Biltong's Campaign Rules

[Snowbart]

Upgrading Attached Units-

-Can you only upgrade one of your 3 units between each battle, or can you do all 3 if you have the points? I assume you may only upgrade one bet. each battle?

[Biltong]

Originally posted by History Buff:

I'm back.

....

Terminator III

[Biltong]

[ May 05, 2003, 05:38 PM: Message edited by: Biltong ]

[Biltong]

Originally posted by Snowbart:

Upgrading Attached Units-

-Can you only upgrade one of your 3 units between each battle, or can you do all 3 if you have the points? I assume you may only upgrade one bet. each battle?

Just clarified the rules:

You may not have more than three Attached Units. If you already have 3 and get more points you can upgrade one or more of your Attached Units using the extra points and buy something better. Use the Experience of the replaced unit.

[Biltong]

Originally posted by OBJ:

Biltong-

Do you have a feel for the winter '41 effects on just Army Group South? I can imagine the Russian winter in the northern latitudes was brutal.

Hmm I shudder to think what the effects there's going to be. When I started out, I thought the South would be reletavely warm. I used temperatures from Kiev and Stalingrad as a sort of a midway point for the South, but as you can see... not a cosy place to hang around in December.

Did you ever get my e-mailed xls file for unit and leader starting potential and tracking experience levels and leadership traits?

I mailed you on the 28th - must've got lost? Mailed you again just now - Hope you get this one.

What would you say to a favor penalty if the TF casualties significantly exceed core force casualties?

I like the principle behind it, but can't see how it can be implimented in a simple way. I.e. without recording all the TF units and counting casualties (esp when their's a casualty % in action). Any suggestions?

[Biltong]

Originally posted by History Buff:

..."Why did the Soviets defeat Nazi Germany in WW2?" (FUN!) ...

This I've got to read. Are you going to post it here?

[88mm]

Hi, Bitrong

great work you have done. This is exactly what i need, i just love the campaign approach.

Keep up the good stuff

Some minor comments do. It's not so easy for a noob (like me ) to start. Some things are confusing to begin and i've read your doc. 3 times before i am getting the "hang of it".

Anyway, i think you can make things a little more organised. Something like:

1) install rule-set

a)bitraid

java. (if needed)

2) BCR Parameters..

a) (anything that's add's on this_

and so on. It now looks like a random mixture to me, dunno where to begin with.

Anyway, i am downloading the latest java at the moment. Hope i can figure it all out when it's up and runnning. One question; The (CO) setting, is this you're own choice like sort of a "difficulty setting" ? .

ps: A few pictures with examples and/or explations on the site would be very helpfull i

think.

*update: installed Java (the JRE-version top of the list at java-site)

After some fiddling what i need to type, figured it out thks to one poster here... made a start biltaid.bat that works. Maybe a idea to include with the biltaid.jar ? Running XP and didn't need to setup a path or something. Only thing i changed was under configuration/java-applet the module it should use.

Now i see a empty sheet. Lets see what i have to do next....

k, after i find the right sheet (camp. sheet 41) i am struggling with the random dice roll -sheet. How do you "roll the dice" here :confused:

Ow boy, i feel like a complete idiot

2) how do i "circle" things in the oncreen sheet ?

3) Do i nee a printer ? since i have not one.

[ May 05, 2003, 09:19 PM: Message edited by: 88mm ]

[Snowbart]

ahhhhhhh.......yes, you must have a printer to do the pencil and paper approach.

If you dont have one, save the:

1. player user guide

2. newest set of BCR(Biltongs Campaign Rules)

3. Parameters sheet

4. Battle Group sheet

5. Favor sheet

6. Random die sheet(if you dont have a die)

to a disk and take to the copy shop to get some printed out.

I suggest reading the Player Guide and BCR at the same time. Read what it says about each step in one and then the other guide/rules. Refer to all notes. Just go down the list and do what it says. Took me many hours to get it straight myself. It is very intimidating at first, but well worth the time spent after you get the hang of it!

[atiff]

Originally posted by Snowbart:

ahhhhhhh.......yes, you must have a printer to do the pencil and paper approach.

Not necessarily. I don't have a printer either, so I do the "pencil and paper" approach on Excel. I just use the Excel file as is, keeping track of which parameters are in effect by making those cells bold (eg, if the weather is "heavy fog" I make that cell bold on the Parameters sheet).

I've also added a few calculation bits to work out my Squad XP when they get replacements for casualties; just have to enter a couple of numbers and then read the cell which calculates the result. And a cell to work out from the points I have and battle type what point size of battle it should be.

[atiff]

Another question for you guys who are into 1942; how many battles have you played all up? I've just started #20, and it is only August '41.

[88mm]

[ May 06, 2003, 12:18 AM: Message edited by: 88mm ]

[88mm]

Tnks for your support, i really need some.

As you mentioned, i switched back and forward from the Campaign.rules sheet (2.2) and the player guide(2.2). Some things are getting clear now, aldo it's not a "easy ride".

Most of this oocurs to the difficult structure that is used and the need to swapping from one note to the other. Since i like logictics, i see room for improvement.

a) instead of all the notes floating all around through the sheets about the firts battle:

why not make a seperate, easy step-by-step walkthrough for a first turn setup ?

Futhermore it seems to jumps forward towards a next step without i even noticed that the other has ended.

Example: I am well underway, writing down all the settings as stated, till i gett to the point; Start a QB , enter the settings and play...

Howww!!! where's the pre-QB stayed ? surely i must have missed something. It's so easy to miss it, afterall.

This brings me to another thing:

A step by step process through the setup WITH! ingame pictures of it !

So my "walkthrough" would be something like this:

Intro

1) Basic Principles

2) what you need and how to use (die for example)

-with links where to get it

3)setup instructions Biltaid etc.

4)Start !

-initial setup

--(suport)task force (AUX easier name)

--(main)battle group (CORE easier name)

-start pre-battle

-real setup

-start real battle

something like that, dunno i have the order right since that''s not clear to me yet. with pictures to clear things up that would make it so much easier (and short, clear comments)

Now it looks like "spaghetti" to me, with no good clues when i am ready to start a pre-battle and when to do next. Atleast, that's my experience....

ps: another thing that isn't clear for me, my basic force points = 653. Do i still need to roll the dice and add up the other things from the table of inf/vehicle/tanks etc.etc. :confused:

Do i add up 5 points for every roll in this section :confused: (since my troops are green +2 and it's a axis assault +3)

And the arty table, firts battle almost always "large arty" or what :confused:

so much questions

[88mm]

Originally posted by atiff:

Not necessarily. I don't have a printer either, so I do the "pencil and paper" approach on Excel. I just use the Excel file as is, keeping track of which parameters are in effect by making those cells bold (eg, if the weather is "heavy fog" I make that cell bold on the Parameters sheet).

I've also added a few calculation bits to work out my Squad XP when they get replacements for casualties; just have to enter a couple of numbers and then read the cell which calculates the result. And a cell to work out from the points I have and battle type what point size of battle it should be. [/QB]

[88mm]

The first QB never gets played – it is only use is to automatically generate a Task Force that will help your Battle Group for just that single battle. The 2nd QB is the Real Battle where your Battle Group fights it out against the Allied enemy.

i can understand the first line. But where does the "generated task force" from QB 1 come into practice at QB-2 (the real thing) :confused:

ps: after 2 hours and finally reading the addional notes of his guide :eek: i finally understand why and how to use the pre-quick battle. Surely this would have been made more obvious in the beginning of the guide....

So, i only use the points generated for the units and sum this up for the making of the taks force (without the 653, this seems to be your main battle group points). Then i have to record this (by pen ?). Funny there's no Task-force sheet, so you supposed to write it down every battle ?

arty (TF):

If you are lucky enough to roll up Large Arty you are also allowed to buy any unit regardless of 'Rarity'.

i rolled 7, +2 for june = 9 , and with note 7 i get +2 for green and +3 for Assuakting (axis), right? thats 14, so it's a ten. By air i understand that i should go to 9 (arty) anyway.

This extra unit, how can i select it when i have "rarity" settings set on ? Is it a TF unit, a one time and forget it the next battle unit ?

Do i pay with for it with my TF-points ?

[ May 06, 2003, 01:11 AM: Message edited by: 88mm ]

[DBaron]

Originally posted by 88mm

Funny there's no Task-force sheet, so you supposed to write it down every battle ?

At the top of the parameters sheet theres some listings for task force offerings, so you can write down what is generated in the first QB.

[ May 06, 2003, 01:45 AM: Message edited by: DBaron ]

[88mm]

Thks, got it

I am 5 hours underway now, still have to begin my pre-setup

Trying to make a workin formula that auto-calc. the purchase p, and my excel knowledge = less then 5% :eek:

sofar i have the formule =E43*1/1.72

but i like to choose the variables in a cel that auto-links to the formule and come up with the right amount so i am not there yet.

One question yet : Do i use the total "provisional Force Size" to assemble my "task force" or only the sub-totals from it :confused:

i have trown 1803 all together (with the 653 Main Battle Points). with the formule i get 1055, so i can buy up to 1250, right ?

Is this also the number in the TF-setup ?

ow, and more thing: AAAAAAARRRRGGGGHHhhhhhhhh (that clears my mind)

[ May 06, 2003, 02:23 AM: Message edited by: 88mm ]

[DBaron]

This is gonna be like the blind leading the blind since I am new to BCR myself, but I will try to help you out if I can. Below is what I do when I start a battle, though I cannot attest that it is the *correct* way.

i have trown 1803 all together (with the 653 Main Battle Points). with the formule i get 1055, so i can buy up to 1250, right ?

Is this also the number in the TF-setup ?

You use 1250 for the force size. Now go into the game, plug in the paramenters you rolled up. 1250 will be the number you put in for the CMBB quick battle force size. You will be able to buy more than 1250 though. It will depend on different factors, but say you are assaulting, with 0 casualties, I think the computer will calculate your force size to 2150 (1250 * 1.72). Next you go and buy up to, but not over whatever values you rolled for infantry, support, etc, and also buy your mech inf company and armor. Remember to buy only what was generated in the task force offerings.

Now, I just quit buying at this point, and move on to the battle, but most of the time I have points left over to spend (after having filled all my task force slots), say I have only used 2050 of the 2150. I *think* you can use those extra points to buy whatever you want, but I'm not exactly sure on how that part works. I convientely ignore it and just start the battle.

But feel free to do whatever you want.

I hope this helps.

[88mm]

Almost

that's the "battle" setup, i figured that out myself. It's the PRE-Quick battle where you monitor your Task-force equipment where i am confused about. So i simply used 1250 points there too and let the PC auto-generate the troops. So i should count the numbers and the types of the troops: 40 x inf '41 Squads, 18x Recon 41 squads, 18 x 50mm mortar etc.etc. (diced only inf. )

Have i done this oke? Or should i use another number (purchase points).

Pre-Quick Baltle ????

Main Quick battle:

1250= main battle points so that's 653 for my main group which leaves me 600 for the Task force.

[DBaron]

Sorry thought you were talking about the main battle.

Yes you use the 1250 in the pre QB (task force offering) as well (at least I do).

For the pre QB, I don't even count the number of units or anything like that (too tedious). I don't have the patience to count them. I just go through, and see what types of units the game offers up. Then I buy those same units for the main battle.

[ May 06, 2003, 03:37 AM: Message edited by: DBaron ]

[88mm]

Good.... almost there

One major problem: due to my buggy? video-card drivers (8500radeon pro /catalist 3.2 Ati) i cannot alt-tab during gameplay. Well, actually alt-tab works fine, i can see my desktop clearly. But when i return to the game the screen is/stays black. Hear the sound, see my mouse and he moves too, but a black screen and nothing i can do about it

and i am lucky with the dice, not only i may chosse a "rare" unit (whatever that is) since i had lucky numbers with the arty-table. I also am lucky with the rare/unique items diceroll. So that means i can buy whatever i want to my likings i guess

update

Finally played my first battle, with all that artillery power i thought it would be a piece of cake. Boy, was i wrong.

bought myself a extra platoon of recon troops, along with 2x 81mm mortars, 1x 75mm spotter and a sweet 170mm spotter. then 3x Sig33, 2x flak 6/2 and a PZ IVc to complete my Task force.

Along with my main battle group (core) this looks good on the field.

USSr: Sov, inf, low quality, low on ammo (40%) and 50% casualty penaltie. This must be a piece of cake, for sure.

First contact: trenches, barb wires and some Sov. rec. troops... easy enough.

Then: (turn 12 already) al my troops in place and 170mm nearly finished. This is it, chargeeee.

My 81mm shells flying over my men's heads, pounding the poor Sov. in the woods. The Sig's firing like maddogs, making use blast and do havoc on the sovs...i think. My tank firing support-shells to pinn the sovs. And one by one my men go down, crawl, die, retreat and going crazy. WTF! so , i charged the remnats of my armor (turn 18) forward to capture a flag. They did, 4 arrived. My troops lay in havoc, 300 metres away... those idiots. Then one by one my armor is taken out by sovs inf assault (molotovs?). Sigh, what a glory

Our great "barbarossa" action report:

we made 121 casualties, killed 30 of them, detroyed no armor/vehicles (there weren't any) and knocked out 3 mortars.

Ow well, lose a battle, win the war right? right

[Greebo]

Hi I'm new in here, made several starts on the campaign, used the paper version, moved to the excel version, use a combination of the 2, and now on BiltAid. Still not 100% sure I'm doing the right things.

Been watching the Biltong Campaign Rules posts, since the last one, all 11+pages of it.

Anyway I might have found a bug with BiltAid, not certain as not 100% sure on the rules, here's what happened. BTW I'm reporting this from memory, so I can't be 100% certain this is how it happened.

Played the first battle, Draw (I just don't seem capable of successfully launching assaults). 2nd battle was a ME and the Russians never got close the the VFs, and my loses were almost none (I think 1 guy sprained an ankle in some tree roots). Next battle was an immediate assault, and this is where BiltAid appeared to go goofey on me.

There appeared to be a mistake in the force size setting it was giving me. It appeared not to take into account the 1.72 division factor. My BG and Task Force was around 800pts, and the force size was 800pts. I realised as I was purchasing my units when I noticed I had spent under 800pts and still had 576pts to spend (800*1.72=1376). Went back to my printed out biltaid sheet, and spotted the problem. So started a new QB with an adjusted pts value of 500 (800/1.72=465 round up=500).

My theroy on the bug, BiltAid took the previous battle setting (ME) instead of setting it to Assault.

[88mm]

Could be, not even used biltaid yet...

My complaint is that you have to do all the mathematics yourself. You go from note* to Note* to find the right figures, if finding them at all (too much info, too much spread, impossible to understand it all at once). Ins't this a Xls, spreadsheet ? the way it is used, it could just as easily been a Word document. Why is Excel not used like it should be used; doing math.

1) No more + this and - that

2) No more go to note* and read appendix*

3) fill in the numbers and the results are shown immediately.

I would consider this a missed oppertunity, and i believe that many people who use these forms implement them in their own way.

Futher observation;

Why do you have to roll the dice for the firts battle concerning;

a) casualties

fitnes

After months of preparation, shouldn't the Compagnies be fullsized, well fed and fresh ?

And were is the experience-gain left from spain/polen/Denmark/Norway,Low-countries/France/Yoegaslavia/Greece ?

Surely they should have some Veterans by now.

[Culex Pipiens]

i just read all the rules and tryed to play my first game, but i have two questions when generating the game:

1- why there is no ground condition choice?

2- the defender when has the option to dug in?

i did not find no answer in the rules on these points

thanx

[Greebo]

88mm dl and install BiltAid it removes alot of the book keeping (well it takes care of it for you).

You still need to input some parameters, like the AAR, and take notes on your Task Force offerings from the Pre-Battle QB

But mostly it is File>Advance to generate the battle, File>Advance to kick of the AAR wizard.

Only problem you might have is getting it installed.

[Guillem]

Fortifications points related post:

Hi all, i've just set up my guys for their 9th battle, the first of a 5-battle long fight in a large town (the first one i have ever played

But my proposal has to do with the previous battle i fought. It took place after 19 days of the previous one, it was an allied assault, and here goes my little complain : i did got no fortification points at all, due to back luck with die.

Shouldn't fortification points be somehow affected by how long has it passed since your last battle?

After 3 weeks, those lazy men didn't did not even one trench!

Anyway, for those interested in the outcome, it was a med map open, with moderate hills, and my positions had clear line of sights, so i managed to pin down the whole rusky battallion and my advanced spotter got his guns on them. It was a total victory, with 370 allied casualties to 19 mine. One tank alone managed to do 140 casualties !

Good luck with your battles !

Guillem.