icecreamsoldier Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 One time in a pbem quick battle, I purchased a King Tiger and after riding boldly into the breach - my commander was shot while riding up top unbuttoned. Since then I always manually button my tanks at all times because it doesn't appear to affect their LOS. Am I missing something here by not leaving armor unbuttoned at long ranges (or any range, for that matter)? Any feedback is appreciated. Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 You miss a lot of situational awareness. With the tank buttoned they'll rarely spot the ATGs or 'Zook teams shooting at them. They will also be slow in response to other threats. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 I think the effect is more subtle than just "worse". From observation (but not isolated measurement) it seems to be that vision to the front, up to a certain range is not affect very much. Vision to the sides and rear sucks. I think CMBO still has code in it that new targets at a wider range than whatever that threshold is are not spotted at all. If so, not a good feature, IMHO. Range shouldn't matter, angle and angle coverage/time should. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silvio Manuel Posted April 19, 2002 Share Posted April 19, 2002 Originally posted by icecreamsoldier: One time in a pbem quick battle, I purchased a King Tiger and after riding boldly into the breach - my commander was shot while riding up top unbuttoned. Since then I always manually button my tanks at all times because it doesn't appear to affect their LOS. Am I missing something here by not leaving armor unbuttoned at long ranges (or any range, for that matter)? Any feedback is appreciated. ThanksPossibly my favorite thing in CM is to play someone who always buttons up their tanks, when they haven't spotted my tanks yet. Its so easy to approach from a flank and gets tons of free shots of before the enemy tank spots you (if it EVER does, that is). If you can lure his tanks in close to "finish off" your infantry lure, he may button-up to protect against short-range small arms fire...then you spring the AT ambush. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
icecreamsoldier Posted April 20, 2002 Author Share Posted April 20, 2002 It never ceases to amaze me - the support that one can get from the cmbo community at large. Thanks for all the input. I think it was Marcus Aurelius who said the only thing more important than doing the right thing, is discovering when you are doing the wrong thing (or maybe it was Cpl. Himmelstoss from All Quiet on the Western front, I can't remember) BTW, what are peoples' strategies regarding when to manually button up - if ever? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted April 20, 2002 Share Posted April 20, 2002 Originally posted by icecreamsoldier: I think it was Marcus Aurelius...or maybe it was Cpl. Himmelstoss...Name dropper! BTW, what are peoples' strategies regarding when to manually button up - if ever?I button up any time I expect to receive small arms fire from within, say, 100 meters (although actually I don't like to let the buggers get that close anyway if I can help it). A barrage of anything no bigger than 81mm should send your TCs under the lid (anything larger than 81mm, not only should you button, you should energetically get the hell out of there). And it seems to help greatly to have plenty of friendly infantry around to assist with the spotting. Michael [ April 19, 2002, 08:42 PM: Message edited by: Michael emrys ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted April 20, 2002 Share Posted April 20, 2002 Originally posted by icecreamsoldier: BTW, what are peoples' strategies regarding when to manually button up - if ever?I have them closed pretty often. From my impression it is not a big disadvantage if you know all possible threat for the next turn offhand, which is usually the case in the second half of the game. Also note that things like Wasp and MMg carrier are better buttoned at any time, since they can't fire after being shocked. Likewise, M3 and M3A1 halftracks onlyfire when unbuttoned. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Auggy Posted April 28, 2002 Share Posted April 28, 2002 I use my HMG's to button-up tanks for a long range so when they get in close i can sneak up on them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cull Posted April 29, 2002 Share Posted April 29, 2002 I rarely button manually....it seems worth the risk to have the extra awareness. I do it mostly when I've manuevered into position and am ready to go directly into the attack, or into open space where I expect fire. I haven't had many TC losses at all considering how often I drive around with them exposed. Besides, they seem pretty good about diving for cover when necessary! I find myself unbuttoning manually a lot more often.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gredeker Posted April 29, 2002 Share Posted April 29, 2002 I button up when armor gets within 150-200m of suspected enemy infantry positions. If it's long range, always keep them unbuttoned unless you're being targetted by arty. The decision is also affected by the tank in question - e.g., I'm more likely to keep Shermans unbuttoned, because then the AA .50 MG can add its lead to the festivities. Also, don't forget that the SPW 251/1 can still fire its MG while buttoned - in this case "buttoned" means fully using the gun shield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts