Determinant Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Does TacOps model time of flight for ATGW? The visual representation, in TacOps 3 at least, shows the pop-smoke-line-splash as happening all at once, but is there more going on 'under the hood' so to speak? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 No, if you look closely you sometimes see ATGMs launched one in 15-second period and arriving in the next (while as you say the mayority of shots arrive in the same period). And it works game mechanics wise, of you supresse the shooting unit while the missle is underway the ATGM drops. This is a major disadvantage of the Russian ATGMs with their lower speed and it is modeled. I am not quite sure supression and drop can happen within the same 15-secs period, I would assume in that case it isn't launched in first place. Major? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Determinant Posted June 10, 2003 Author Share Posted June 10, 2003 Originally posted by redwolf: No, if you look closely you sometimes see ATGMs launched one in 15-second period and arriving in the next (while as you say the mayority of shots arrive in the same period). Ahh, I hadn't noticed that. 'Tis indeed a very fine simulation indeed. I suppose that most ATGWs will have a time of flight under 15 seconds except at very long range. Milan (which bears a striking external resemblance to Spandrel - I wonder are they in any way related ) takes 13 seconds or so to get out to its max range. So operator suppression is modelled. Excellent. But a further dumb supplementary. I know 'pop smoke' is an SOP for vehicles when fired upon. Will targets pop smoke while the ATGW is still inbound thus increasing the chance of a miss? Thanks for the clarification. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted June 10, 2003 Share Posted June 10, 2003 Hm, that's a very fine question, and the answer is probably different for ATGMs witin the same time period and those flying over a period boundary. Smoke does decrease the accuracy of weapons with thermal sights and normally disables shooting of non-thermal sight weapons. I guess dropping the ATGM or making it less accurate after launch is not modeled, but we would have to wait for the major to comment. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted June 11, 2003 Share Posted June 11, 2003 >Will targets pop smoke while the ATGW is still >inbound thus increasing the chance of a miss? No. I think that tactic has been exagerated in games. I don't think it is likely that there would be enough time to notice an incoming ATGM, then pop smoke, and then have the smoke develop enough to obscure the target as it changes its direction or position. Might of been possible against the Swatter or Sagger ATGMs of the 60s. [ June 11, 2003, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: MajorH ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redwolf Posted June 11, 2003 Share Posted June 11, 2003 Thanks. Is there a chance to make an ATGM drop target by supressing the shooter if the departute and arrival is in the same 15-second phase? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted June 11, 2003 Share Posted June 11, 2003 No. You need to obtain suppression before the ATGM launches. [ June 11, 2003, 02:00 PM: Message edited by: MajorH ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim A Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 Originally posted by MajorH: No. I think that tactic has been exagerated in games. I don't think it is likely that there would be enough time to notice an incoming ATGM, then pop smoke, and then have the smoke develop enough to obscure the target as it changes its direction or position. Might of been possible against the Swatter or Sagger ATGMs of the 60s. Major, perhaps a more specific question. When is smoke "popped" due to SOP setting? Is it popped at the end of a 15 second round or at the end of the turn? If popped at the end or even during a 15 second round then I assume that will affect subsequent ATGM launches either in the same round or later rounds. Is that correct? And a stupid question. I had assumed or thought I read actually, that popping smoke is a total waste of time against thermal units but it sounds like there is chance of decreasing hit probability. Is this true? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 > When is smoke "popped" due to SOP setting? At the end of the 15 second game pulse in which the event occurred that triggered the SOP item - but after all direct fire has been resolved for that 15 second pulse. > I assume that will affect subsequent ATGM launches either in > the same round or later rounds. Is that correct? Yes - if the ATGMs do not have thermal sights. > I had assumed or thought I read actually, that popping smoke > is a total waste of time against thermal units but it > sounds like there is chance of decreasing hit probability. > Is this true? Smoke does decrease hit probability even vs thermal sights. However some argue that the speed reduction that a unit suffers in TacOps while in smoke is not worth the decrease in hit probability. [ June 28, 2003, 09:49 AM: Message edited by: MajorH ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim A Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 Originally posted by MajorH: Smoke does decrease hit probability even vs thermal sights. However some argue that the speed reduction that a unit suffers in TacOps while in smoke is not worth the decrease in hit probability.How about dropping smoke either on the firing units or in between the firing unit and target? Again, I had assumed this was useless so stopped doing this. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted June 28, 2003 Share Posted June 28, 2003 Smoke on a target unit reduces hit probability for thermal sights. Smoke on a firing unit or between a firing unit and a target unit does not currently reduce hit probability for thermal sights. [ June 28, 2003, 03:04 PM: Message edited by: MajorH ] 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim A Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 Originally posted by MajorH: Smoke on a target unit reduces hit probability for thermal sights. Smoke on a firing unit or between a firing unit and a target unit does not currently reduce hit probability for thermal sights. By "currently", do you mean that is on the list for a future enhancement? 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted July 6, 2003 Share Posted July 6, 2003 Its on the "think about it" list. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tim A Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 I wouldn't want to know how many lists you are maintaining there Major 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MajorH TacOps Developer Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 The TacOps suggestion folder and wish list currently contain 1,575 items. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Gilbert Posted July 8, 2003 Share Posted July 8, 2003 1,575 items !!!! :eek: You should post that list somewhere so we can quit asking for the same thing! Maybe even save you a few hours a week answering emails on items already on the list. Of course, then someone would want the list prioritized because they would want to know what to look for next ... on second thought ... DON'T publish that list. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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