Blashy Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 1- People could make WW2 look as they see fit instead of constantly asking Hubert for this and that. 2- Each country could have their own MPP/Military. 3- Each country could join / surrender or remain neutral as the player wish. And most of all with an extensive editor you could make mods that are not WW2. The roman empire, the crusades, the napolean era, the UK/French/Spain naval era, Gengis Khan, The Chinese battles for control of China and many others, especially my favorite The Great War. So you would not have the units of that era but at least you could have the map, the layout and use the available units as best you can. Like the Rome vs. Attila mod I made, I used tanks to represent horses... Can you imagine the replayability? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyJohn Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 Blashy Great Post. Very similar to one I put up last December or January, including the map editor. I'm glad it's true about Great Minds thinking alike. I'm sure both our ideas were also thought of long before that old post of mine, and I remember Hueristic helped form the concept as well. Shaka and Bill Macon added comments and everyone liked the idea. In the end we all agreed the Hubert should use this basic game system and package it as a "Universal Wargame Kit." Which is what I think you're really talking about. Anyway, good ideas become better when restated from a fresh point of view. I hope your Thread on the matter gets somewhere. It's a good request. We appear to have many similar ideas. This a link to my April posting in the FAQ Thread with a list of Threads to refer to. I'm not doing it in the spirit of been there and done it, it's being listed as a reference you might find useful; finding these old threads from scratch would be time consuming and difficult: < FAQ Post with Thread Links > CvM also has some links there. It's unfortunate the thread wasn't renamed to something like FAQ and Useful Topic Links,, which was pretty much the original idea in starting it. Also copying the list here. It went up when Patch 1.07 was first made available for testing. You can't link those threads from this post, you'll need to go to the original FAQ Thread first; mine is the posting immediately following Hubert's and CvM's is a bit further down. JerseyJohn Member Member # 10545 posted April 09, 2003 02:08 PM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Three Cheers For Mr. Cater! Well Done, Hubert. Great Opportunity to have frequently referred to Topics Organized and Linked. Presumably we should URL the Threads we feel hold lasting relevence to the game. I think it would be a good consideration for members to only paste their own Topics at first, avoiding confusion, duplications and also allowing the originators of other Threads an opportunity to add introductions, explanations or notes where they think it is necessary. -- * Links to Selected Topics * -- The Game Map and Weather. *Hubert -- The North Atlantic! *North America *Weather and SC. Ideas Regarding Diplomacy and Inter-nation Economic Relations -- These entries are closely tied to related topics posted by Shaka of Carthage and Kurt88. *Topic of Suggestions for Diplomacy and Economic Ideas. *Neutrals as Economic Factors in SC. The Air War in SC. *Solutions for the Bullying Air Fleet Problem. *Separate Units and Research Fields for Prop and Jet Aircraft Redefinition of HQs in SC. *HQs and Unit Nationality. *Expanded HQ Roles: Stacking with Advance and Retreat after Combat. *HQs for Large Minor Countries -- Mannerheim & Franco etc.. Ideas Concerning Amphibious Tactics in SC -- These posts closely related to ideas posted by Immer Etwas. *Amphibious Operations in SC. *Ideas Regarding An Amphibious Operations Unit. *Amphibious Operations Research Field An Expanded Campaign/Scenario Editor. *Player Defined Unit Limits in the Scenario Editor. *Map Editor and Troop Placement for Non-starting Nations in the Expanded Campaign Editor. [ July 10, 2003, 08:43 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ] [ November 18, 2003, 02:51 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blashy Posted November 18, 2003 Author Share Posted November 18, 2003 I read part of those links a while ago. You say that SC should be package more as a Universal Wargame kit. I could not have said it better myself, I never even thought of it that way, but you are absolutely right. That would be the best path to go for this game. 1- Make a WW2 scenario for those that would not get involved in the Editor 2- But within the editor make it as free form as possible as I wrote in my 1st post on this thread. You could even have it that you can make your own troops; strength, size, movement, etc... SC turned into a Universal Wargame Kit, excellent idea. [ November 18, 2003, 03:31 AM: Message edited by: Blashy ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyJohn Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 Glad you like it, I think it's what you were talking about all along. CvM has also been very interested in creating Roman and Napoleonic Campaigns using the SC engine. Shaka of Carthage has really been the driving force for a greatly expanded editor for a long time now and I remember he was also in favor of this idea. Hopefully if enough of us get discussions going on the idea Hubert might create something. I'd like to see a kit that has various continent maps, Asia, North America, Europe ... also regions such as the Middle East etc. with a random map generator and also a map composer so players can either create their own maps of fictional or real life places or download one from the built-in library. Same situation with the units. Have it come with historical units for the various eras but also make it possible for players to create their own. Specifics would need to be changed for various eras. An ancient army or fleet wouldn't have the same sighting capabilities as a modern one. Ideally the kit would come with a few campaigns for each era: Alexander the Great, Roman Wars, Ghengis Khan, The Crusades, Thirty Years War, Napoleon 1798 American Civil War, WW I 1914, WW II Europe 1939 WW II Pacific 1941 I'm sure people would also buy expansion packs which should be in the $10 range with, let's say, five professionally researched and created campaigns. The Roman era alone, as you know better than any of us, covers a huge span from the early wars against Pyhrus up to your own Atilla ideas. I hope Hubert goes with it. [ November 18, 2003, 06:19 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blashy Posted November 18, 2003 Author Share Posted November 18, 2003 A Full editor and a small campaign for different eras. You know, I think this would sell like crazy, people creating their own stuff and the ability to relive a conflict of any era, you just have to research and create it. Why buy other games of the genre if you have that [ November 18, 2003, 06:50 AM: Message edited by: Blashy ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iron Ranger Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 Look a year ago SC was just out the door and this was being posted: posted November 14, 2002 02:29 AM -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- What SC2 really needs is sharks with frickin' lasers on their heads. Funny Funny Funny! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyJohn Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 I remember reading that but don't recall where or who said it. Sharks with lasers -- hey, the Navy's been training dolphins for how many decades now? And how basically different are sharks with lasers than getting on a horse and riding it into battle, or using specially trained attack dogs to assist troops, and how about those screwy Indians and Burmese with their war elephants and that Hannibul guy? What I like best is phosphorus covered flaming pigs and stampeding cattle herds; no doubt the casualties served as the victor's dinner! Mankind can be very creative when it comes to finding ways of killing other members of the same speicies, and doesn't flinch from drafting other species! Anyway, looking at it now, that is a funny quote and I'm glad you posted it. This Forum has produced thousands of gems. [ November 18, 2003, 07:24 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hubert Cater Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 Originally posted by Blashy: 1- People could make WW2 look as they see fit instead of constantly asking Hubert for this and that. 2- Each country could have their own MPP/Military. 3- Each country could join / surrender or remain neutral as the player wish. And most of all with an extensive editor you could make mods that are not WW2. The roman empire, the crusades, the napolean era, the UK/French/Spain naval era, Gengis Khan, The Chinese battles for control of China and many others, especially my favorite The Great War. So you would not have the units of that era but at least you could have the map, the layout and use the available units as best you can. Like the Rome vs. Attila mod I made, I used tanks to represent horses... Can you imagine the replayability? Hubert Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kurt88 Posted November 18, 2003 Share Posted November 18, 2003 There you go ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blashy Posted November 18, 2003 Author Share Posted November 18, 2003 Hubert That's enough for me, I have no more suggestions / comments to make regarding SC2. [ November 18, 2003, 06:29 PM: Message edited by: Blashy ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyJohn Posted November 19, 2003 Share Posted November 19, 2003 Man you guys are harsh. Hubert gave us a perfectly clear message, just read between the lines! -- Hubert, just where are these lines where supposed to be reading between? As usual you're ahead of the rest of us having given up mere words for a pictograph language! You've got poor Blashy banging his head against the wall -- a little compassion man, a pictograph? That's all we get, just a smiley? [ November 18, 2003, 09:02 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shaka of Carthage Posted November 19, 2003 Share Posted November 19, 2003 I'm all for an expanded editor. And yes, if the players want to create campaigns for different time frames, ok. But thinking that makes it a Universal Wargame kit is wrong. Its hard enough to create a system that handles the various unit type interactions among WWII era units. Trying to cross the ages makes it so abstract that it becomes worthless in any one age. Thats why almost all of the other Universal kits have failed. For example, take something as simple as Spear or Pike armed infantry fighting Shock or Melee Cavalry. The Spear/Pike armed infantry should get a bonus, but not against Missile Armed Cavalry. And what about supply? One of the transparent things in SC, is that there are railroads operating. So if supplies need to move from one area to another, we don't have to move them, its assumed that railroads can get them there. Not so in the periods before there were railroads. Troops ate the food that was in a specific area, but once it ran out, they had to move on. And they were tied to major rivers, otherwise, they had no access to water. Current supply system in SC can't represent that at all. See my point? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JerseyJohn Posted November 19, 2003 Share Posted November 19, 2003 Shaka You're right, of course. Even in reagular board game varieties it was always difficult to encompass entire melennia; and would be particularly difficult using SC's game scale. How about this, why not a different kit for several different ages? One to cover Egypt thru Alexander; One to cover Early Rome through Atilla; One to cover Medieval and Renaissance warfare; One to cover Gunpowder through 1900; One to cover 1901 (flight) through 1946 (nuclear) After which Hubert can take a rest before embracing the age of MADD! Yeah, yeah, okay Mr C., choose your pictograph ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pzgndr Posted November 21, 2003 Share Posted November 21, 2003 What SC2 really needs is sharks with frickin' lasers on their heads. What about SC right now? I'm sure someone with talent could come up with an imaginative and humorous graphics and sound mod package. Sharks for subs. T-Rex for tanks. War elephants for armies. Etc. Might break the monotony, eh? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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