Phoenix Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 By accident, I discovered (maybe to no ones surprise) that if you place mines close enough to a house...they actually have effect on units entering that house. I even tested it out in a quick test scenario and the unit that ran in the house took 2 casualties. Just thought Id mention it...seems a bit odd. [This message has been edited by Phoenix (edited 01-18-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasoncawley@ameritech.net Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 Mines inside of houses are called booby traps. They were quite common in WW II. A tripwire across a window-frame connected to a grenade, a toe-popper placed under a bit of rubble, etc. Traps or men covering an opening were so common that the German doctrine was to go through windows not the doors, even in villages. And in street fighting inside large cities, they prefered to blow a new hole in the wall or to enter the building on the upper floors - with a ladder or plank or across roofs from another building - because just barging in the doors or even ground-floor windows resulted in extremely high casualties. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted January 19, 2001 Author Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jasoncawley@ameritech.net: Mines inside of houses are called booby traps. They were quite common in WW II. A tripwire across a window-frame connected to a grenade, a toe-popper placed under a bit of rubble, etc. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, that's all fine and dandy, but BTS said they were not going to model booby traps for CM. So are you saying then that this is a "proper" way to simulate booby traps? My bet is it's not what BTS intended. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Madmatt Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 I don't see a problem with this. So the Engineers just covered a few mines i nthe living room with an oriental rug and a chair instead of twigs and brush. Madmatt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bruno Weiss Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 Long as they don't put em in the lavatory. Bad sport to send a feller off to the ever here after with his knickers down. ------------------ "Gentlemen, you may be sure that of the three courses open to the enemy, he will always choose the fourth." -Field Marshal Count Helmuth von Moltke, (1848-1916) [This message has been edited by Bruno Weiss (edited 01-18-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jasoncawley@ameritech.net Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 I have no idea what BTS intended, being neither their employee nor clairvoyant. But mines inside of buildings were a common tactic in WW II. If they did not "mean" to "model" them or something like them, then they should. Certainly, no CM player should have the sense, as he runs a squad toward a building, "whew, at least there won't be any mines in there". Incidentally, there should be more mines in CM, and fewer Jadgtigers. Last I checked, the number of the latter made, barely had 3 digits, while the number of the former deployed by the Germans alone, had 8 digits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted January 19, 2001 Author Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Madmatt: I don't see a problem with this. So the Engineers just covered a few mines i nthe living room with an oriental rug and a chair instead of twigs and brush. Madmatt<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ok. If BTS says it's cool Im down with that!! I just thought it odd that actual AP mines would have any hope of being used in a house with any effectiveness. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted January 19, 2001 Author Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jasoncawley@ameritech.net: Certainly, no CM player should have the sense, as he runs a squad toward a building, "whew, at least there won't be any mines in there". <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Oh really? Hmm..Id be curious how many times people have played games here and EVER found that their guys ran into mines IN a house. I bet you the AI never places mines close enough to a house that they end up "inside" them. You do realize that you can't technically place them *inside* a building. But if you stick them close enough to a building they end up "running over" into the floor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phoenix Posted January 19, 2001 Author Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jasoncawley@ameritech.net: I have no idea what BTS intended, being neither their employee nor clairvoyant. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> No clairvoyance needed. The words right from Steve - Booby traps were used in some circumstances, but generally were not part of frontline combat. The purpose of a booby trap was to cause problems for units that would otherwise not have problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JoePrivate Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Oh really? Hmm..Id be curious how many times people have played games here and EVER found that their guys ran into mines IN a house.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> That's been a favourite tactic for some since the game came out. I guess it can still be a nasty suprise for the unwary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tss Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 jasoncawley@ameritech.net wrote: Mines inside of houses are called booby traps. When Soviets attacked Finland in December 1939, Finns destroyed or trapped pretty much all buildings of the frontier area. One sapper had to destroy his own home. He didn't want to burn it down so he booby-trapped it. However, he also wanted to leave a small possibility of returning after the war and finding the home intact (if it happened that the war would end quickly). So he booby-trapped the kitchen firewood storage box. He put 5-6 AT mines (25-30 kg explosives) in the bottom, constucted a false floor over them, and filled the box with wood. The trigger wire was attached to the piece of wood that would be the last one to be taken out. Soviets captured the village in the second or third day of the war. A large explosion was heard from the direction in mid-January. So, over a month after the building was first occupied and when all suspicions had died, the building exploded on the face of the inhabitants. It is not known what unit was there when it exploded. - Tommi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Heidman Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 That is freaking brutal! Remind me not to piss off the Finns. Jeff Heidman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Aitken Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 Madmatt wrote: > So the Engineers just covered a few mines i nthe living room with an oriental rug and a chair instead of twigs and brush. Dare I say no soldier is going to step on anything bumpy inside a house. Once you've got a bit of debris though, avoiding bumps becomes pretty difficult. jasoncawley wrote: > Incidentally, there should be more mines in CM, and fewer Jadgtigers. Last I checked, the number of the latter made, barely had 3 digits, while the number of the former deployed by the Germans alone, had 8 digits. However, (1) you need mines where you expect the enemy will be, not where he is, and (2) you can't relocate them if you don't use them. I'm not sure tanks and mines is a good comparison. tss wrote: > So he booby-trapped the kitchen firewood storage box. He put 5-6 AT mines (25-30 kg explosives) in the bottom, constucted a false floor over them, and filled the box with wood. The trigger wire was attached to the piece of wood that would be the last one to be taken out. Sounds like the A-Team. =) The wonders of human ingenuity... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Der Unbekannte Jäger Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 This could be a great way to give a CM'er a surprise in a scenario, along with the putting AT guns in houses. ------------------ "The world is wide, and I will not waste my life in friction when it could be turned into momentum." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 The Germans were so notorious with booby-traps that in N. Africa a common practice was "If it doesn't belong to you don't pick it up". As a test a CO left his fountain pen on the ground for a couple of days. ------------------ Check out http://www.geocities.com/funfacts2001/ for military documents written during WWII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wwb_99 Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 I once put mines in a house. Then my troops fled into the house. BOOM! WWB ------------------ Before battle, my digital soldiers turn to me and say, Ave, Caesar! Morituri te salutamus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jarmo Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 <BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jasoncawley@ameritech.net: I have no idea what BTS intended, being neither their employee nor clairvoyant. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I think something can be seen from the fact that AT mines can't be placed overlapping a house. This is clearly an intended feature. I'll have to mine a house sometime soon... Too bad you can't place a big house-destroying booby trap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jasper Posted January 19, 2001 Share Posted January 19, 2001 Great thought Jarmo. It would require that CM have 'sympathic' explosions - one explosion setting off a nearby explosive device. Does it? If so all we need is the explosive. Maybe a suicide Flamethrower team! 'Things' burn, but I'm not sure if I've seen a 'thing' explode. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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