Robert Olesen Posted January 6, 2004 Author Share Posted January 6, 2004 Here is the last beta (2.00e) before version 2 proper, if things go as expected. The main changes from 2.00c are: Error correction: The briefing for your own force would show the axis fitness setting even if you're allied. Change: Retreat battle changed to Relief, which is about passing a number of supply trucks through the enemy lines to a surrounded force. The last change is a bit of a gamble. It simplifies the rules a great deal, but may or may not be a good change. But, as I said, if it goes well this version should form the basis for version 2, and thus for the CMAK conversion. Let me hear what you think. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 7, 2004 Author Share Posted January 7, 2004 I'm in doubt, and would very much appreciate soem feedback. Should Retreat battles be kept? In addition to Relief battles, that is. Are they at all interesting in CMAK? They are no doubt relevant on the East Front, but they have some serious weaknesses: - They can potentially cripple your core force, if you're unlucky (but then, we're not whimps, are we ) - It's difficult to get accurate kill information for the units that move off the map - Bookkeeping is troublesome - It's difficult to handle guns, mortars and some vehicles, as you can't voluntarily abandon equipment. But they are fun in some cases and add variety. I can still re-add them, I have the necessary rules and spreadsheet available. Their frequency would go down compared to version 1, as Relief battles will take some of the previous Retreats. Let me have your votes 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Rob, I just got finished with a Retreat...settting on Hard. 1500 pt. all Infantry support with my core force of Tanks and infantry. Luckily, I had Regulars for support force and not conscripts. As it was, I had to take a batallion/battallion/battalion of infantry and more to meet the points criteria. I got everyone off the map (mostly), but like you say, the biggest problem was bookkeeping. When I looked at the battle at the end, I took out my new clean 100 page notepad and was going to fill it up with the data, but decided that playing the game was more fun than wasting ink and paper and chucked the whole game and just made it a non-battle, moving on to the next. I think you know which column my vote goes under. A VERY VERY small thing. Check the spelling of Temperature on the Setup sheet. Been that way for a long time now and I just caught it myself. Am getting VERY VERY large Favor values. On average, 200 pts per game. This is on settings of Hard and Gruesome. Also, an interesting result. I totally descimated the enemy. Killed all but 10 of the German rascals, took all the flags, had very few losses. Ended up with a -1 Favor for the battle and a loss. I know you need all the specific settings to make a determintation, but I don't remember them all. I guess what I'm basically saying is that Favor seems to be totally out of whack (from what I expect for Favor gain/loss). What are basic Favor awards for battles at different settings of difficulty? Do you have a chart or anything that shows what you would expect at different difficulty levels? jt jt 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 John (JAT), I'm amazed at your ability to extract wins under hard conditions. Anyway, I really need a spreadsheet (or several, perhaps) to give a qualified comment on those Favor values. Do you have some you can send me? Perhaps some endgame saves as well, though I expect they hit the trash can long ago. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 Version 2.00e gave the German winter modifiers for replacements to the Soviets as well. That has been corrected. As well as a small typo. Get it here: http://www.roqc.cdgroup.org/files/ROQC_Sheets_2_00f.zip 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Rob, I'm still using my 3meg spread sheets, tho, the favor calculations (as are all calculations) are yours. I only copy the answer in O29. Which brings me to ask you a question if you ever got to take a look at any of the clipboards that are in my copy? Since you couldn't get past the C-Clipboard, I don't think you were able to utilize or even look at the rest. I've merged Transfers and Upgrades together and it's working quite nicely. I'm not upgrading like your rules say because Favor is so abundant. I just buy all new equipment. In fact, this last upgrade, since I had a platoon of 5 T-34 (1941) and upgraded to two platoons of KV-I (1941), I would have gotten back 58 Favor. So, I just left the 5 tanks on the battlefield and bought new ones and still have 800pts. I'm on my 9th battle now and have gotten 2 Promotions. Did you get to see the Add Units Clipboard? The Briefing Clipboard? Or the Requisition clipboard? I really like how I don't have to mess with Point Cost or Point Value any more and can just click a button and my core force just appears - all filled in with PC/PV and updated after each battle automatically. I've just added a Promotion Clipboard, but it's not quite ready yet. German side is done, Soviet and all the rest will take some research to do. Alas, no one offered to test out my spreadsheets so I'm just going to keep them for myself. I have been teasing with the idea of making some of the clipboards stand-alone so that they will slide into your package...use or not. Also, I've tested my spreadsheets on several different computers with different Excels. A laptop with the files on a CD, one with Office 97 and Windows 98, and 2 with XP with the latest Office and they all worked first time every time. I don't know what to say why it doesn't work on yours. Anyway, I'll see what I can do to get you some data that you can use without sending the entire 3megs. Maybe just copy the data over to a blank sheet and send that. I too am amazed that you are amazed that I've produced wins. They are really pretty easy. Not the battles per se, but it really doesn't take to much to produce a win at settings of hard and grueling. It's quite free with allowing victory. At first, I didn't follow the Computer Bonus (1st two games), but then I started doing it and really haven't noticed too much of a difference. Just have to use more bullets. I guess maybe why it might be so easy is that I have tanks and infantry in my core force. A platoon of T-34s (5) and a company of Pioneers. Pioneers suck at any distance over 50m and don't do that well close up either. They are best when throwing their bombs. Which, I've noticed that CMAK tends to allow freer use of them than CMBB. I only have the demo of CMAK, but those guys stand up and throw their bombs like nobodys buisness and right away too. If and when I do get CMAK, and if they act like they do in the demo, it's going to be a lot of fun with Pioneers or whatever the equivalent is...Engineers for the Americans. Some of the wins I got were due to bad weather, namely thick snow. The AI just can't move into flag position very well. I really wish there was a way to lengthen the game while in game cause if the AI is attacking in thick snow, I would up the turns dramatically...to give me a chance to kill them close, but they just never seem to get close enough. I also up the number of turns if it's too low. I can't stand the way CM limits a battle. It may be the way the have to do it to make their game work, but it sure is a sucky way of doing it. Very bad programming decision IMO. One thing that I've always used but never could effectively was walls. CMAK seems to have fixed that. Too bad they won't go back to BO and BB and put in that coding. I failed to pay my phone bill again, so I do expect that since Friday, Sat, Sun and quite possibly Monday are holidays, and it will be turned off tomorrow, I won't be getting my phone turned back on until probably Tuesday % 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JAT Posted January 8, 2004 Share Posted January 8, 2004 Double Post 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 8, 2004 Author Share Posted January 8, 2004 No, those clipboards don't ring a bell. I have no clue why it doesn't work on my PC, but you could try sending the latest version, if you manage that before the phone is cut off. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Cold in Alex Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Hey Robert - thanks for the previous clarifications, here's another question for you. I've just finished game 4 with my cossacks, the jerries surrendered ending the game, when I brought up the T34s to the victory flags . The surrendered points values obviously count as favour when the AAR results are fed into the spreadsheet. But do the prisoners also count for core force experience as per inflicted casualties? If so how do I determine which prisioners surrendered to which of my units. NB in this game most of the POWs surrendered close to the tanks or the butch Guards SMG squads rather than my cossacks. Maybe they thought they would have a greater chance of surviving captivity? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 9, 2004 Author Share Posted January 9, 2004 Originally posted by Ice Cold in Alex: Hey Robert - thanks for the previous clarifications, here's another question for you. The surrendered points values obviously count as favour when the AAR results are fed into the spreadsheet. But do the prisoners also count for core force experience as per inflicted casualties? If so how do I determine which prisioners surrendered to which of my units. Hi ICiA (what does that alias mean :confused: ) The number of captured and casualties caused by a unit should show up on the kills page of the unit info screen that you get when you select the unit and hit Enter. Just sum the captured and casualties (you don't get more for captured then casualties when calculating experience gain) and write the total into the core force sheet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joachim Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Originally posted by Robert Olesen: </font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by Ice Cold in Alex: Hey Robert - thanks for the previous clarifications, here's another question for you. The surrendered points values obviously count as favour when the AAR results are fed into the spreadsheet. But do the prisoners also count for core force experience as per inflicted casualties? If so how do I determine which prisioners surrendered to which of my units. Hi ICiA (what does that alias mean :confused: ) The number of captured and casualties caused by a unit should show up on the kills page of the unit info screen that you get when you select the unit and hit Enter. Just sum the captured and casualties (you don't get more for captured then casualties when calculating experience gain) and write the total into the core force sheet. </font> 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Great work Robert There is a problem when I try to upgrade to version 2.00f, when i try to paste my rank in the new sheet, I'm told that the cell is protected, if I instead of pasting it from the old sheet, just copy it from the buttons on the right, I'm told the same. If I turn of the protection and paste the rank, then it says "-4" in the cell and it loses the dotted line. Do you know what the problem could be? Christian 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ice Cold in Alex Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Joachim, yeah that's where I am at auto-surrender is not credited. I thought about assigning it to the HQ, but that's an awful lot of points , and anyway the support force CO outranked my core force CO. Ice Cold In Alex is a classic British war film from late fifties set in the Libyan desert, about escaping from Tobruk in an ambulance. The captain played by John Mills is a drunk and dreams of drinking a beer in Alexandria that's "so ruddy cold there's a sort of dew on the outside of the glass". The director went on to make Guns of Navarone. http://www.britmovie.co.uk/genres/drama/filmography/032.html http://www.open2.net/science/hollywood_science/ice.htm I thought it would make good handle when I sweep the CM world with my superlative CMAK play. Unfortunately (?) I'm still playing CMBB, and will be for some time thanks to ROQC. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 9, 2004 Author Share Posted January 9, 2004 sepruda, I don't have that problem in my own copy. My best guess is that yiu have pasted something into the cell directly, instead of using Paste Special > Value. Can you send me the sheet? You might try using a fresh copy, otr pasting the complete cell (not just the value) from the original first. Joachim and ACiA, I understand your problem, but I don't have the time and energy to come up with a good solution now. My best shot for now is to simply ignore those prisoners for experience calcualtion. Tough luck. You get a fair amount of Favor from then anyway In fact, that may be the final solution (oops). It isn't all that unfair. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 I tried again with a new copy, this time I was able to enter the rank manually. The same problem occured when I had to transfer my core force data, it seems that whenever I want to copy more than one column at a time I get this message. Anyway I just typed the whole thing in manually, so now my brave platoon of PzIIIJ are ready for some more action. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 9, 2004 Share Posted January 9, 2004 Hello again, another issue. I've finished my first battle in the new version, and am about to update the core force sheet, there's three new columns "availability for current battle". What do you type in here, it doesn't seem to be covered in the new manual? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 10, 2004 Author Share Posted January 10, 2004 Originally posted by sepruda: Hello again, another issue. I've finished my first battle in the new version, and am about to update the core force sheet, there's three new columns "availability for current battle". What do you type in here, it doesn't seem to be covered in the new manual? I assume you're talking about the columns labelled 3, 4 and 5 in the core force sheet. Read section 3.7.6 in the rules There are two possibilities: 1. You use the automatic generation of the spreadsheet for the next battle, in which case they should be filled out automatically. 2. You are updating to a new version, in which case you need to fill them out yourself. Check the example - that's probably the best way to see how it's done, apart from reading that section I mentioned above If it's 1. and it doesn't work, then please send me the spreadsheet - preferably both the one from the previous battle that you used to generate the new one and the new one for the next battle. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 10, 2004 Share Posted January 10, 2004 I've got it, thanks. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 Ok next silly quiestion. If this is in the manual, you can call me whatever you like. I had a tough battle with my PzIIIJ's (they met about half a dozen of KV-1's), the endresult was that two were KO, two abandoned, two crews captured and two crews fled of the map. One tank I manage to salvage, the others are replace. I have two men left, and get 5 replacements. Obiusly I fill up the HQ tank, and add the last replacement to my 4 tank, who's now got two men. As I finished the next battle with just my HQ tank, I roll for replacements again - none - and the spreadsheet states that I don't need any replacements in the control sheet. Also I try to calculate through the die modifier, and it doesn't seem to add up. I've tried this in two or three battles more, so I guess either Im making a mistake somewhere, or theres a bug. I've got 4 tanks, but only the crew to fill one, rats! Also the two men I've got in my fourth tank, gets experience for surviving after each battle, although they're not participating. I know I ask alot of questions, this campaign is just so addictive and fun, and I wan't it to work perfectly. Christian 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 Funny...I always figure out the answer just after I've posted. I'm not supposed to change the men in unit column, column 0, in the core force sheet am I? I've tried setting it back to 5, and roll the dice again, and I've got 7 replacements. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 sepruda, your questions are fine, keep 'em coming. I think you got a bug or two. I really need to see that spreadsheet to see if you did something wrong or if there is a bug. Even if you are the "culprit", that's useful info to help me prevent others doing the same. The men in unit column (which is labelled 1, not 0) should not be changed unless you change the unit itself. It shows how many men there are in the unit according to the TO&E, not how many there are currently. Column 3 does that. That probably explains why you don't get replacements. I don't know why the men who don't participate gets experience for surviving the battle. they shouldn't, and my spreadsheet looks fine. Please send me yours. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sepruda Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 I understand now that column 1 is for the TO&E not for the current status, and it worked just fine when I changed it back to 5. I've send two spreadsheets two you. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 13, 2004 Author Share Posted January 13, 2004 I wanted to share this as some of you may be inclined to try it and the changes are quite important. But you should know that I haven't had time to test it very much. I plan to do that asap. 1. I decided to reimplement Retreat battles. It was simply a shame to let all that good work go to waste. But their rate of appearance has been reduced a good deal. 2. I implemented Raid battles. A Raid is a local attack with the purpose of achieving a specific objective, followed by a withdrawal to the original frontline. To get more info about Raids, read sections 4.2.1, 4.3.5, 4.4 and 5.2.9 in the rules. There are eight raid types/targets: · Regimental Command Your intelligence has located a Regimental command post in a Manor house close to the front line. You are to raid the post, gather as much information as possible and return with as few casualties as possible. · Command Pillbox Your intelligence has located a Battalion command post in a bunker close to the front line. You are to raid the bunker, gather as much information as possible, destroy the bunker and return with as few casualties as possible. · Mortar / Gun Battery A battery of mortars / howitzers positioned fairly close to the front line have been harassing us for some time. AA guns protect them, and in any case we don?t have enough aircraft to spare for such a small job. Our artillery is busy elsewhere too, so you are to raid the position, destroy them and return with as few casualties as possible. · MG / Gun Pillboxes We are planning an attack, and have located some pillboxes that needs to be taken out first. Destroy the bunkers and return with as few casualties as possible · Supply Depot The enemy is planning an attack, and has placed a forward supply depot, which our intelligence has managed to locate. Destroy it before they have the chance to attack, and return with as few casualties as possible. · Repair Shop The enemy has placed a forward repair shop, which our intelligence has managed to locate. We suspect that they are using it to prepare for an upcoming attack. Destroy it before they have the chance to attack, and return with as few casualties as possible. You can get a Raid each time you roll an Attack or Hold order. There's a 1/6 chance that it is converted to a Raid. This still needs some balancing, but now I _really_ want to stop adding features before I turn to the CMAK version. Just a bit of testing first, and balancing. I'm of course interested in any feedback you might want to provide. Oh, and the files. Get them here: http://www.roqc.cdgroup.org/files/ROQC_Rules_2_00i.zip http://www.roqc.cdgroup.org/files/ROQC_Sheets_2_00i.zip http://www.roqc.cdgroup.org/files/ROQC_Sheets_2_00i_Example.zip Enjoy, Robert. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 14, 2004 Author Share Posted January 14, 2004 Two changes to 2.00i: If you raid a gun battery, edit the ammo of the howitzers down to 1 HE (and no other ammo). Padlocked units that are imported into a QB with a map can in fact be moved by the AI during setup, so you need to use setup zones with a separate color instead. Also note that the die roll that checks if an Attack or Hold is converted to a Raid can be found in cell E6 in the Auto sheet. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robert Olesen Posted January 15, 2004 Author Share Posted January 15, 2004 I got these from Craig Watsford. The problems exist in 2.00i. Looks like you missed an adjustment when you added in the raid data. The modifier setting in the after battle "number of replacements' is still setup for 2.0h. I had to make the folowing change in the formula to get it to work </font><blockquote>code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;"> =IF(I38<>"",3*($I$38-1)+1+IF($I$38=2,2,0)+IF(AND(Q6,$M$20),IF($M$13<43,-4,-2),0)+IF(I38<2,LOOKUP($I$6,Tables1!$E$52:$E$64,Tables1!$K$52:$K$64),0)+IF($Q$6,-1,IF($Q$5,1,0)),"")</pre>(in table 1 both ranges were 1 square out) Also the blank 2.0i sheet still has some dice rolls from the example sheet in the core force tab 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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