1939 Campaign Mod

[pzgndr]

A 1939 Fall Weiss Campaign Mod is now available at Strategic Command HeadQuarters. This mod provides players some additional balance for use with v1.06. There is increased emphasis on the North Atlantic and North Africa campaigns. The British and French start with some additional units, while the Germans start with a slight advantage in technology and experience. Adjustments to research reflect more accurate starting tech levels and capabilities for all nations. Many ideas come from Dgaad, Martinov, and others. Primary intent of this mod is to provide subtle changes to the existing Fall Weiss scenario rather than include numerous additional units to address various historical details. As always, players are free to edit this and other scenarios as they see fit. Comments are welcome. Bill Macon (pzgndr@hotmail.com)

Britain

-------------------

- HQ "Wavell", Army "8th Army", and Tank Group "Western Desert Force" start in Egypt at strength 2.

- Army "BEF" starts in Great Britain at strength 2.

- Cruiser "Lend Lease" starts at St. Johns at strength 5.

- Canada starts at war, Canadian I Corps and 1st Army converted to British units for HQ control, Tank Group "Canadian" starts in Canada at strength 2.

- Sonar tech reduced to level 0.

- Jet Aircraft, Heavy Bombers, and Gun Laying Radar techs increased to level 1, but all units start at strength 10.

- Atlantic fleets slightly repositioned.

- Strategic bombers repositioned to prevent deployment to Irelend on Turn 1 for U-boat spotting.

- Britain starts with 1 research point.

France

-------------------

- Armies deployed in the Maginot line start entrenched at level 4.

- Tank Group "DCR" starts in France at strength 2.

- Atlantic fleets slightly repositioned.

- France starts with 125 MPPs (1/2 research point).

Soviet Union

-------------------

- Heavy Tanks tech increased to 2, but all units start at strength 10.

- USSR starts with 3 research points.

USA

-------------------

- Industrial Technology increased to level 2.

- USA starts with 2 research points.

Germany

-------------------

- All German HQs, Airfleets and Armies start at experience level 1 to reflect their superior doctrinal & operational advantage at this stage of the war.

- Corps deployed in Essen and Cologne start entrenched at level 2.

- Battleship "Bismarck" starts in Kiel at strength 2.

- Heavy Tanks and Jet Aircraft techs increased to level 1, but all units start at strength 10.

- Advanced Subs tech increased to level 2 and Atlantic subs start with experience level 1, but all units start at strength 10.

- Atlantic subs slightly repositioned.

- Germany starts with 1 research point.

Italy

-------------------

- -5 entry to make entry date more historical.

- Italy starts with 125 MPPs (1/2 research point).

Poland

-------------------

- Positions of some units moved.

Comments

-------------------

- North Atlantic U-boat war is slightly more balanced. Allies can still defeat the Atlantic U-boats in 1939, but should proceed more cautiously or risk higher casualties. Early British research should include sonar or risk tougher challenges later in the war.

- Germans receive more technology and experience benefits at start, but Allies receive some additional units at low strength. Additional British forces in Egypt make Allied AI more challenging and provide more emphaisis on the North Africa campaign. The South Africa transport loop allows for additional reinforcement of Egypt.

- Revised research rules in v1.06 significantly slow down German tech advances and allow the Allies to close the gap. Slightly increased research capability of US and USSR will help turn the tide. Luck will continue to play a role, but it should be less significant.

- USSR is not changed much by the mod, but changes to Russian supply rules and partisans in v1.06 provide a greater challenge for the Axis player.

- Overall, this mod provides a relatively balanced solo game for either Axis or Allies on the Intermediate +1 settings. Higher settings provide a greater challenge. Default game options should be: Disable Undo ON, all Rules/Variations ON except Free French and War in Siberia, and all Politics RANDOM.

- Players should use Free French option for Axis handicap. British cruiser "Lend Lease" was added to help compensate for no Free French fleets and to represent surplus American destroyers. "Canadian" Tank Group was added and Canadian units converted to British for HQ control purposes. These Allied advantages help compensate for no Free French.

- Players should use War in Siberia option for Allied handicap. War in Siberia significantly penalizes the Allied player, but could be played with Soviet Partisans OFF as an interesting variation.

Additional comment. I've been able to defeat the AI on Intermediate +1 settings as both Axis and Allies by 1944 with this mod, so I think it's relatively balanced. Add some higher settings or throw in the Free French for the Allied AI or War in Siberia for the Axis AI for a real challenge. Enjoy!

[JerseyJohn]

Downloaded it; looking forward to giving your creation a test run.

With the Cape of Good Hope Loop now functional I think North Africa will be more of a factor.

Will start a game vs. the AI and post input as I go along.

I'm sure it's going to be fun, thanks for creating it.

[ December 07, 2002, 11:50 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[jon_j_rambo]

Bill Macon --- What do you mean your '39 mod-campaign provides balance? Is just your historical beliefs & the fact you play against the AI.

Here's the Truth regarding your new set-up:

-----------------------------------------

Western Desert Force --- Strength 2 Tanks & Army units w/ HQ? Are you kidding me? They had boyscouts defending Egypt. I debate the fact England even had a Corp in '39.

Canadians under British control --- I think not.

Tank Group "DCR" starts in France at strength 2 --- Another joke, I could put a layer of Reynold's Wrap around the Acura I drive & slug it out with the French. Giving them artillery would be more historical.

Heavy Tanks tech increased to 2 --- This is insane!!! The Russians have the best tanks in the world in '39? HaHaHaHaHa... It wasn't so. Then you try to hide it with: Oh, but they start at strength 10, BIG DEAL, the first Russia turn they become strength 12.

All German HQ, Air, & Armies start at experience 1 --- Where did they get the experience in '39? Playing paintball & goose-stepping-practice doesn't count. Terrorizing civilians doesn't count either.

Italy --- (-5) for entry point? Dude, just change the setting before you play to historical! Plus Hubert's awesome rules regarding Italy's status rules.

Defeating the AI --- Means nothing.

Human vs Human

Human vs AI

Human vs Rambo

You guys will need a Rambo Patch

Johnny Legend

[JerseyJohn]

"Wait -- he said a Rambo Mod!"

It's good to have varying opinions -- I think it will all eventually average out into one 1939 Mod' everybody agrees with (I also believe in the Easter Bunny!).

Sounds like Rambo's put considerable thought into this -- eager to see the results.

[ December 07, 2002, 02:22 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Konstantin V. Kotelnikov]

Has anyone written a campaign where war breaks out in 1938 over Czechoslovakia? You can even go as far back as war breaking out in 1936 over Germany entering the Rheinland.

Of course something interesting would be a nuetral Poland. So you could decide to declare war on it or wait. A lot of the german generals felt the war started too early.

Or is this just not possible within the framework of the game?

-dave

[JerseyJohn]

Konstatin V. Kotelnikov

You might want to post your ideas in Carl von Mannerheim's Official New Scenario Forum

which is a bit farther back by now. The idea is to get everyone's scenario ideas organized in one place instead of scattered about. Also, people who have put out scenarios can more easily add suggestions and comments.

[ December 07, 2002, 01:06 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[J P Wagner]

I don't think you can edit the calender....

[JerseyJohn]

No, you can't. The only way is to see it as a different year. With the game calander going up to mid-47 now, it's six of one and half dozen of the other to say Sept '39 is really Sept '38, etc..

If I had all the changes I'd like in the scenario editor, there'd be a map creator (perhaps even with a random map option) and a calendar editor -- possibly a way to use this game system for other eras, such as 19th century, by blocking certain research areas or making them very slow and being able to make true WW I scenarios.

Maybe those little extras could be included in a V 2.0 DELUXE package. It would cost more but would be a combination of the conventional SC and a universal wargame creater with a true scenario editor and map builder (where hex's could be altered and changed, creating new maps entirely).

Even with a comprehensive wargame maker and randomizing map maker There would still be as great a market, perhaps greater, for the basic SC game and off shoots (Pacific War). The majority of people who enjoy making their own scenarios would still want to see how the professionals are doing it.

[ December 07, 2002, 07:03 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[JerseyJohn]

Bill Macon

Gave your MOD the once over in the scenario editor and it looks very good. I like the way you incorporated dgaad's and Martinov's ideas with your own. The altered research is an improvement.

The only things I have a gripe with involve the game mechanics and not your MOD. At this point I'm confident even those issues will vanish with V 2.0. Meanwhile, your MOD helps deal with many of the previous issues.

The Western Desert Force is very interesting in itself. Hopefully the AI won't send the HQ canoeing westward across the Mediteranean as it's done in the past!

I'm looking forward to a game vs the AI later today and a PBEM in a few days.

[ December 07, 2002, 03:04 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Wolfpack]

Biggest improvement I noticed was the UK desert force. While it may not be perfectly historical, it does change things up a lot. Usually once Italy enters I embark my african troops to take out Greece, and when I did it this time, I looked back a few turns later to see that the Brits had romped across North Africa and taken my cities. Makes it a bit harder to go off on wild adventures with the Italians.

[pzgndr]

Bill Macon --- What do you mean your '39 mod-campaign provides balance?

I'll take some nominal credit for tweaking this scenario, but the efforts of others have been fully acknowledged and they deserve credit for helping to make the original scenario somewhat more realistic and historically accurate. It's not perfect nor intended to be; it is what it is. But as I commented, it provides reasonably good balance for play against the AI using v1.06. I was busy with the original scenario during TCP/IP playtesting, so I can't comment on the play balance of this mod in human games.

Let's consider some of the current limitations of the game. Inability to edit Italian or Soviet units with the editor. A take-it-or-leave-it Free French option. A rather abstract representation of historical units, their strengths, their experience, their tech levels. It's all VERY subjective. Martinov has taken a more literal approach and attempts to include every at-start historical unit in his Blitzkrieg mods. I'm not convinced this is the way to go right now; however, it deserve further study. Dgaad took a more subtle approach with his Historicity mod, and I choose to build on this. The "perfect" mod is still out there somewhere.

Trying to make every scenario "accurate" and enhancing the game mechanics in SC2 to make gameplay more "realistic" will be continuing challenges. For now, I'm interested in more feedback on these mods for future updates. I fully expect someone else, perhaps even you Rambo, to take these efforts one step further and offer other improvements. Regardless, players are free to play the original scenarios, any of the mods presented so far, or create their own vision of perfection.

[Desert Dave]

As originally posted by Bill Macon:

Regardless, players are free to play the original scenarios, any of the mods presented so far, or create their own vision of perfection.

Very true.

This campaign sounds intriguing and I shall play it and provide some feed-back.

Eventually, we may well reach a consensus on what is the best, and most balanced '39 scenario. Until then, everyone! let's have more mod ideas!

[JerseyJohn]

Bill Macon --

Tried the MOD twice thru Sept. 41; stopped there both times due to the same occurence. With Germany following it's historical path, Pol-Den-Nor-Low Countries-France-Yug after coup-Russia (summer '41) -- and the United States entered the war on the first turn of September 1941! . It happened exactly that way both times.

The initial settings weren't touched, US = 0%, USSR = 30%. I can't see any reason this should happen. It has to either be the scenario or the patch.

Other than America's entry, everything went as in the actual war and almost exactly on schedule!

[ December 08, 2002, 02:51 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[pzgndr]

I noticed in a playtest game with the original scenario the US entered in October 41, but we figured it might have something to do with Allied casualties. Maybe there's something else going on with the US triggers, or something was introduced in the patch that skews the game, so I don't think it's the mod itself. I just tried to tweak it by making US readiness -5 or -10 but the editor will not accept negative values.

Maybe Hubert can provide some insight on what's happening because I can't explain it. If the Axis follows a historical strategy, the US should not be entering early. Perhaps with all the other v1.06 changes that effectively slow down the Germans a little and provide a slight boost to the US then maybe the historical entry option for the US is more appropriate now as a default.

I've had regular games where the US has not entered until mid-42 if the Axis is less aggressive, as if Pearl Harbor doesn't happen. The downside of using historical entry is if Sealion occurs then the US just sits back and watches, and that's not right. However, if you intend to follow a historical Axis strategy and knowing that the Axis AI never attempts an early Sealion, then historical US entry for solo games should be considered.

[JerseyJohn]

That sounds good. I hate putting it in neutral and there's no reason it would be the mod.

In the two games played I was deliberately trying to do things on the historical schedule --Barbarossa came off a little late both times but was launched during the summer of 41 with the described results; will put USA on historical in future games.

I think the taking of London should accelerate U. S. entry -- FDR would have found a way to get the United States in the war if he thought Britain was going under. It's odd that it has the opposite effect and instead it's Barbarossa that's the big stimulus!

[ December 08, 2002, 11:45 AM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

It's odd that it has the opposite effect and instead it's Barbarossa that's the big stimulus!

Actually, it isnt a surprise that Barbarossa is the bigger stimulus. Publicly, Roosevelt came of as England sypathetic, and in many cases he truly was. However, if London/England fall, the US Should Go up 30% on the war readiness. However, when Russia is invaded, the US W.E should jump up 40%-45%, this would simulate Roosevelt political 'oneness' with the USSR.

CvM

[JerseyJohn]

CvM --

Interesting viewpoint. I see it a little differently: that FDR, prior to America's entry to the war, put Britain's survival as America's main concern. After America's entry -- knowing Britain was now secure -- he shifted much of his concern to Soviet Russia because he didn't want Stalin signing a seperate peace with Hitler, freeing Germany to concentrate on the West!

Also, it made sense to assist Russia as much as possible because it was tying up so much of Germany's resources, making possible a US/British second front on the continent.

In a sidenote, during the fifties and sixties a lot of the "better dead than red " type Americans used to talk about FDR and Ellanor being "dirty commies" who sold us to the Russians! They'd tie Roosevelt's domestic programs into it as well, calling them socialistic.

I still come across many people who hold those beliefs, some going so far as to say Roosevelt covered up Soviet spies in the U. S. (principally Los Alamos).

NEXT TWO PHOTOS: Between plan and execution two thirds of the "Western Team" disappeard (FDR's death and Churchill's replacement as head of state). Only Stalin remained of the original Big Three.

None of which is my personal opinon; I think FDR was a pragmatist who tried to use Russia to fight Germany but didn't see the "Cold War" consequences. An understandable result as those events transpired after his death and the final defeat of Nazism.

[ December 08, 2002, 01:45 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[JayJay_H]

Originally posted by JerseyJohn:

CvM --

[...]and the final defeat of Nazism.

Who said its defeated at all

Immagini di repertorio su UFO e fenomeni paranormali

-6 As you arrive at HQ, you are hurriedly congratulated by your commanding officer and whisked by car to a nearby airstrip, where you and he board a specially modified JU-88. The plane quickly takes off, your destination, Switzerland, and then beyond. As a high ranking and decorated SS officer, you are the benefactor of a special "postwar" plan. The weather in Buenos Aires is very pleasant this time of year.

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

Originally posted by JayJay_H:

[QB

Immagini di repertorio su UFO e fenomeni paranormali

-6 As you arrive at HQ, you are hurriedly congratulated by your commanding officer and whisked by car to a nearby airstrip, where you and he board a specially modified JU-88. The plane quickly takes off, your destination, Switzerland, and then beyond. As a high ranking and decorated SS officer, you are the benefactor of a special "postwar" plan. The weather in Buenos Aires is very pleasant this time of year.[/QB]

That my friend, is a FooFighter in that picture.

CvM

[JayJay_H]

Originally posted by Carl Von Mannerheim:

</font><blockquote>quote:</font><hr />Originally posted by JayJay_H:

[QB

Immagini di repertorio su UFO e fenomeni paranormali

-6 As you arrive at HQ, you are hurriedly congratulated by your commanding officer and whisked by car to a nearby airstrip, where you and he board a specially modified JU-88. The plane quickly takes off, your destination, Switzerland, and then beyond. As a high ranking and decorated SS officer, you are the benefactor of a special "postwar" plan. The weather in Buenos Aires is very pleasant this time of year.

That my friend, is a FooFighter in that picture.

CvM[/QB]</font>

[JerseyJohn]

JayJay_H and Carl von Mannerheim --

Great stuff -- for once I'm almost speachless. Guess they weren't defeated, just moved to Groom Lake after the war.

"The United States begins it's own advanced research program."

[ December 08, 2002, 06:15 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[Carl G. E. von Mannerheim]

So thats what tech 6 jets look like

CvM

[JayJay_H]

Originally posted by Carl Von Mannerheim:

So thats what tech 6 jets look like

CvM

your SO DAMN RIGHT

Dont anyone of you anytime believe its all over

Maybe that we wont be alive to see but Nothing will ever keep the post-war-plan away from beeing fulfilled

Some new prototoype of Wenherr von Brauns undefeatable V-Weapons - still held in disguise

[ December 08, 2002, 06:44 PM: Message edited by: JayJay_H ]

[JerseyJohn]

Shhhhhh-- nobody's supposed to know that's an L-6!

[ December 08, 2002, 06:37 PM: Message edited by: JerseyJohn ]

[pzgndr]

I've sent an update to Otto for posting. v1.01

fixes hex control for Brest and renames cruiser "RCN" for Royal Canadian Navy. I don't know how Brest became British - sorry.

Warsaw can be taken on turn 1 now with the Pomorze Army moved north to Danzig in the mod setup. Thus Poland could surrender on turn 1 unless it holds out for another turn. This may be too fast. I've got one vote to change back to original setup. Yeas or nays?

Any comments on the U-boat war? If one or both subs break past the Allied screen, the British Admiralty raises hell. I think the revised tech levels for subs and sonar work OK, but I'm looking for independent assurances. If it's not working out, I can make changes.

Any other comments?