Justin Rebelo Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 Being an old Close Combat fan, Combat Mission is right up my alley and then some. I love the game and the way it plays (i really like the fact that you guys included historical information as mission briefs, very cool). The only problem I have is the way infantry combats. I have had more than one instance where 4 or 5 of my infantry are within a few feet of an enemy squad of troops and the two groups shoot and shoot and shoot (i mean they are almost close enough to touch eachother somtimes), yet it still takes a VERY long time for casualties to show up. I mean, I would expect that 9 or 10 soldiers in a close vicinity would become 1 or 2 soldiers in a matter of seconds. This just seems rather whacky and I was wondering if there is some setting I can adjust to increase damage taken? I would like it to play out a little more realistically in that sense. Thanks, folks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSword Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 Justin, Welcome to the real thing ! CMBB is far, far ahead of the comic like Close Combat thing. In your example you waited to long to go in. What you have to do in an attack: 1. Close in to the enemy and locate him. 2. Suppress him 3. Go in and kill For 1. you need some recons, usually splitted squads are the most economical. As soon your recons stumble into opposition, have your second line (MG's, mortars, squads) ready to suppress it (2.) (Area fire works best) and then 3. Storm the enemy troops with some unfrightend squads. So far the theory, in practical application 3. may still become a disaster when there are other enemy units you haven't seen already. So before transition from 1. to 2. i usually recon the flanks and check whether the approaches are clean and use the time to bring up my heavy weapons like HMGs and mortars. If possible i try to install an additional flank threat. On recon my units (always splitted squads with the exception of a reserve squad always near the HQ) are almost always sneaking/hidden with the exception of the HQ-unit and when being surely out of LOS, thus i can manage to really close in to the enemy. In general this takes time so in case you play QBs give enough time. It's like creating a trap. This advice is true vs. AI. Against human opponents things become much more complicated if you're on the attack. Greets Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vergeltungswaffe Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 When people are shooting at one another at close range, there is not a lot of aiming going on, so hits aren't as prevalent as you might think. However, when one or the other squad decides they've had enough and gets up to run, you will see people who are no longer being shot at actually use the sights on their weapons. While playing last night, 3 squads of German infantry came across a single Soviet squad, and traded fire at very close range for about 40 seconds, at which time it became known that there were 9 of 11 men remaining in the Soviet squad. In the 41st second, the Commies decided they had had enough and jumped up to run. Within 9 seconds, 7 more casualties, versus the 2 that occurred in 40 seconds. I think this is excellent realism, personally. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mud Posted October 14, 2002 Share Posted October 14, 2002 What kind of squads are we talking about here? If you haven't tried them yet, have a look at how SMG-heavy squads (like the Soviet all-PPsh squad...) do in close quarters. Also, if one squad in good cover ambushes somebody on the move in worse cover, it can be over fairly quickly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Justin Rebelo Posted October 14, 2002 Author Share Posted October 14, 2002 I completely agree with you guys as for the manner that this all takes place and such. It is very realistic. It just seems that, in my experience, sometimes it's just painful to watch a small skimish play out. Like 2 or 3 guys piled into a small house occupied by 3 enemies. They sat and shot at eachother for at least half a minute before the other guys just crawled out the wall... I guess it's not really worth getting in to. This is how it is, so I just have to learn to like it. Justin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty's Double Posted October 15, 2002 Share Posted October 15, 2002 Another thing to remember is that some of the terrain isn't strictly representational. Buildings look like hollow boxes but the game engine assumes there are internal walls and furniture in there. Two squads in a building only a few metres apart could spend ages trading blows because they are actually firing blind. On the whole, CM simulates larger conflicts than CC, so it's best not to focus on the micro level. While I enjoyed the CC series, they don't come anywhere near CM's level of accurate simulation. I for one could never go back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie the Toad Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 When my units get that close they start smacking each other around. You can hear a lot of rifle butts or fisticuffs. I like the sound of that... fisticuffs.... it sounds so ... polite. gentile Toad Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Manuel Posted October 16, 2002 Share Posted October 16, 2002 Originally posted by Louie the Toad: When my units get that close they start smacking each other around. You can hear a lot of rifle butts or fisticuffs. I like the sound of that... fisticuffs.... it sounds so ... polite. gentile ToadThe CMBO mod I have (I think it's a mod-?) uses the sounds from the hand-to-hand combat b/w Mellish and the SS trooper in the knife fight at the end of SPR...nasty! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Moore Posted October 19, 2002 Share Posted October 19, 2002 TSword, I have been playing CMBO (i.e. getting beat up by TacAI) for about 2 months and I must state that your post is the most succinct and informative tip I have read on infantry tactics! Thanks. p.s. anyone heard about the new "GI Combat" game from the close combat series developers? Is it just me or does it look like a copy of CM with real-time? The problem with close combat for me was that my reflexes were too slow to stop the AI from doing stupid things with my troops (anyone remember the 'dancing' tanks that would start rotating in from of enemy troops for no reason? ha ha). sorry, enough of my ranting... [steps down from soapbox] Originally posted by TSword: Justin, Welcome to the real thing ! CMBB is far, far ahead of the comic like Close Combat thing. In your example you waited to long to go in. What you have to do in an attack: 1. Close in to the enemy and locate him. 2. Suppress him 3. Go in and kill For 1. you need some recons, usually splitted squads are the most economical. As soon your recons stumble into opposition, have your second line (MG's, mortars, squads) ready to suppress it (2.) (Area fire works best) and then 3. Storm the enemy troops with some unfrightend squads. So far the theory, in practical application 3. may still become a disaster when there are other enemy units you haven't seen already. So before transition from 1. to 2. i usually recon the flanks and check whether the approaches are clean and use the time to bring up my heavy weapons like HMGs and mortars. If possible i try to install an additional flank threat. On recon my units (always splitted squads with the exception of a reserve squad always near the HQ) are almost always sneaking/hidden with the exception of the HQ-unit and when being surely out of LOS, thus i can manage to really close in to the enemy. In general this takes time so in case you play QBs give enough time. It's like creating a trap. This advice is true vs. AI. Against human opponents things become much more complicated if you're on the attack. Greets Daniel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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