Guest Ace Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Originally posted by Jasper: I don't understand what rockets have to do with selecting German tanks, but I won't stand by and let my favorite weapon system be badmouthed. What you is a shortcoming, I think is a benefit. One of the big benefits of rockets is you don't need the detailed targeting information like you do with lemming artillery. Since no matter what you do, rockets are going to do their own thing seeking out the enemy. So let them! Best to point them in general direction of the enemy and let the rockets figure out what's best. Some rockets will undoubtedly overcome your inaccurate guess, and end up hitting the enemy anyway. Given your ringing endorsement, I might just try them, but only on a large map, so I can run and hide How far from your own troops should you target them. I think I read somewhere else that at least 500m was a good bet. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Agreed (again?). In some cases PzIVs work wonders. Try the "South to Sword" scenario (it is on CD) and you will know. They get a Churchill VI once. But, personally, I find not much difference between a "veteran" to a "regular" tank in shooting situation and they miss almost as much. But still (!!!) I would trade 1 Tiger for 2 PzIVs. Tiger really works great in both AT and infantry support roles. Griffin. Originally posted by jasoncawley@ameritech.net:If you want realistic (no "super-tanks" please, you said) then buy 1 veteran and 3 regular Pz. IVs. Costs only 500 points. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" [This message has been edited by GriffinCheng+ (edited 02-27-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Thanks for the positive nod Cheng I rarely use rockets I prefer good old shells. But get Scipio's sound Mod and go to town. My friend fired 240mm at me the other day and I almost jumped out of my seat when I heard them coming in (I was in view 1 at the time). As far as tanks go I prefer the Tiger but have been using Panthers lately to get used to them. I do like to use one vet unit to "anchor" my AT line. As far as covering for advancing tanks (as always this is dependent on terrain) I like AT guns also. Hidden in a reverse slope they are deadly. Used en masse they can be deadly (on defense usually). The reverse slope is the key. I had a green crew hang on for 2 turns killing one Panther and Gun Damaging another (the crew was being fired on by 4 panthers and one platoon of pioneers). 5 shots hit the hill in front of the gun and countless others flew over. Eventually they ran but still which was my fault for not having them in CO range. Of couse 11 of his friends opened up the next turn and killed off 2 Panthers, 1 Panzer IV and a 250/8. I have not committed my armor or infantry yet but already have hurt the enemy badly. Again develop a style and cultivate it. That is what I have done. When i first started playing I sucked at armor (if you were in a tank you were dead) and artillery (if you were an FO you will hit nothing) but was great with infantry and infantry AT weapons. Well now I am still pretty decent with infantry and infantry AT weapons but have really grown into using armor and am known amongst the group I play with as Mr. Artillery. This took times so stick it out and develop it. It works. My friend uses light armor and infantry and can probably woop anyone. His favorite two tanks are the M5 and Lynx TO ATTACK WITH !!!! So it is all preference. I am ranting. Later ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf [This message has been edited by Priest (edited 02-27-2001).] [This message has been edited by Priest (edited 02-27-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 On topic: I recommend using tanks on attacking rather than assualt guns. As other points out: how one uses them is the key. Stick them together and have multi-tank lock on the same single target. Note, if one gets the tanks too close together, they are likely to become air-strike magnet. Off topic: Priest, you are welcome. (shy) When I hear rockets incoming, I usually duck under the computer table as if it were a trench. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 I agree the turreted tanks are a must for advances. SP Guns, Assault Guns and Tank Destroyers (with a few exceptions) I use as standoff weapons. Same goes for AT guns. A tank's main asset is it's mobility and ability to bring a majority of its fire to bear on any target in any direction. The M1A1 Abrams of today is deadly not because of it's accuracy but because it can bring that precision while moving 40-60 (depending on terrain and govenor settings) mph. That it can do this at an extended range is bonus. Oh and Cheng have you gotten Scipios Heavy Tank MG sounds? On one of the wavfiles you can actually here the casing hitting the tank. Truly awesome. ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Total off-topic: Priest I think it is the Socprio sound mod but I have to check. There are so many mod clotted in my HDD so I am lost which is which. When I hear sounds like a squadron of Concords roaring near, I instantly know something bad gonna happen and duck immediately into cover. When you read this, don't laugh CDIC, I know what you did earlier... Griffin. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viceroy Posted February 28, 2001 Author Share Posted February 28, 2001 Jason Crawley, yes, I meant "realistic" or at least "realisticISH!" I see your point, Pz IV's are cheap and the gun is good enough most of the time. I was defending recently with 2 Fireflies and lost to 4 Pz "Mark 4 Specials". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted February 28, 2001 Share Posted February 28, 2001 Originally posted by Ace: How far from your own troops should you target them. I think I read somewhere else that at least 500m was a good bet. Depends on what cover your guys are in. If they're in buildings you could probably go say 200m. There will be a random shell or two falling all over the place, so personally I wouldn't have anybody (important) under trees if I could help it. It's best to use then as soon as you can: (a) most likely chance hitting the enemy while they are approaching ( since they're moving you can guess where some of them will be in a couple of minutes © best chance to spot a target big enough for rockets (d) as they approach the range will only get shorter 109 Gustav and I disagree on using rockets for dug in infantry. There's a case I'm playing now where I *know* the enemy is in a village. I'd like to start shelling the village sight unseen to: (a) perhaps start suppressing a few of the enemy units ( Slow down or stop his (hidden) maneuvers preparing for my attack *MOST IMPORTANT IMHO* © Maybe get a unit, or two, to route out of cover (d) Maybe get lucky and knock out a gun or something before I can see it. So I can: (a) 'Target Wide' for a couple of minutes with more expensive gun artillery ( 'Target' building by building hoping I guess right © Let'er rip with rockets as I approach - (c1) the range is at it's greatest - (c2) Buys me a minute or two of advancing while the enemy is catching "most" of my rockets. - (c3) Since I'm not targeting individual units (yet) speculative shelling is done with cheap rockets - saving more expensive artillery for more accurate targeting. (d) I'm the Americans - so I don't get rockets - rats! Ok I'll do what the historical practice was - lots of gun artillery. But wait! Cost is based on effectiveness not 'supply and demand' - meaning 105mm US artillery costs substantially the same as 105mm German artillery - so I can't load up on it as I'd like. Guess I'll do it the hard way. Oh well - makes it a more rewarding expirence if can root him out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 . [This message has been edited by Jasper (edited 02-28-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Captitalistdoginchina Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Hi Griffin, Those were not Rockets......later you will find out what it was! But i can testify to Griffins recommendation on the humble Stuart - He did in fact take out my Panther G with the first shot of the game frontaly (I was hulldown) I could not believe it CDIC ------------------ "Death solves all problems - no man no problem" J.V.Stalin, 1918 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John Kelly Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 If you are faced with American Jumbos, you better buy a King Tiger and place him in a hulldown position on an "overwatch" role...escepcially if it's late in the war and the probability of tungsten exists. Sorry, that's my opinion. John Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Don't have to feel sorry, John. I rarely use and face Jumbo in my PBEM games, neither KT, too. But both are vulunerable to side and rear shots. Again, you may find the points better spent on something else, mostly depending of the terrian and opfor style. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mannheim Tanker Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Originally posted by Panzer Leader: You people and your tigers and panthers!Saying all that bad stuff abot the Panzer IV. Geesh! When CM2 comes out it will be a whole new ballgame. You will pray for the day when those Panzer IV's are made available and the Panther will be little more than a pipe dream. ANd the King Tiger -- Ha! That's just a myth, a legend, science fiction even... I vote for the Panzer IVG and the Panzer IIIE! They got CLASS. Problem is, that in the time frame of CM:BO, the MkIV is an old tank. It's still a goody if used cleverly, but there's a lot of tanks out there that can abuse it with ease in late '44-45. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niles Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Originally posted by Viceroy: Need some tips for a good German tank for attacking. I want something that provides a good bang for the buck .... no super tanks please. Depending on the weather and land i.e. (Urban, farm,village etc.) the panther with its speed and reliability would be the best. For night the panther G late, it has infared aiming. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Originally posted by Priest: I agree the turreted tanks are a must for advances. SP Guns, Assault Guns and Tank Destroyers I use as standoff weapons.Assault guns are designed to be used in attack/assault, bringing maximum bang for the buck to the battle. They're supposed to follow behind the advancing infantry screen and destroy enemy strongpoints. To do this there's definitely no need for a turret. Tanks are more multipurpose and supposed to lead the attack in front of the infantry. Once through the enemy MLR they're supposed to speed on to hit deep in the enemy rear. In the timeframe of CMBO assault guns are generally outgunned by and less armoured than tanks, and the defender is more likely to have armour as well. Therefore, in CMBO, assault guns are generally less effective than tanks, even in their field of expertese(sp?). It all ends up with the question of what type of attack you're planning to do. For speed and manoevre you'll need the medium tanks (PzKw IV/V), for a slow and steady attrition StuGs, StuHs or PzKw VI is better. Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Originally posted by niles: For night the panther G late, it has infared aiming.No it hasn't. There were some very few Panthers equipped with IR searchlights and vision devices, but these aren't modeled in CM (because they were so rare). This subject has been thoroughly discussed a couple of times before, so if you want more info; do a search... Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted March 1, 2001 Share Posted March 1, 2001 Olle, you are right with the "assault gun", they are designed to do such job in history but in the game, assualt guns are not very useful in CAME situations, except for being targets. Sounds gamey, right? Griffin. Originally posted by Olle Petersson: Assault guns are designed to be used in attack/assault, bringing maximum bang for the buck to the battle. They're supposed to follow behind the advancing infantry screen and destroy enemy strongpoints. To do this there's definitely no need for a turret. ------------------ "When you find your PBEM opportents too hard to beat, there is always the AI." "Can't get enough Tank?" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts