Gyrene Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 I wanted to add POW's to the start of a scenario I'm working on (To keep the allies from simply destroying the Axis fortifications, and adding an extra dimension to the game involving their rescue), and I'm wondering if this can be done. Does anyone know of a way to do this? I tried to panic/exhaust/run out the ammo of half squads placed next to enemy units, but they just get anhilated by fighting back, instead of surrendering. Is this even possible? Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warmaker Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 More than likely they'll get shot up real bad at the onset of the fight. Even those that surrender during the hail of bullets stand a real chance of getting killed since they're at the target area. Sure, some may survive (depending on how many there are) The thing is, if enemy troops (captors) are nearby as gaurds and if they have ammo, they'll use them ASAP on the enemy. I like the idea though with busting POWs out and watching the use of your firepower (very judicous use of MG and HE fire). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted June 12, 2001 Author Share Posted June 12, 2001 Warmaker, IIRC one of the Skorzenny scenarios involved freeing POW's along with a raid on a truck yard, but as I got my butt handed to me on that one I never got to see if there were POW's or not. I'll have to look at that scenario again from the Allies' side. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannheim Tanker Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Gyrene: Warmaker, IIRC one of the Skorzenny scenarios involved freeing POW's along with a raid on a truck yard, but as I got my butt handed to me on that one I never got to see if there were POW's or not. I'll have to look at that scenario again from the Allies' side. Gyrene<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Where can I D/L this scenario? Sounds like fun...TIA! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 I would suggest that it is possible to put the POW units in in the scenario surrounded by full strength captor units. To do this so the captive units don't shoot back, I would make them routed or broken AND exhausted. For each captive unit you place on the map you would have to go in and set those optional settings to broken and exhausted, or just shaken and exhausted, this should make their will to fight, just about nill (AND BTW at this point you could set their Ammo load to 0, so they can't shoot back) and then in the game as you test it (hint hint) MAYBE if they are surrounded they will just naturally surrender? This will take some tweeking as there is no actual "POW" state that the captive units can actually start with, but they can begin the game surrounded by healthy units and they can be set to be exhausted and broken, which should make them surrender. Has anyone ever tried this before? -tom w [ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] [ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Posted June 12, 2001 Share Posted June 12, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by aka_tom_w: I would suggest that it is possible to put the POW units in in the scenario surrounded by full strength captor units. To do this so the captive units don't shoot back, I would make them routed or broken AND exhausted. For each captive unit you place on the map you would have to go in and set those optional settings to broken and exhausted, or just shaken and exhausted, this should make their will to fight, just about nill (AND BTW at this point you could set their Ammo load to 0, so they can't shoot back) and then in the game as you test it (hint hint) MAYBE if they are surrounded they will just naturally surrender? This will take some tweeking as there is no actual "POW" state that the captive units can actually start with, but they can begin the game surrounded by healthy units and they can be set to be exhausted and broken, which should make them surrender. Has anyone ever tried this before? -tom w [ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ] [ 06-12-2001: Message edited by: aka_tom_w ]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> AFAIK that was tried before by an opponent of mine, and even after setting the potential POWs to Panic/Exhausted(can't set them to Routed/Broken) with no ammo and surrounded by the enemy, they would try to flee then get cut down without surrendering. The chances of a unit surrendering is tied to the Global morale so unless the Global morale can be reduced significantly at the start of a scenario it probably won't work out as planned. Ron Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted June 12, 2001 Author Share Posted June 12, 2001 Mannheim, I can't remember where I got any of the Skornzenny scenarios (CMHQ?) Tom, I tried to panic/exhaust and run the ammo down of the units, but like Ron said they still try to fight. Maybe they have to be completely surrounded and a nearby tank might help to convince them Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Clubfoot Posted June 13, 2001 Share Posted June 13, 2001 Mannheim, The Skorzeny scenarios can be found right here. The scenario mentioned by Gyrene is entitled Hoofin'it. It is a fictional commando raid on the American truckyard at Schadenbach. And to be quite honest, it's not my best work by a stretch. Way too hard. For some real fun, try Higher Ground or Squeeze Play. I have experimented with POW ideas and the nearest workaround I could find was to place Green units with low ammo in the middle of a circle of enemies, also with low ammo. Have all the captors facing 180 deg. away from the intended prisoner. And believe it or not, it's best not to have the POW in a state of panic or otherwise altered disposition. This gives the green unit time to look around at the OBVIOUSLY superior forces, and rationally decide to give up. Having the captors face away from the prisoners lengthens the delay for them to fire upon the intended prisoners. This gives the POW's a longer period of time in which to capitulate. Giving the captors low ammo decreases their probability of firing upon the inferior enemy. Teams(w/ no ammo) and split squads with no HQ units seem to give in the quickest. If the prisoners give up fairly quick, they're usually identified as captured by the enemy before the enemy can fire upon them. However, I didn't do this in Hoofin'it. The dealbreaker for the idea of POW's, is that it not only tells the rescuing player exactly where the (not yet captured)POW's are (lame!), but also gives him an initial look at all the enemy units guarding the intended POW's. Hopefully, CM2 will give us this ability in the editor. Let's hope we can do unarmed but not yet captured soldiers, and knocked out vehicles at the outset of a scenario as well! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gyrene Posted June 13, 2001 Author Share Posted June 13, 2001 Clubfoot, thanks for the hints, I'll try it with the Green units, but the problem of them giving intel to the opponent side is a big one. I really enjoyed the David and Goliath scenario, excellent mountain road map. Gyrene Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aka_tom_w Posted June 13, 2001 Share Posted June 13, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Ron: AFAIK that was tried before by an opponent of mine, and even after setting the potential POWs to Panic/Exhausted(can't set them to Routed/Broken) with no ammo and surrounded by the enemy, they would try to flee then get cut down without surrendering. The chances of a unit surrendering is tied to the Global morale so unless the Global morale can be reduced significantly at the start of a scenario it probably won't work out as planned. Ron<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ok That makes sense Thanks for the Update Ron -tom w Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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