M4A3 machine gun tracers?

[Dawg Bonz]

Just picked up "Another River, Another Town" by John P. Irwin. Interesting personal account of a teenage tank gunner coming of age in Combat, 1945.

Speaking of his 76mm tank cannon and coaxially mounted .30 caliber machine gun, "Both guns were zeroed in to hit the same target at 1,800 yards, which made it possible to use machine gun tracers to target an object quickly and then fire the cannon to score."

How often were tracer rounds fired from the tank gunner’s machine gun?

Did the bow gunner also fire tracers?

Dawg

[Huckebein]

I'd guess that they were quite common - does the gunner have time to aim separately two totally different (muzzle velocity, round trajectory, etc.), but coaxial, weapons? Tracer would sure alleviate the problem a little, even if only used sparingly.

Others here will know far better than me though - I'm an air warfare nut really. Ask me anything 'bout that...

[Huckebein]

The bow gunner, as far as I can imagine, has time to aim his weapon, so doesn't need tracer so much. A few well-spaced rounds should be useful, but might end up revealing a hidden vehicle's position a little prematurely...

[Dawg Bonz]

Thanks for the feedback.

Did a little looking and found Fionn Kelly & Madmatt

http://www.combatmission.com/articles/usmedtanks/m4a1.asp

M4A1(76)W

Type Amount

76mm 71

.50 caliber 600

.45 caliber 900

.30 caliber 6250

Hand grenades 12

2" Smoke mortar 12

From other material it sounds like every cannon round had a tracer?

Did not find any mention of tracer rounds fired from the tank gunner’s machine gun.

Dawg … not a tank grog dawg

[MOS was 71331]

As I recall my 1960s training on the 106mm recoilless rifle, that AT weapon had a .50 caliber sighting scheme. You fired a .50 cal tracer and, after the tracer hit the target, you fired the main gun. (It was strongly recommended not to stand behind the recoilless rifle -- its back blast was lethal.)

[flamingknives]

A bow gunner in a Sherman may have time to aim, but that doesn't help as he doesn't have any sights.

Dedicated spotting rifles are ballistically matched to the trajectory of the main round.

Most, if not all main gun rounds have tracer.

Logic suggests that tank MGs had a fairly common 4 or 5 to 1 ball to tracer mix.

ISTR that there was a thread in one of the forums that covered the use of MG fire to judge range. The main gun sight has a number of graticles indicating aiming points at given ranges for different rounds (MG, HE and AP). If the Co-axial is hitting the target at the mark for a particular range, you simply re-lay the gun using the relevant mark for that range.

[Dawg Bonz]

Thanks guys. My brief search seems to point to most guys using collateral dust, damage as point of impact affirmation and adjusting from that. Guess that worked during the day fairly well. "Hey Joe, you just blew out that wall… over 2 clicks." Or sumpin like that.

In "Another River, Another Town" John P. Irwin said he relied heavily on the Tank Commander’s call as to what and where to shoot. Irwin, the gunner, kept his eye on the periscope but his TC really adjusted his fire more than tracers.

Irwin’s account of the close in fighting near Padderborn, Dessau, etc. bestows new respect for hand help AT weapons in the closing days of WWII.

Dawg