight forward file sharing service – no registration is needed to upload or download. Although if you register you can create and share “folders”.

An American MG team that spotted an enemy unit ran to the wrong side of the building they were on top of and consequently had no shot. I had to manually re-face them.

I found that to be a bit of a problem as well. So in cases where units moving around a building might cause them being exposed to a new threat I issue a gigantic 180-degree fire arc to keep them focused in a specific area … seems to work pretty well.

[mcitt]

Phil,

Yes you can email it to me at mcitt@wideopenwest.com

[Guest]

The Louch and mcitt --

I've just emailed you the scen, mcitt. Sorry for the delay, last week was a crazy work week (my development team is working basically the same hours as BFC at this point). I've made no changes from the original description.

I have noticed that there is an MGS stuck in a building towards one corner of the map. I should move it out in the editor, but I haven't yet. If you're playing Red, just be careful of the 105mm that lurks in one of the buildings.

Here's the link to the file for anyone else that wants it (thanks for the tip The Louch):

http://www.mediafire.com/?eg93nvdn1mc

Let me know what you think, guys.

Cheers,

Phil