russian cavalry

[dog of war]

in the game they always go in to battle on foot .

in real life did they not go in to battle on horseback or did they dismount and leave their horses to the rear

[stoat]

I'm sure there were some battles where they engaged the enemy on horseback, but I doubt that these were planned, set-piece battles. Cavalry was used mainly to do recon probes, or to pour through and exploit breaches in the line.

I can see them attacking rear area units like field ktchens, hospitals, and even artillery batteries on horseback, but I don't think that horse vs tank Polish-style battles were common at all.

If the Russians charged anyone on horseback, it would probably be the forces of Romania, Bulgaria, Hungary, or Italy, basically those that were more pooly armed than the Germans, and had fewer heavy weapons and armor.

The reason they always go into battle on foot in the game is that it is quite hard to model horses in the abstract, and it's the same reason you don't see motorcycle troops.

[General Bolt]

WWI proved cavalry attacks were suicide. The Russians knew this too.

[JasonC]

The main use of cavalry was for operational mobility, particularly in winter and in wooded areas with little road net. Swampy areas freeze and become passable, but don't have any roads, for example.

Tactically they usually fought on foot. There were a few exceptions (mostly raids), but set piece attacks by cavalry against anybody who knew they were coming were suicidal.

[Fußball]

Originally posted by stoat:

horse vs tank Polish-style battles were common at all.

Excuse me if you meant only sarcasm. But the Poles never rushed men on horseback towards enemy tanks. The Poles were not stupid either and realized that would be unethical and result in complete failure. If anything of this sort really did happen its never been truly reported and was out of sheer disregard of ones life or a factor of stupidity on someone's part.

Tschüß!

Erich

[stoat]

I mentioned it becuase it is a fairly common statement. It is meant to illustrate differences in material and weapons more than tactics, but in this occasion it served my purpose and I used it.

[stoat]

If I remember correctly, the notion of Polish cavalry charges against German tanks was initiated by the Italian press, and then the Germans seized on it for propaganda.

The Polish army was certainly not that backward in 1939, and their main drawback was their lack of modern weaponry. This is a big if, but I would like to know what kind of show the Poles could have made of it had they had enough modern weapons. Their army was fairly large and their dedication would have made it a bloody affair for the Germans.

[Fußball]

My apologies for the misconception. Many soldiers fighting against the Polish, notably the driver of a PzII showed disgust at this falsehood. He stated that the Poles never did such a thing, at least from his experience.

Tschüß!

Erich

[stoat]

Originally posted by Fußball:

My apologies for the misconception.

Not at all. It does read that way, doesn't it?

[Fußball]

Ja at first. But now that I notice it it could go either way.

Tschüß!

Erich

[imported_KG_ThorsHammer]

I remember reading an account somewhere of A german infantryman. A mass of Russian cavalry was riding over their positions. There were but a handful of German tanks spread out, with a few grenadiers huddled close to each of them, with this sea of cavalry flowing all around them. The sight left him awestruck as he hadnt seen something like that in a long time. I dont know if this was an accidental engagement or planned.

Attacking fixed positions with cavalry would be obviously suicidal, but the Russians made extensive use of cavalry for mobile operations, and were of course not shy about taking casualties.

[stoat]

Originally posted by KG_ThorsHammer:

and were of course not shy about taking casualties.

Especially when the cavalry was a Cossack unit. Stalin could eliminate military and social enemies at the same time.

[chiavarm]

The report I read, which was later was found to be incorrect, was that the Polish Army had known the Germans used canvas covered cars to simulate tanks during maneuvers, Therefore the Polish Calvary charged these units thinking they were mere mocked up vehicles. I also read that captured soldiers punched the armor of the German tanks to see for themselves if it was the real think.

Again, I later read that these reports were false.

[rum]

Originally posted by stoat:

but I don't think that horse vs tank Polish-style battles were common at all.

This is a very widespread myth. One should think german memoires and all the "Wehrmacht fetishists" who do blindly believe to memoires.

In real life, cavalry were fighting dismounted.

Horses were used for marches and to tow artillery and ammo and supply. Before the battle, cavalrymen were dismounted, and where were a special person (one per 5 or 6) who had to take care about horsed during fight.

The accident with mounted polish cavalry vs tanks was in real life some like this:

Poles spotted german infantry on the rest. Commander decided to charge mounted attack onto unawared infantry. Poles started the attack, wrecking havoc and killing with firearms and sabres, while germans tryed to run for cover, cought by surprize. Suddently, two german armored cars, previously hidded in the trees, rolled out and opened MG fire. The picture has changed - now polish horsemen were running and dieing under fire.