EricM Posted April 20, 2001 Share Posted April 20, 2001 I know this has been discussed before and people are asking for a patch to fix it. But I know we won't be seeing a patch from BTS for CMBO for a long time (maybe never). How do you stop troops from retreating towards the enemy? I am playing First Clash at Cambes (?) against AI as British. I have units in houses engaging the Germans, when suddenly they lose their morale (or something) and go charging the enemy :mad: ! Not only the enemy but into an mortar barrage. It not only happened with a rifle squad but also a platoon leader. How can I stop them from charging? Thanks, Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
109 Gustav Posted April 20, 2001 Share Posted April 20, 2001 Kind of hard to tell directions when all you care about is getting away from the firing, eh? Units will usually retreat toward the friendly map edge (set in Perameters in the scenario editor), but panicked units will do all kinds of things that us reasonably sane battalion HQs would think is senseless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panther131 Posted April 20, 2001 Share Posted April 20, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Kind of hard to tell directions when all you care about is getting away from the firing, eh? Units will usually retreat toward the friendly map edge (set in Perameters in the scenario editor), but panicked units will do all kinds of things that us reasonably sane battalion HQs would think is senseless. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Hi 109Gustav, I have to disagree with this. I know that troops can and will act senseless when being butchered up by enemy fire but running towards the fire does not make any sense even to the one being shot at. I have seen a few to many times in CM where I have a squad being fired at by an enemy squad and it would seem that my squad would have the sense to run away from the attacking enemy squad. Hmmm...maybe there is references to this occurance. But until I read up on it I would say this doesn't seem right. But again...we are just normal reasonably sane battalion HQs that would think its senseless. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
reggie Posted April 23, 2001 Share Posted April 23, 2001 i dont know about you but if someone is shooting at me i know were it coming from 90% of the time if you every heard a gun shoot at you you know were it coming from and most of the time what kind it is too :eek: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Determinant Posted April 23, 2001 Share Posted April 23, 2001 It's a fair point. If troops are that spooked by the incoming fire and associated butchery then common sense says that they would leave by the same way that they came in. Unless they were really spooked in which case they would probably lie where they were hoping for better days on the 'If you knows of a better 'ole then go to it!' principle. The only historical example I can think of of troops under fire taking cover towards the source of the enemy fire was 2 PARA at Goose Green in the Falklands Conflict - Rifle Company advancing down a forward slope towards the settlement on a billiard (sorry pool) table piece of ground. The only possible piece of cover (a fence line or similar) was forward and there was no way anyone could run back over the crest of the hill... Quite rare - hardly ever see ground that open in NW Europe... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panther131 Posted April 24, 2001 Share Posted April 24, 2001 Agreed. running towards enemy fire is overdone in CM if you ask me. Too any times I have seen a squad run towards the enemy that is shooting at them. I know my tactics are bad but I think the run to to the enemy under fire is overdone in CM. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted April 24, 2001 Share Posted April 24, 2001 Actually, part of counter-ambush doctrine is to charge the ambushing location. The rationale is that by attacking one point of the ambushing force will reduce the number of weapons involved (Unless the ambusher's friendlies have a penchant for firing at their own troops.) and you will avoid any other traps set up at possible escape routes by the ambushing force. Also most ambush formations have no depth and a quite easy to turn the offensive if a point in its line is breached. Now, I have no idea if that is what BTS coded the squads to do. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Determinant Posted April 24, 2001 Share Posted April 24, 2001 Well, yes... It is always said that a snap assault is the best response to an ambush. And that's fair enough because if you are ambushed then you are in the killing zone of a prepared attack by a force lying in wait for you and you are therefore likely to be hit quite soon (if you haven't already been hit). The rationale is therefore that the worst thing has already happened and that your best possible response is to attack your attackers - it is the reaction they will expect least... So far so good. But is this is what is happening in the original problem referred to above? I'm not sure that it is. CM is modelling troops in battle - not patrol anti-ambush drills. Anyway as a point of interest, even though it is the recommended drill, how often have troops caught in an ambush actually responded by assaulting the ambushers? Somebody somewhere must have researched this (pretty sure that the US Army did a bunch of statistical work on ambushes during the Vietnam era). It would be interesting to know. My bet is not very often. Not if the ambush was any good anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abrams Posted April 24, 2001 Share Posted April 24, 2001 As an Old CMBO Guy (I started with the Demo over a year ago ), this was not a problem for me until I recently upgraded my original version 1.0 to the latest upgrade . Something changed that did not need to be IMO. Abrams Out dP Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panther131 Posted April 24, 2001 Share Posted April 24, 2001 Well I agree with Abrams (and welcome back by the way). I have said it above twice so I'll leave it at that. However we all know that CMBO is finished and BTS will not return to it so maaybe there is hope for CM2 and its future iterations regarding this issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACTOR Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 I guess I am wondering how many times has this actually been an issue for you? I have been playing for about a year also, and I have seen that there is a difference related to this sort of AI activity. However, it has not been a significant issue in the fifty or sixty games I have played since the latest patch was released. I have seen it happen a few times, but that act alone was never the defining moment in the game. I am not saying that it couldn't be better, I am only saying that despite this mild annoyance I am able to play the game without concern. My $0.02...thanks for listening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EricM Posted April 25, 2001 Author Share Posted April 25, 2001 To answer somethings brought in some post. None of the times it has happened was an ambush situation. My units were in a house with support troops in the houses to the rear and sides. They were firing on the German units that were trying to assualt my position. That is why I had an mortar barrage to their front. There was also a platoon leader in the house with them. As to frequency, I don't ever remember seeing units flee towards the enemy before I downloaded the 1.12 patch. I had started with 1.0 and downloaded each patch as it came out. I also played games between patches, so it's not like I missed something in between. My question still remains, is there some order that I can give my troops that will keep them from fleeing foward? Eric Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ACTOR Posted April 25, 2001 Share Posted April 25, 2001 Sorry Eric, I don't think there is any command you can give that will prevent the Tac AI from doing something stupid. Happy hunting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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