Priest Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 First off this is not the place to discuss the merits of either commander. This is more to the point of CM and it's players. In many walks of life you can draw nasic conclusions. Is someone a saver or a spender? A screamer or a moaner (uhm okay could not resist sorry, young folks just look away)? So now I ask are you a Rommel or a Monty in your basic approach to CM? Personally I started out a Monty but now am very much a Rommel in my view of tactics. I feel that while CM does not cater to one view or the other a persons buying techniques in a QB and use of equipment can be used to further someone's tactical style. My friend and I both buy lots of armor when we fight. I use there mobility to flank and manuevere while he uses them with his infantry forces as mobile strong points in a controlled and measured advance. I advance with thrusts seeking to find an advantage and then dive through weak points rushing past the MLR of my opponent and establishing an anvil that allows me to bring up my reserves as the hammer. Anybody else with ideas on the subject? ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Rommel22 Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 I guess I consider my self "A Rommel" since I use the tactics use describe. I keep my armor seperate from inf. and use the armor to dash at the flanks and behind the enemy lines. I use support vehicles to suppor tthe inf. for example the 251/9 H-track! The Germans don't have armor thats fast as the Hellcat, but the Stugs or the PzIV will do for the tactic. ------------------ Rommel22s Kampfgruppe site: http://rommel22diarys.homestead.com/MyPage1.html "I saw 5 Germans walking down the side of the road, so I followed them for a few yard to get closer. Then I shot them! Later that day I found out the war has been over for a few weeks." - someone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 I'm not so sure the terms "Monty" and "Rommel" are apt. You may want to define how you are using the terms. To muddy the waters, it can be pointed out that Rommel used siege tactics at Tobruk, and Monty used a lightning armoured thrust at Market Garden. I get the impression this is not what you meant, though. The point being, that Rommel acted like a Monty on occasion, and vice versa! The conclusion is that you have to alter your outlook depending on the situation. No doubt your comments about CM not catering to one view or another are on the mark (witness the furore over attrition/maneuver, which is what I think you are getting at). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted March 7, 2001 Author Share Posted March 7, 2001 Ah but Rommels siege at Tobruk did not work (if you are referring to the first time) and didn't Market Garden end badly also (I may be wrong it has been a long day and I haven't read about the European front in awhile so it quite likely i am confused). A commander out of his element is usually at a severe disadvantage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Dorosh Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Good points....most impressive! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted March 7, 2001 Author Share Posted March 7, 2001 Thanks Micheal. By the way the book Knight of the Cross about Rommel is an excellent read. I got mine at Barnes and Noble. ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JunoReactor Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 There is the problem of scale. Sex is a much bigger part of one's life than individual unit tactics are for Monty or Rommel. So the scale of the metaphor is flawed. Other than that, lovely post. [This message has been edited by JunoReactor (edited 03-06-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted March 7, 2001 Author Share Posted March 7, 2001 True True ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fan Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 I think I'm more of a Rommel when it comes to sex, and more like Monty when it comes to CM. Lately though, I've been trying to develop a more aggressive tactical approach in my CM games. I guess I'm lucky and have had the benefit of a solid player taking me under his wing and showing me the error of my ways. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Im mostly a Monty, but do take small steps towards the Rommel style... Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stefan Fredriksson Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Re: Fan Hmmm, using "flanking manoevers" in the sack, eh? Not sure I want to know details Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CombinedArms Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Originally posted by Michael Dorosh: To muddy the waters, it can be pointed out that Rommel used siege tactics at Tobruk, and Monty used a lightning armoured thrust at Market Garden. Another point is that on defense Rommel was heavily into mines (and along the Atlantic wall, reinforced concrete) and wanted to beat the Allies amphibious assault with a more or less static defense at the water's edge (plus armored reserves right on their tail--which Hitler wouldn't let him have.) So, arguably, on defense, Rommel was sort of a Monty himself (this partly enforced by his healthy respect for Allied airpower.) All in all, I'd say slashing maneuver or steady, methodical attack (which I take to be the Rommel or Monty alternatives) seem to me to be dictated--in CM--by the terrain and tactical situation. Even Patton--the Allies Rommel counterpart--had to slow down and lay siege (which he wasn't at first good at but eventually mastered) when he hit the West Wall. It's good to be able to switch from one style to another based on the situation, and even a given scenario might call for both in succession--e.g. an initial methodical advance, then slashing strokes when a weak point is found, or, on the other hand, a fast run toward objective flags in a meeting engagement, then a methodical assault once the enemy is encountered.--Just some words in favor of tactical flexiblity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olle Petersson Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Coming to think of it: For QBs, where point costs are a factor, CM seems to favour manoeuvre warfare (Rommel style)... And mostly so for the Allies! (Don't have time to develop my thoughts in detail right now, but will do it later.) Cheers Olle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tanaka Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Originally posted by Priest: Ah but Rommel siege at Tobruk did not work ... One of the most brilliant "moves" of E. Rommel was the DAK escape of El-Alamein... As you know it wasn't a victory Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest machineman Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Originally posted by Olle Petersson: For QBs, where point costs are a factor, CM seems to favour manoeuvre warfare (Rommel style) That is historical, from what I have read. Monty's victories were won with massive superiority in men and materials and he was very lucky to take over in Africa when the British were on a supply bonanza. He could afford to fight battles of attrition and grind his opponents down, WWI style. CM doesn't give enough of an advantage to make that method work very well. [This message has been edited by machineman (edited 03-07-2001).] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted March 7, 2001 Author Share Posted March 7, 2001 In QB's I find that either side can use manuevore to it's fullest. Yes the Allies have some faster armor but I find that the Panther and Panzer IV can run and gun (especially the Panther) better then the Allies. And I agree that Rommels ideas concerning defense in Europe where more in line with Monty's doctrine but it was a situation that somewhat forced this on him. Rommel was no fool. In Africa while the Germans and Italian high command wanted a step by step bloody holding action retreat Rommel wanted to bring his forces together in Tunsia and defend. Also a quirk is that Rommel loved mass AT guns. Not what us folks in CM would consider a highly mobile piece of equipment. ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever Babra Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 I'm more of a McClellan myself. I really hate to see my beautiful legions get all kil't and maimed and broken. I'd much rather have a parade! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter White Posted March 7, 2001 Share Posted March 7, 2001 Originally posted by Forever Babra: I'm more of a McClellan myself. I really hate to see my beautiful legions get all kil't and maimed and broken. I'd much rather have a parade! I am more of a Varro myself. I like to create what appears to be an irresistible concentration of firepower, order my tanks and infantry support vehicles to cross paths and bump into each other, and leave myself wide open to counteratttacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Monty Posted March 8, 2001 Share Posted March 8, 2001 I concider myself a ... MONTY - Place your units carefully - Be sure your not outnumbered - Study the battleplan again and again - Advance Monty aka Moose Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Forever Babra Posted March 8, 2001 Share Posted March 8, 2001 Originally posted by Peter White: I am more of a Varro myself. I like to create what appears to be an irresistible concentration of firepower, order my tanks and infantry support vehicles to cross paths and bump into each other, and leave myself wide open to counteratttacks. LOL!!! "Publius Quinctillius Varo, give me back my Legions!" - Augustus Caesar, AD 9 ------------------ "Za Rodentia!" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Priest Posted March 8, 2001 Author Share Posted March 8, 2001 Well if it is any consolation most of my cool manuevers end up being a nice representation of "Pickett's Charge!" ------------------ Sir are you sure you want to go to red alert...it would mean changing the bulb -Kryton of Red Dwarf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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