Deuce Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 I tried to look this up, but gave up after it searched for five minutes without displaying any results. I purchaced Black & White a while ago. As those who've played with it know, it uses a view system where you can "grab" the landscape with your cursor and "pull" yourself around. Also, by holding the wheel down you can orbit and tilt around the position of the cursor. Zoom is handled by rolling the wheel. The system works pretty well for me and after going back to CM after a couple days playing B&W I felt like I had one hand tied behind my back, what used to feel like fairly natural camera control seemed overly difficult to work with. I'm not saying I'd like B&W's system copied directly into CM2 but, are new view control methods being considered? I haven't seen any threads like that myself, and as I mentioned above me search was less than fruitfull. I think there is some room for improvement in the current system. Regards, Deuce Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gen-x87 Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 Just got a copy of B&W last night. I personally find thier system very clunky. I also found the game to be populus 3 with a different name and a different interface. Only Populus 3 was more fun to play. Oh well I would not be too happy having that in CM2. Gen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Fredriksson Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 I have not tried B&W so I can not comment on that. Personally I think the CM interface is pretty good, but there is a thing I would like to see: When zooming in topwards or angular, I would like to have a "continous zoom" (do not know the proper word). ie, instead of fixed zoom-levels, I would like to be able to adjust them myself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMcGuire Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 I have to say I'm rarely happy with CM's camera control, although by now I'm very used to it, of course. Continuous zoom would definitely be nice, as would controlling the view angle continuously. A quarternion-style camera rotation system would be really great (and oh-so-trendy). Heh, Game Dev Magazine has plenty of articles on implementing that in DX (the only thing good about Tomb Raider as far as I can tell). One specific complaint is that at high resolutions you spend a lot of time just dragging the mouse from one edge to the other -- or going down to the buttons then back up into the play area. Yes it's minor if you look at it abstractly, but over the course of several hours of play, it adds up. I also don't like that Ctrl+Click changes your facing, and that it deselects the unit you've selected. I keep catching myself selecting a unit, then Ctrl+Clicking to the target area intending to set orders in the area, then remembering the unit has been deselected. I would also like a pair of keyboard hotkeys to dynamically speed up and slow down how fast the camera scrolls. When I'm crossing a huge map it would be cool to be able to hold down Shift and double my speed, or something along those lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Maastrictian Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 IIRC (though my track record today has been pretty abismal) the camera's vertical levels are fixed in the current CM engine. We won't see any smooth zoom until we get a new engine. Personally I don't think this is a problem, but that's just me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Admiral Keth Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 I have seen B&W, and personally prefer CM's camera views. I'd rather BTS concentrated on game mechanics (such as the reverse slope cover issue), and CM2. Trying to modify the existing system potentially incorporates additional bugs which would raise quit a fuss amongst the CM community. It's the old "If it ain't broke..." thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Commissar Posted April 10, 2001 Share Posted April 10, 2001 Ive recently purchased B&W, and while I love the game and the cameras, I dont see why CM cant keep the camera controls it has. To me, both systems works fairly well, where B&W's camera allows more flexibility but requires a longer time to learn to use properly, while CM's is a bit ridgid but is very easy to control. I say leave it be. Its good as it is. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Emrys Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 The only thing I would like to change about the viewing system is to exchange the commands for panning and lateral tracking. It may just be me, but it feels strange that I can track forward and back just by moving the mouse, but in order to track laterally I have to hit the Shift key. Since I track more than I pan, I spend a lot of time on that shift key. Minor but annoying. Michael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Fredriksson Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by The Commissar: [QI]... while CM's is a bit ridgid but is very easy to control. I say leave it be. Its good as it is.[/QI]<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I would not like to replace the current fixed-view system. What I would like, is to have a compliment to it. I have found myself many times wanting to have an angular level between 2 and 3, 3 and 4, and higher than 4. Same goes with 5, sometimes I wish for a bit closer look, when there are a couple of units closely bunched up in a building, wooded area etc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 Well, I have B&W and I think the camera control is okay and I think it is perfect the game like this. CMBO, otth, it is okay this way, I usually stick to view "3" most of the time and sometime view "1" for plotting hull-down ambushes. Griffin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deanco Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 Yo, I couldn't get anything done with Black and White's mouse control when I first started. But after a couple of days solid playing I actually prefer it now, and am now so used to it that I subconciously try to use it with other games... such as CM. Really though, moving the mouse to the side of the screen and clicking and holding, to turn and tilt is pretty funky. I don't see any advantages over your usual "push" style RTS scrolling. The real innovation here is completely controlling the camera with the middle button IMO. Now THAT is a powerful tool I would like to see implemented. (OT) If anyone would like to see an advance preview of what the new CM2 engine will be capable of (of course, I'm only guessing here), I suggest they pick up a copy of Black and White. The thought of tanks and soldiers moving through terrain like this has me drooling with anticipation, I can tell you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GriffinCheng+ Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 Deanco, how do you like B&W's TnL and other goodies? Sweet for ya eyes, yo? Hehe BTW, I acutally use keyboard all the way in B&W cause it is faster to move around while my mouse do the work. Look for preview for CM2: From Barbarossa to Berlin in June issue of Computer Strategy Plus. I think it is best for Stever&Charles Co. to leave the control as is cause I don't think it is wise to change the whole thing around when most of us have already get used to CMBO control style. Griffin. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Fredriksson Posted April 11, 2001 Share Posted April 11, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by GriffinCheng+: ...I think it is best for Stever&Charles Co. to leave the control as is cause I don't think it is wise to change the whole thing around when most of us have already get used to CMBO control style. Griffin.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You mean we are too old and stuffy to learn new things? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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