Jack Ryan Posted August 30, 2003 Share Posted August 30, 2003 A question about the german airborne on the eastern front. Did there germans use the airborne in any large scale attacks on the east front? Did the germans use gliders? Thanks for any help edit to add these question: In game there are tanks, armoured cars etc all which can be used for the airborne. But will they have been able to use any of these in combat ... like a combat jump ... armoured cars etc in gliders prehaps? Did the german airborne do day or night drops, or did they drop in both? [ August 30, 2003, 07:39 AM: Message edited by: Jack Ryan ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zukkov Posted August 30, 2003 Share Posted August 30, 2003 i don't think the germans did many actual airborn drops in the war. they did have a somewhat elite status, but basically they were used as regular infantry. wasn't crete their last large scale drop? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 30, 2003 Share Posted August 30, 2003 Yes, and the staggering losses there made Hitler think the Fallschirmjäger were no good (a big factor was poor planning of the invasion, so it gave a wrong picture of the arm, really). I doubt they had even recovered enough by Operation Barbarossa, and after Stalingrad I don't think they had a lot of chances (being on defense, having lost the air superiority and having a chronic lack of divisions to strengthen the lines). Would some of the grogs think that German paratroops could have made a difference at Zitadelle? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IntelWeenie Posted August 30, 2003 Share Posted August 30, 2003 Originally posted by Jack Ryan: Did the germans use gliders? Thanks for any help edit to add these question: In game there are tanks, armoured cars etc all which can be used for the airborne. But will they have been able to use any of these in combat ... like a combat jump ... armoured cars etc in gliders prehaps?The Germans used many types of gliders and developed them until the end of the war. There were even a couple designs (Junkers Ju322 Mammut and Messerschmitt Me321 Gigant) that could carry a tank. In addition to using the various types for glider-borne assault, they were also used for things like carrying supplies to encircled troops. AFAIK, the Mammut never got past prototype and the Gigant was never used operationally in an assault. The Gigant design was later modified to have 6 engines and used as a regular transport. The Fallshirmjaeger units were used quite often as regular infantry on all fronts, so armor could be allocated to support them like any other unit. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Ryan Posted August 30, 2003 Author Share Posted August 30, 2003 ok thanks all 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavlov Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 I don't know about the East Front but the Germans did launch an airborne (parachute) assault during the Ardennes Offensive. It was very dismal. Led by Colonel Von der Heydte, they jumped a day late with maybe 1,200 men. They did not achieve any significant objectives and were never relieved as planned. Only about 300 were ever regrouped after the jump, and they were surrounded by the Americans in a wooded area. Eventually they tried to make their way back to german lines in groups of three. Only about 100 men made it. Von der Heydte gave himself up to the Americans at Monschau. Addendum: That was a night drop by the way flown by many inexperienced pilots which accounts for why they were so scattered. Most of them never had a chance to reach their designated redezvous points on the Hautes Fagnes. [ August 30, 2003, 09:31 PM: Message edited by: pavlov ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pavlov Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Originally posted by Sergei: Would some of the grogs think that German paratroops could have made a difference at Zitadelle? IMHO, no. The Soviet defenses in that battle were very deep, multiple lines going back for many miles; the defenses were well prepared; and the scale of the battle was such that the numbers of paratroopers the germans could insert would probably have been insignificant. Part of the reason for this situation is that the Soviets knew the attack was coming. It was an obvious strategy to cut off the salient, Hitler kept postponing Zitadelle giving the Soviets time to build up and dig in, and, additionally, the Soviets had high level espionage that basically gave them the plan and the exact date of the offensive. In fact the Soviets launched bombing raids of German airfields the morning of the planned offensive in order to spoil the Luftwaffe's attack. Although the Soviet bombing raids were not altogether successful, they would likely have disrupted an airborne mission from the German side. In any case, Goring had so mismanaged things by that point it is doubtful they had the resouces to launch a sizeable assault. My 3 cents. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berlichtingen Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 The Fallschirmjäger made several combat jumps after Crete. The largest, probably, being Leros in 1943. Some combat jumps were made in Russia, all of regimental or lower size (but well withing the scope of CMBB. One of the main reasons for combat jumps in the east was to reinforce encircled units, which was done more than once. If you are making a scenario that assumes they jumped in (jumping was also used for rapid deployment and not just combat), then no vehicles of any kind should be included. Heavy weapons would be recoiless artillery (7.5 & 10.5cm), mortars, MGs, light AT (3.7cm most likely, but definitely NOT 7.5cm PaKs) and light AA (2cm). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hellfish Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 What are some good books about later-war German paradrops? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack Ryan Posted August 31, 2003 Author Share Posted August 31, 2003 Originally posted by Berlichtingen: but definitely NOT 7.5cm PaKs). i wasnt planing on that lol [ August 31, 2003, 04:50 AM: Message edited by: Jack Ryan ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Originally posted by Jack Ryan: Did the german airborne do day or night drops, or did they drop in both? The invasion of Crete, Operation Merkur, was began at dawn, as did most Allied Airbourne operations later in the war. The normal practise was dictated by the risk of injuries on landing and reorganizing after the drop, which both would have been more difficult in complete darkness. On the other hand, darkness would have protected the parachutists better. I remember stories of both Merkur and Market Garden, where the defenders, after realising what was happening, started firing with small arms at the human clay pigeons. I'm sure some crapped their pants! There are many sites on battle of Crete, worthwile checking out especially when it's going to be featured in CMAK. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 This photo is quite illustrative of the situation: 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
K_Tiger Posted August 31, 2003 Share Posted August 31, 2003 Wasn`t the norm to carry stuff around...but take this: PAK40+PzII 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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