Scipio Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 That's something I have seen in a current battle. I give an artillery order with LOS, the shells come down far away from the sheduled target. Well, **** happens. I give a correction order, and after the delay, the shells fall again to same wrong target zone. I just wonder - is it a bug, or is sheduled that way? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robohn Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Isn't it part of a Forward Observers job to correct for artillery when it comes down off target? If the FO has LOS to the target, then shouldn't he start giving corrections without you having to tell him too? Robohn Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted November 24, 2002 Author Share Posted November 24, 2002 Well, that's what I think, but it doesn't seem to work that way? :confused: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 There were several threads on the issue. Apparently this is a feature (the being off at first), but it appears to be broken in that the adjustment is ignored. No word from BFC yet as far as I know. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted November 24, 2002 Share Posted November 24, 2002 Scipio, are there any spotting rounds before the FFE? Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted November 26, 2002 Author Share Posted November 26, 2002 Originally posted by Michael emrys: Scipio, are there any spotting rounds before the FFE? MichaelWell, I think so, but in the heat of the battle and because they were so far of target I have not seen them - I just heard a single artillery round coming down. Indeed I already had problems to locate the main barrage because it was so far of target. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Posted November 26, 2002 Share Posted November 26, 2002 There are certainly spotting rounds fired - 1 or 2 before each FFE - you can normally see them land and if they happen to hit soemthing then that's good too. What's a correction order for artilery in CM? You have a line to hte target or you don't. Has your observer been forced to lose his LOS by fire or otehr distraction? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted November 26, 2002 Author Share Posted November 26, 2002 Originally posted by Mike: There are certainly spotting rounds fired - 1 or 2 before each FFE - you can normally see them land and if they happen to hit soemthing then that's good too. What's a correction order for artilery in CM? You have a line to hte target or you don't. Has your observer been forced to lose his LOS by fire or otehr distraction?No, the FO did not change his position, and his LOS was not blocked by smoke or dust or whatever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted November 28, 2002 Author Share Posted November 28, 2002 I guess the question is still not answered, so : *BUMP* Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrold Posted November 28, 2002 Share Posted November 28, 2002 Artillery is just like a proper holiday frame of mind: 'Tis better to give than to receive' BDH Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted November 28, 2002 Share Posted November 28, 2002 Scipio, Mike E, Red, & BFC Guys, Twice recently, I have had "spotted" BB arty barrrages fall 200 meters or so off target. Of course, both times, the arty landed on my guys :eek: . Out of the the whole universe of possibilities, my arty scoured the whole map and sought out with incredible efficiency their poor, unfortunate, fellow foot sloggers brothers. Fortunately, the arty was 81 mm mortars so the damamge was not too great to my guys. I would have been less happy if the arty had been 105s or above. Indeed, except for smoke, I always use "spotted" arty barrages. To me, one wastes arty when it is fired unspotted in BB or BO. I too would like BFC give us a reply as to how to correct errant "spotted" BB arty barrages. I don't really care about unspotted barrages (although an answer for this would be OK) since I don't use them :confused: To make it easier for BFC, here are some of the most probable scenarios. The turn after one has a spotted BB arty barrage go awry: (1) One should not move the aiming point; the FO, within the BB system dynamics, will automatically adjust the impact point. The FO sees that the shells are not landing properly and gets the gunners to correct. (2) One should move the aiming point a small amount; this imparts a less than long pause in the barrage & allows the gunners to adjust the impact point to where it should properly be. Within the BB system, the small impact point adjustment corrects the improper fall. Once again, The FO sees that the shells are not landing properly and gets the gunners to correct. (3) One should cancel the barrage completely & completely restart the targeting process with the long, long targeting delay; the BB internal system does not allow impact point corrections without a whole new targeting process. The FO sees the shells falling improperly or at least not where they should. The FO says, "holy cow" or some similar more colorful four letter epithet; he assumes that everything is FUBB [xxxxxx xx beyond belief ] 'and' FUBAR, that his gunners are imcompetent, and that he will be called upon the carpet for having a barrage whack his own men; the FO figures the only way to get it right is to start from scratch. :eek: (4) Other; please explain what to do & why. BFC guys, thanks in advance for your most kind attention. We await with bated and somewhat baited (those fishy smells are quite noxious) breath. Cheers, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Excellent post, Richard. A model of how a question should be put to BFC. Let's hope that after the holiday stuffing (of the people, not the turkey! ) is done, they will be so good as to acknowledge it in some way. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kanonier Reichmann Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 I agree. I tied to ask a question in a similar vein not long ago but obviously it was not clear enough. Hopefully we'll get some sort of resolution to this vexing question. Regards Jim R. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neutral Party Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Steve did briefly comment on this issue. Joe Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Mike E, Thanks for the compliment. I try. I guess my many hours of enjoyment and study of BB & BO, plus three years of law school have some outward beneficial effects, ... maybe. Guys, Additional update on bad falling spotted arty. In one of the previously mention games the spotted Ruskie 82 mm FO's barrage went about 150 meters awry (I said 200 meters earlier; I was wrong; I counted this time.) & of course upon a platoon of my guys. Not much damage done even to my bombarded infantry platoon because the barrage was puny 82s, and it was only about 20 seconds of shells. Life is good. During the planning phase for the next turn, the earnstwhile 'crack', yes crack FO moved the aiming point about 30 meters. Of course, the FO can see the aiming point with those good Boschenlomb binoculars bought prior to the war. Hey, a little adjustment might make those 82 gunners turn those cranks and get the barrage to land on target for a change. Well, the next turn arrives, and about 25 seconds later the barrage begins. With that bated breath, the FO watches, hopes, crosses his fingers, knocks on wood, and prays to the big guy upstairs. "Help our brothers from the heart of Old Mother Russia." Well, after all that hopeful anticipation, the barrage lands ... about 180 meters off target. :eek: Fortunately, the barrage landed not upon that stalwart Russian platoon, but upon what is probably an empty patch of woods behind the German lines. Moral to story, it seems that when a spotted barrage is off target, a slight 30 meter spotted readjustment of the aiming point may not (or will not) cause the barrage land on target. This implies that a negative answer is provided to #2 and probably #1 in my earlier post. In this battle, the weather is overcast, wet, still, and hot in southern Russia in October 42. (Hot in south Russia in October! Is this Tahiti? Hey, it is hardly even hot in New Orleans in October.) Also, of interesting coincidence, the first turn of barrage had a 150 meter spotted LOS to the aiming point, and the center of the landing point seemed about 150 meters off target. The second turn of barrage had a 180 meter spotted LOS to the aiming point, and the center of the landing point seemed about 180 meters off target. What does this mean? The karma of the universe is symetric? Coincidence is rampant? I need glasses? The answer is that I don't know. BFC, we await your reply. Enlighten us. Cheers, Richard [ November 28, 2002, 10:27 PM: Message edited by: PiggDogg ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mike Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Originally posted by Neutral Party: Steve did briefly comment on this issue. JoeNote that Steve asked for save game files showing the error 'cos they hadn't seen it at BFC - so if you've got some perhaps you should send them to him. ciao Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Mike (without an E or D) , Thanks for the advice. I'm gonna do that. In fact, where is Mike D and JasonC in this discussion?????? :confused: Cheers, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Originally posted by PiggDogg: Also, of interesting coincidence, the first turn of barrage had a 150 meter spotted LOS to the aiming point, and the center of the landing point seemed about 150 meters off target. The second turn of barrage had a 180 meter spotted LOS to the aiming point, and the center of the landing point seemed about 180 meters off target.Hmm. Curious. Most likely just coincidence, but people should make a note to watch for that and if it continues to occur, be sure to send a saved turn to BFC with an explanatory note. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PiggDogg Posted November 29, 2002 Share Posted November 29, 2002 Mike E, Good to see ya. Now where is JasonC? :confused: Cheers, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scipio Posted November 29, 2002 Author Share Posted November 29, 2002 Originally posted by Mike: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Neutral Party: Steve did briefly comment on this issue. JoeNote that Steve asked for save game files showing the error 'cos they hadn't seen it at BFC - so if you've got some perhaps you should send them to him. ciao Mike</font> Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted November 30, 2002 Share Posted November 30, 2002 Originally posted by PiggDogg: Now where is JasonC?Good question. One I started asking last week. Speculation is that he has been too caught up in Real Life (shudder) to drop by. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts