116th Panzer Division

[Frenchy]

Looks like the book will be very informative and a goldmine of information for scenarios. Check the page out for specific information.

116th Panzer Division

[Peter Panzer]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>...the 116th Panzer Division was one of the relatively rare German armored formations that fought exclusively on the Western Front. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

...my ass. the 116th division was actually a rather old and highly successful unit - it simply received a new designation when it was shifted to the western front...

...known to the russians in 1943 as the 16th panzergrenadier division, the division was led by count gerhard von schwerin, who was only the third wehrmacht general to receive the knight's cross with oak leaves/swords...

...within a short period, the unit proved itself capable of chopping up ivan with tremendous verve and tenacity, eventually earning the moniker of "greyhound division..."

...apparently, they weren't too bad at grinding up brits and yanks either. initially rated as an "average" division by allied intelligence, the 116th would be upgraded to "superior" within thirty days of the normandy landings...

...the mech troops/tankers of the 116th were some hard-nosed sons of bitches to be sure, worthy of a good look-see, however, it seems as though the well-intentioned authors of the aforementioned book may have fumbled early...

[JasonC]

Actually its lineage was longer than that, though more twisted, too. The 16th Infantry division fought in Poland and France, distinguishing itself in the breakthrough fight at Sedan. After the French campaign, two new formations were formed from it - the 16th motorized infantry and the 16th Panzer divisions. The 16th Motorized was the one that eventually became the 116th Pz.

But first it fought in the Balkans, and then in Army Group South in Russia. It fought in the Crimea and pushed in the Caucasus, and held part of the right flank of the Stalingrad position. It avoided encirclement in the retreat and again fought well. It was upgraded to the 16th Panzergrenadier division in the summer of 1943, before the Kursk campaign. It was not involved in the Kursk attack, but was heavily engaged in the subsequent Russian offensive. It fought heavily in the Dnepr bend battles and by early 1944 was basically destroyed.

It was then pulled out of the line and sent back to western Germany to rebuild. It joined with - or perhaps more accurately, provided a cadre to - the 179th reserve Panzer division. That made the 116th Panzer.

It was then stationed in Pas De Calais, and went to Normandy after the invasion as a reserve behind Caen, but without being engaged at first. (It was also still missing its Panther battalion, which was still training). It was committed after the breakout to try and stop it, and largely destroyed in the process. It has 12 tanks and 600 men left in early October, but fought anyway in Aachen. It then absorbed the 108th Panzer brigade and took replacements, and fought rather successfully in the Hurtgen forest (the Schmitt counterattack). It was brought up to strength for the Bulge, where it had a leading role. But it was largely destroyed yet again in that battle. It still fought more, in the Ruhr pocket in early 45, before surrendering when the pocket fell.

It was thus largely destroyed three times over, once as the 16th Panzergrenadier by the Russians in the Dnepr bend, and twice as the 116th Panzer by the Americans, in Cobra and the Bulge - and a fourth time if you count its final surrender. It also incorporated two other large units during its history, the 179 reserve Panzer division and the 108 Panzer brigade. And it served under 4 different names, 16 Infantry, 16 Motorized, 16 Pz Gdr, and 116 Panzer. In one manifestation or another, it fought the entire war from the invasion of Poland to the collapse of the Ruhr pocket.

Hardly "served only in the west..."

[Mark IV]

Yeah, but...

The author is Heinz Günther Guderian, son of THE Guderian,

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>he entered the German Army as an officer cadet on the eve of the Third Reich on 1 April 1933. Promoted to Second Lieutenant exactly two years later, he served as a platoon leader, battalion and regimental adjutant, and company commander in Panzer Regiments 1 and 35. He saw his first combat during the invasion of Poland, and was wounded twice during the campaign in Western Europe in 1940. Graduating from the General Staff College in 1942, he served in a variety of staff assignments in armored units until being assigned as the Operations Officer for the 116th Panzer Division in May 1942. Although again wounded in action, he held that position until the end of the War... General Guderian’s decorations include the Iron Cross Second and First Classes, the Knight’s Cross of the Iron Cross, the Wounds Badge in Silver, and the Federal German Grand Cross of the Order of Merit.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I'm sure he doesn't know as much about German units in WWII as many of our contributors, but I think he may have some insights of worth. I doubt that the blurb was parsed exactly correctly, but I'm not sure the author penned it. And in any case, the offensive snippet was preceeded by <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Organized in France in March, 1944 from elements of the 16th Panzer-Grenadier Division and the 179th Reserve Panzer Division <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>, so it is technically correct in the strictest sense, eh? And isn't that what we would expect from a Guderian?

[Peter Panzer]

...now ain't this just a whole heap o' learnin' folks?

[JasonC]

"assigned as the Operations Officer for the 116th Panzer Division in May 1942"

So, was he assigned as head of ops 22 months before the division was formed, or to the 16th motorized, or is that a typo in the blurb?

If we are going to worry about technically correct...

[Andreas]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark IV:

Yeah, but...

The author is Heinz Günther Guderian, son of THE Guderian,

, so it is technically correct in the strictest sense, eh? And isn't that what we would expect from a Guderian?<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dust-jacket writing is an artform that few can handle

It is usually not done by the author but by some minion in the dungeons of the publishing company. Anyways, I think I'll get that one. The publisher looks good, and there is far too few German stuff on the market.

Anyway, here is Feldgrau's info. http://www.feldgrau.com/heer116p.html

The division gave the 1st Canadian Army a very hard time during BLOCKBUSTER, part of the battle to clear the west bank of the Rhine. The relevant pages in the South Alberta Regiment's history make for some really chilling reading.

[ 08-11-2001: Message edited by: Germanboy ]

[Gary T]

Hi,

Just out of interest I recently obtained 3 wehrpasses to members of 2.(Panther)/ Pz. Regt. 16. Apparently a number of these were found buried boxes in the Ruhr area. I missed out on two or three others before I got these. Alot of the personnel came from Pz. Abt. 116 (obviously). In turn in a lot of the wehrpasses found, most of the members of Pz. Abt. 116 came from Pz. Rgt. 1 when PZ. Abt. 116 was formed in May 1942. anyone want any scans e-mail me.

Ta,

Gary.

[Madmatt]

Wrong forum, moving thread now.

Madmatt