gravburg Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Longtime lurker here. I've just finished playing the two CMAK demo scenarios and encountered some troubling tank movements. * * *SPOILER WARNING * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * In Line of Defense I was playing the Germans and had my Tiger up near the Church when I spotted his tank destroyers arriving on the scene. My Tiger was at the fork in the road near the church and I gave it orders to reverse back down the road and then rotate towards the tank destroyers after it got back behind the woods some. Instead, next turn it turned sideways, and started racing parallel to the tank destroyers. It was then hammered by the TDs and killed. Before that point the tank commander had buttoned up but was not killed, the morale was fine, and it was not shocked. In the other battle ( Fruhlingswind ) my german panzers were racing around the berm on the opposite side of the oasis. They were ordered to turn the corner using the hill as cover and then turn to their right and head towards the mosque and hunt towards the sides of the Grants. A couple of them were given orders to rotate towards the Grants and start firing immediately. What happened was one of the tanks raced around the berm, turned the corner and then turned its rear to the Grants and started racing towards the side of the map. The next turn it got killed before it had a chance to rotate back towards the battle. The tank commander was buttoned up, but morale was good and it was not shocked. I can probably dig out the game files if needed, but has anyone else encountered this? I think I have seen this once in all my CMBO and CMBB experience, but I have ran into it in two of my three CMAK battles. [ December 08, 2003, 02:33 PM: Message edited by: gravburg ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ant Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 That's wierd. I've been playing CMAK for a week now and haven't seen anything like this.....until last night when I was playing 'tigers and 2 pounders' One of my M3s decided it was going to go for a little drive in the woods for no reason whatsoever. I wondered what the heck was going on but just reissued an order and it ws OK after that so I forgot about it. Your post just reminded me. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Crowley Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Similar experience in Fruhlingswind demo. My PBEM oppo had a PzK111 climb a ridgeline and drive parallel to the US position. It didn't last long. In the same game, I had a Grant, nicely hull-down to it's target, suddenly move forward unbidden, until it was totally exposed to some Pzk111s on its flank. It too rapidly expired. A tad frustrating and also not experienced at all in CMBB. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tacitus Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 I`ve noticed that after giving "shoot n scoot" orders with a delay in between the pause is ignored.Is this deliberate?Also in normal shoot n scoot the time spent stationary is far too short.They hardly have time to locate targets before the reverse. Also,do you find the "seek hull down" order to be effective ? They were trained Marder crews. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 The initial post requires a spoiler warning, please include one. In CMBB and CMAK I see tanks take off towards the enemy or go in backwards reasonable often, I just got used to it. In my opinion, CM would be a better, more realistic, game if 2/3rds or so of all these automatically ordered TacAI movement orders would just be replaced by nothing, that means don't change or on unexpected heavy fire just stop and keep the head down (like TacOps does). I don't say it is realistic to go on or stop than to evade. But the evasion code in CM is often so bad that it makes realism even worse than they would be without it. There are limits to the intelligence of the TacAI and in doubt it should not be allowed to take over. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
James Crowley Posted December 8, 2003 Share Posted December 8, 2003 Originally posted by redwolf: The initial post requires a spoiler warning, please include one. In CMBB and CMAK I see tanks take off towards the enemy or go in backwards reasonable often, I just got used to it. In my opinion, CM would be a better, more realistic, game if 2/3rds or so of all these automatically ordered TacAI movement orders would just be replaced by nothing, that means don't change or on unexpected heavy fire just stop and keep the head down (like TacOps does). I don't say it is realistic to go on or stop than to evade. But the evasion code in CM is often so bad that it makes realism even worse than they would be without it. There are limits to the intelligence of the TacAI and in doubt it should not be allowed to take over. Hear,hear. Would stop infantry from climbing out of perfectly good holes and getting cut down in the open and tanks from taking silly strolls. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UberFunBunny Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 Originally posted by James Crowley: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by redwolf: The initial post requires a spoiler warning, please include one. In CMBB and CMAK I see tanks take off towards the enemy or go in backwards reasonable often, I just got used to it. In my opinion, CM would be a better, more realistic, game if 2/3rds or so of all these automatically ordered TacAI movement orders would just be replaced by nothing, that means don't change or on unexpected heavy fire just stop and keep the head down (like TacOps does). I don't say it is realistic to go on or stop than to evade. But the evasion code in CM is often so bad that it makes realism even worse than they would be without it. There are limits to the intelligence of the TacAI and in doubt it should not be allowed to take over. Hear,hear. Would stop infantry from climbing out of perfectly good holes and getting cut down in the open and tanks from taking silly strolls. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted December 9, 2003 Share Posted December 9, 2003 Originally posted by Tacitus: I`ve noticed that after giving "shoot n scoot" orders with a delay in between the pause is ignored.Is this deliberate?Yes. Any player-applied pause is always acted on at the beginning of the following action phase. Also in normal shoot n scoot the time spent stationary is far too short.They hardly have time to locate targets before the reverse.What do you mean? Can you give a typical pause length? I was noticing in Line of Defense that a veteran Stuart seemed to be taking an inordinate amount of time in the middle of its move, so I timed it. It turned out to be over 20 seconds, which is quite a long time to be exposed to return fire. So how long are your tanks pausing? If they aren't finding targets, maybe you should give them some help. Use Covered Arc or Armor Arc to get them to concentrate on the area where they will find targets. They will also spot better if they are unbuttoned. Also,do you find the "seek hull down" order to be effective ?I don't know, I never use it, preferring to eyeball my own hulldown positions. Others have reported problems with it, however. Mostly it seems that vehicles are apt to continue movement toward the indicated point that you want them to be hull down to, rather than stopping. They were trained Marder crews. What's that supposed to mean? I assume all crews in the game have received some degree of training. Michael [ December 08, 2003, 05:14 PM: Message edited by: Michael Emrys ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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