Hunt command...

[Zipuli]

I got over the fact that hunt meant that whenever a unit sees something, they cancel the order. OK, fine, but if a unit on hunt command is fired at, it won't care if it doesn't see the enemy firing at it. Because of this I lost a lot of troops in my last mission as 4 Syrians opened up on my platoon on hunt orders moving ahead. The guys kept dropping like flies and they just "sneaked" on shouting about keeping an eye on those flanks. When the enemy was spotted by the remaining few the guys stopped, canceled orders and hit the dirt and some even returned fire.

This is really a problem for me, as now it seems there really is no order (especially for inf in MOUT) to scout ahead and take cover if fired upon. Yeah yeah I know about "move" order but spotting is not great on move and they also try to keep on going even if under fire. Either have the original "hunt" - better spotting + return fire and keep moving or then have sort of "move to contact" order which causes the troops to move slow and scout and if fired upon stop movement, take cover and return fire.

Zip

[SmithyG]

Good points. I hadnt noticed this yet.

[benpark]

This might be why the AI seems reluctant to fire on the move as well.

[Chelco]

Thanks Zipuli. Great point.

To solve this: have you tried a bounding overwatch?

[Elmar Bijlsma]

I'm not sure I understand. You complain about your soldiers on "Hunt" continuing to advance when shot at by an unseen enemy? Staying in place while you are under fire from an unseen enemy is the absolute worst you can do.

CMx1 "Hunt" was never return fire and keep moving. It was exactly the same as current "Hunt" with the exception that they get under way again should the enemy disappear. That wouldn't have saved your squad from your example, as they were being shot to pieces before you even spotted them.

[John Catsack]

I'm glad people are making posts about the lack of a good advance-equivalent order. To me, the behavior of units coming under fire is a much bigger issue than the supposed "pathfinding" problems people are having.

[Zipuli]

"Staying in place while you are under fire from an unseen enemy is the absolute worst you can do."

No it's not. The worst thing you can do is to continue "sneaking" ahead like you were not under fire and do it in the open and yell to your squad to look at the flanks! Have you seen this in game? Try it and you'll get it. If they would sprint to cover it would be different. But now they still go on in their "duck-walk" like nothing happened, while the whole squad is killed 1 by 1.

"To solve this: have you tried a bounding overwatch?"

Of course I have. But my problem is not bounding overwatch but the way the squad on point trying to get in contact with the enemy has no way of doing it in a clever way. Even if I had the whole platoon in good overwatch positions and the squad advancing on point takes fire and then does nothing to preserve their lives I end up with a dead squad - of course few seconds later the platoon mows down the enemy, but too late for the squad that could not A) return fire and take cover in the terrain (meaning not only to go belly-down on the ground, but perhaps sprint the 2 meters to take pos behind that wall...)

Zip

PS. Never said anything about CM1 hunt command, did I?

[Elmar Bijlsma]

Originally posted by Zipuli:

"Staying in place while you are under fire from an unseen enemy is the absolute worst you can do."

No it's not. The worst thing you can do is to continue "sneaking" ahead like you were not under fire and do it in the open and yell to your squad to look at the flanks! Have you seen this in game? Try it and you'll get it. If they would sprint to cover it would be different. But now they still go on in their "duck-walk" like nothing happened, while the whole squad is killed 1 by 1.

So in short, you gave the wrong order for the given circumstances. Try "Assault", it'll be what you are looking for. Stop expecting "Hunt" to read your mind.

[NCOIC]

My feeling is that since the game was designed to be played in realtime, they didnt consider the need for a "move to contact" command.

Dunno why people are being rude about a reasonable question, since "assault" isnt what he wanted to do...

[Elmar Bijlsma]

Who's being rude? I merely corrected him. He wanted his unit to have good spotting, move, and fire at the same time. "Assault" does exactly that.

The old CMx1 "Move to contact" is in, in the form of the "Hunt" command.

[NCOIC]

Maybe its because they dont stop when fired upon (taking casualties)? They only stop when they see something...

Point is, assault doesnt work either, because they dont stop.

[Elmar Bijlsma]

But he doesn't want them to stop when fired upon. He wants them to take some form of cover or protective stance, return fire and continue advancing until they spot something.

Of course, there is a way to make the engine do what you want. Try the "assault" order, but put tiny stretches of "hunt" in between, as and where the situation required. And that's sorta my point. There is no way CMSF can read your mind and do exactly what you want. It will do exactly what you order it to do. If you want complex behaviour exactly the way you want it, you have to issue more complex orders.

[Chelco]

Originally posted by Zipuli:

"To solve this: have you tried a bounding overwatch?"

Of course I have. But my problem is not bounding overwatch but the way the squad on point trying to get in contact with the enemy has no way of doing it in a clever way. Even if I had the whole platoon in good overwatch positions and the squad advancing on point takes fire and then does nothing to preserve their lives I end up with a dead squad - of course few seconds later the platoon mows down the enemy, but too late for the squad that could not A) return fire and take cover in the terrain (meaning not only to go belly-down on the ground, but perhaps sprint the 2 meters to take pos behind that wall...)

Zip

PS. Never said anything about CM1 hunt command, did I? [/QB]

Ey Zip,

I hear you. LOL on the hunt command!

Please don't take me wrong, my questions asked in good faith, since I want to learn too. After all you are the soldier in this discussion!

But anyway, here is what I do: point squad split into two fire teams. Bounding overwatch with those two fire teams. If there is any spotting to do, has to be done with the overwatch fire team. The fire team moving is not expected to provide too much spotting at all, and is moved from cover to cover on "quick" orders.