Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 Condor (axis) Vs Dalmatian Partisan (allies) Bid system 1:5:20 Bid was 200. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 September 39. Poland army destroyed and hitting Warsaw, i used 1 AF so only 2 Af to LC next turn. DOW on Denmark. Subs raiding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 Turn 2. Couldnt take LC, 1 point left... Warsaw taken, another corps destroyed but Poland didnt surrender. Subs still raiding. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 Turn 3. Poland army destroyed but poland still didnt surrender... French army in Brussels totally surrounded. Denmark alive. 1 british corps and 1 cruisier destroyed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 November 39 German tank group destroyed(Ardennes), French army leaves Brussels-British corps defending brussels, Modlin korps(POL) takes Konigsberg, Dutch korps between Hamburg and Essen [ January 11, 2004, 02:10 PM: Message edited by: DalmatiaPartisan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 Turn 4. NO plunders yet, kinda a joke. Poland wont surrender, neither LC. French cruisier sunk. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 February 40. LC surrenders, Poland surrenders. Italy enters the war next turn and Denamrk will surrender next turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 FEBRUARY 1940 Poland surrenders(although holding Prague and Konigsberg), LC surrenders Italy enters the war Carriers and airfleet practicing on Ireland Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 11, 2004 Share Posted January 11, 2004 March 40 1 german tank and army destroyed maginot left empty France will fall soon 1 Italian and French battleship sunk in Med [ January 11, 2004, 02:44 PM: Message edited by: DalmatiaPartisan ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 11, 2004 Author Share Posted January 11, 2004 June 40. France surrenders. kills: - 2 BBs - 2 cruisiers - some corps also 1 french BB, 1 cruisier , hevily damage teh other. Casualties: - 2 italian ships. - 2 tanks, army. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 14, 2004 Share Posted January 14, 2004 August 40 -Norway surrenders -Brits fleet in med destroyed(Egypt still holding) -UK corps defending Brest-German army killed infront Brest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 14, 2004 Share Posted January 14, 2004 April 41 Yugoslavia enters the war Sweden capitulated few turns ago allies lost corp in norway Italian fleet and Luftwaffe bombarding Free French on Gibraltar heavily Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 14, 2004 Author Share Posted January 14, 2004 July 41. Norway, Sweden and Vichy converted. Last minor Bulgaria joined axis in June 41. Brest axis, UK corps killed. Bergen axis, UK corps killed. Yugo cope in April 41 was quickly suffocated by Garibaldi and company. Egypt axis. Malta still allied, but is getting a hard time, 3 carriers, italian fleet and Luftwaffe. Tech known: Jets 2 for germany. Jets 1 for UK. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 15, 2004 Share Posted January 15, 2004 August 41 USA 78%, USSR 74 Free French on Malta still holding although heavily attacked Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 16, 2004 Author Share Posted January 16, 2004 Barbarrosa went ok, a bit light. With the high bid he started to buy tanks, and he is killing some troops but he ahs lost many units too. The west menace is over and now its time to give the final blow on the reds. - 3 UK AFs destroyed (no more AFs) - US BB destroyed - carrier destroyed (only 1 left and im gonna hunt it) - US HQ destroyed - 2 US armies destroyed - French army and several UK corps destroyed. UK/US will be facing a Sealion soon, he doesnt have much left. - i still have all carriers and all AFs alive. - 3 Italian navy - all kriegsmarine Tech known: Germany: - Jets level 2 - LR level 1 - AT level 1 UK: - Jets level 2 (but no AFs to use the tech) Iraq and Greece is axis, Spain has just surrendered, Portugal will do the same next turn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Codename Condor Posted January 19, 2004 Author Share Posted January 19, 2004 Year is 42. Russian forces advanced towards Poland in the first months after barbarrossa, mostly tanks and most of them are dead now. Now russian forces are retreating and german forces are chasing. US bought 3 subs, they are all dead now. Sealion in process, 4 experienced carriers level 1 LR, 4 Luftwaffe AF and italian armies. I sank some UK/US BBs, still 2 alive and 2 damaged carriers. Every UK/US AFs is dead including the bomber, russian AFs been killed by Lufwaffe level 3. I still have 7 AFs + 4 carriers and winning over 700. Allies have 1 russian AF left. Half of my AFs are in France once London falls(next turn most probably). I will kill every russian HQ. Dalmatian doesnt think game is over, well, he says something about a storm that is falling there and wanted to quit. Well, u can judge who is gonna win. "People should know when they're conquered." QUINTUS from Gladiator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DalmatiaPartisan Posted January 19, 2004 Share Posted January 19, 2004 not quite right I d say! Game is over-Condor wins-dont want to argue-I understand SC as the game and nothing more... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dragonheart Posted January 19, 2004 Share Posted January 19, 2004 Dont worry you will get your second chance against me. See you on the battlefield. Tell me when you are available. greetings Dragonheart Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Ranger Posted January 20, 2004 Share Posted January 20, 2004 Nice game guys. CC looks like your the King right now, I know you've kicked my arse afew times as Germany. The next line is more on the game then your style, don't take it personally. August 41 USA 78%, USSR 74 Now is this a joke or what? That Germany should see its greatest foe at such low readiness when she is wiping the floor of all those minors . And the USA ready to jump into another war on the other side of the pond when Congress could care less? Yes I know its for 'play' balance but if that was true why do we need a bid? And for those who say Russia wouldn't be ready for war I suggest a 'new' book out called 'Hitlers Traitor'. I read it last month and it had alot (for me) of interesting info. I'm sure we've all heard of the 'Lucy' spy ring and how it saved Stalin's butt. The book works from released data (50 years old and KGB info) that nobody had access to until the late 1990s. The #1 spy was called 'Walter' and in the books conclusion this is Borman, Hess's assistant untill he flew to UK (planed not the 'crazy' flight we think it was). Borman became the #2 man in the Party (after Hitler) and was the Big Guys personal secritary, i.e. he controled who and when people could see Hitler. In many ways this made him the #2 man in Germany from 41-45, and he was working for Russia (if you believe this book). Back to the Red Army, in the spring of 41 the entire Red Army was outside the 39 Borders, with huge supply dumps right behind it. Attacks are conducted in such forward positions, Defense is conducted in depth, USSR was preping for attack. Hitler just beat Stalin to the punch, the attack came just as the Red Army was reorginizing its armored units, if these repositioning's had been compleated Russia would have attacked (depends on what books you read, 'newer' books tend to support this more) in the late Summer/early Fall of 41, maybe not until 42. It all depended on if Stalin could stick it in Hitler bum while the Germany army was ocupied with Sealion or not. In SC terms USSR readiness should be incressed 15-20% and USA's should be reduced 5-10% (can't go neg so this is moot). Then I think you would see a more 'historical' time line. Ahhh another rant by the sleep deprived Iron man. Was thinks also what it would be like if Russia started actived like in 3R but very weak (no units in 39) with several resources green and one oil well gray, Interesting? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Iron Ranger The earliest Stalin was considering a conflict with Germany was no sooner than '42. You've got to sift thru all of the political agendas of the people who are publishing translated Soviet material. The whole idea that Stalin was going to launch a "preventative war" in '41 against Germany, comes from a May '41 proposal by Zhukov that was published in a number Soviet journals. A Soviet immigrant, who wrote a few books under the pen name of Victor Suvorov, is the guy who started this. Some European historians, lapped this up when it first came out. Some Russian historians, also have accepted this as the truth, since it serves the political purpose of making the Soviet regime look bad. The short version is that Zhukovs proposal, which called for a offensive against Germany in July, is accepted as truth, due to the actions that Russia took between the late 1930's and June of 1941. As any former military officer can tell you, especially those who have served in a planning capacity, various plans are made for all types of potential actions. No doubt, somewhere in the Pentagon, there are plans to take over the Saudi Arabian oil fields. But that doesn't mean, that the Gulf Wars of '91 and '03 are the preliminary steps for that action. Stalin knew there would be a future war between Germany and Russia. But he hadn't started purging the Red Army officers until '37, and was at it when Germany invaded. There was also acceptance (verified by translated documents within the last 5-10 years), that the Red Army due to its performances in the Winter War (vs Finland), needed reform. Even the actions against the Japanese in '39, showed that the Red Army needed time to equip, but more importantly, replace its officer leadership. Even if Stalin agreed with Zhukov's plan, he needed time to get his new officers familiar with thier commands. Especially since his expierences in the Russian Civil War gave him an understanding of what needed to be done for military effectivness. And with Japan conducting its "border excursions", Stalin was more worried about what the Japanese were going to do than Germany. When you look at all of those details, with some appreciation of how the military really works, it becomes clear that Stalin couldn't conduct any offensive actions, even if he wanted to, until '42. Whats kinda interesting, is that the current day Russian military, is looking at various options on how to reform themselves, since the "Soviet" model hasn't performed so well for them. They are examining Russian military traditions before the Soviet era, to see if there isn't something in thier history that can be brought back to solve thier current problems. One of those things, are officers who come from the enlisted ranks. Its pretty much a given, that "mustangs" are your most effective combat leaders. These of course, are the same guys that Stalin was scared of, since he blamed them for the Russian Civil War. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Ranger Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 Yup, read/seen ect... and agree with everything above (ok not the stuff on modern Russia, thats new). Was Russian ready in Late 41 or Eary 42? Since none of us were there, I don't think any of us really knows. And personally I'm not pushing the 41 thought, but in the game from a balance issue it would be better to go that route and skip the bidding. From a historical side, I think the key is 'attack Hitler in the bum, during sealion'. Stalin had to know that if Germany could take down UK in a quick invasion (4-12 weeks) that Russia was doomed. Yes the Winter war was a disastor (unprepared/poor leadership) but attacking in 41 with UK still active (but unprepared) would be better then facing Nazi Eroupe all by your self in 42 or 43. Thats something even the Cazr's didn't have to face during during Napolians invasion. Easy Facts/thoughts from a 'poor' historian, like me: Three 'powers' controled the west at this time, each hoped the other two would destroy each other in battle and then 'thier' side would be the last standing (or the strongest). Stalin Knew Germany could take down anyone, major power or minors quickly - Poland 2 weeks, Denmark 1 week, France 6 weeks. Germany had many supporting Countrys, Spain weak after the cival war but Facist, Sweden support Finland during winter war selling ore, all the balkins (reluctant?) allies. Germany at some point was going to attack, Hitlers book said so. A Russia facing Germany one on one was going to lose, no matter what. Stalin didn't know Was Hitler going to invade UK, if so he had to act fast. Is this why the units are so far forward in June 41? To conduct a 'spoiling' attack even if unprepared with the balk of German armor was in UK? Ahhh, an interesting and fun discussion. I suggerset reading the book "Hitler Traitor', alot of good info on the eastern front that you can't get in most 'western' books on WW2. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Liam Posted January 21, 2004 Share Posted January 21, 2004 The Russian War is definitely the most entertaining if you like land warfare. My favorite. From the eternal siege of Leningrad, to the Tank Battles in Kursk the encirclement of the 6th in Stalingrad. Endless amounts of reading material and battles. Though many historians disagree about things, I think we all can agree the Reds payed a lot more Red than we did. Although I suppose that's what they get for going to bed with Germany in Poland The Russians had lots of equipment from what I've heard and always were good at mass production. I don't know if on the level the USA could do if the USA really really rationed to the degree that other nations had done. The USSR really outproduced Germany by far and they had some quality goods, and where they lacked quality they had numbers. The people were suprisingly devoted the leadership adaquete... You really have to say on the all, the Russians knew that if they lost they were all dead so fight to the death instead and that they did. Something the US and other nations haven't faced in their recent history, perhaps something instilled in the Russian people for centuries going back to the time of the Mongol Invasion. I'd really like to see the Eastern front have a few more essential cities and a slight bit more length to it so we could put 3 million invading Axis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 You know, I don't really like to get involved in threads like this, because questions like "What caused the Russo-German conflict 41-45?" can't be answered on one page. For those students of the war, there are plenty of books to read that can really clear up a lot of the spaghetti that is world war II (btw, WWII is THE most documented event in history, more books on this subject than any other). One of the most famous is "Rise and Fall of the Third Reich". This book follows mostly the political intrigues, with more than half the book devoted to the events prior to 39. A great overall book is Liddell Hart's "History of the 2nd world war". Great book, gives a good general account of the war and is recommended by most historians as a good starting point for entry level studies. MY favorite book is "The German Army: 1933-1945". Has anyone read this? It is AMAZING. Only when I bought this book, did I really start to feel I had gleaned some truth about what really went on in the German camp. It's written by an American, Matthew Cooper, but it's very objective. #1 thing is this book, BlitzKrieg is an invention of the Allies, for the Germans, the real strategy was "Vernichtungsgedanke" Cauldron battles, and this strategy dates back farther than even the Prusso-French war. Another interesting note from this book that on Albert Speer. Speer had said that had he been governing the war economy from the start, germany's barbarossa would have been thrice as strong. Although at heart a good man, I am glad Speer did not get that chance Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Avatar Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 "When you look at all of those details, with some appreciation of how the military really works, it becomes clear that Stalin couldn't conduct any offensive actions, even if he wanted to, until '42." I disagree. The Soviet winter offensive 41-42, although only partially successful, was devastating to the germans. Zhukov begged Stalin (and STAVKA) to concentrate Soviet reserves into 1 or 2 thrusts with clear strategic goals. Instead, Stalin insisted on a broad advance along the whole front. This caused a dispersal of soviet supplies, men, tanks, etc etc, and subsequently the germans were able to hold and regroup. OKH was really scared that Army Group Center was going to be encircled, and there was real substance in that worry. Lucky for them that Stalin was at the helm, and not Zhukov. But isn't that the way with all warlords? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Ranger Posted January 22, 2004 Share Posted January 22, 2004 Thanks for the list of books, I've read some of them but not all. I'll take a look at the others next time I'm at the libary, so many books as so many that are shat (Shaka is right on the 'pol mot' part). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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