To All New & Relatively New Members!

[Seanachai]

Okay, I'm neither experienced enough nor have been here for a long enough time to even be described as one of "the Immortals", but I can already see a pattern forming.

There's currently a large influx of new members due to the actual release of the game, combined with the proselytizing efforts of the Combat Missionaries, etc.

And many of you/us/them are asking the same questions over and over (sometimes on the same page of threads), and many of those questions have been dealt with previously on this board (some topics may actually have led to the extinction of the dinosaurs...)

For new members, please keep in mind that some of the people on this board (not me, mind you, I'm a relative newcomer) have been discussing some of these issues for over 2 years. Almost any issue you can think of has often been discussed, often at incredible length, and often to the point where some people sit in their foxholes, silent and brooding, and honing a finer edge on their bayonets and obsessing.

So, when you post, you newer people, you will find many, many helpful souls who will try to answer your questions. Sometimes they may be somewhat concise, or even brusque, but that's because you're getting an answer that's been refined down by endless argument and discussion. Sometimes you will be told, usually politely, to use the search function. That's not because people aren't trying to be helpful. It's because they're directing you to the most thorough-going and fully discussed answer to your question. And while there are so many threads and posts as to be completely daunting, it's still the most complete source you are going to find.

When I first showed up here, I quickly learned to withhold questions and to refine search terms to check on issues/tactics/bugs/ and info of every kind. True, I often had to wade through a ton of posts to find what I wanted, but sometimes I found info on other things I hadn't gotten around to asking yet, sometimes I found info it hadn't occured to me to ask, many times I found fascinating discussions on historical and/or game characteristics that made me appreciate the whole process of creating Combat Mission. And in many cases if led me to posts that were just a firking howl. You will find facts, wisdom, and knowledge, and you will find it about equally mixed with gibberish, inanity, and complete crap. But I've been forums, and I have to say that my searches here have resulted in the best collection of posts of any forum I've been on.

Beyond the info that searches will garner you, you'll begin to come up with a picture of the many, many people that have contributed directly, or indirectly through posts on this forum, to the process of creating Combat Mission. So you'll get a feel for what these people are like, and the variety of their experiences. And from this you'll develop a new terrain map: who will make good PBEM opponents, who won't; who's worldview you share, and those you don't (but many who still seem to be fine people with their own contributions to make). Who's the best source to go to for serious grognard info, and who's the best to talk to for bawdy songs. And more than any other forum I've seen, this one involves people from all over the world. And you'll discover a large world of books, URLs, movies, and even music that will interest you by searching this forum.

So, if you're new here, use search, unless your question is one that can be quickly and easily answered. And if you ask something and people seem to ignore you, or are curt with you, realize that this forum has been in operation for something like 3 years. And if you've played the game for 4 hours, and sign on to say you don't think that x factor is properly executed, and demand it be immediately changed, then don't be surprised if most people just laugh at you, and try using search. If you've seriously got a contribution to make, it will be listened to with great attentiveness. If you've watched every war movie ever made and aren't happy with how your last Quick Battle went, then please consider searching before posting here. Chances are, your question/demand/observation has been dealt with before, and the blind posting of uninformed opinions based on no experience, no research, and no true knowledge will only earn you amused contempt, at best. There are many people here with a vast amount of specialized knowledge. Right or wrong, you'd better be ready to meet it.

------------------

After witnessing exceptional bravery from his Celtic mercenaries, Alexander the Great called them to him and asked if there was anything they feared. They told him nothing, except that the sky might fall on their heads.

[MrPeng]

Well said, MrSenileTea!

------------------

A Journey of a thousand miles starts with a single gunshot wound to the foot.

[bauhaus]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by MrPeng:

Well said, MrSenileTea!

<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

for you Peng

[Stuka]

Fight, Fight, Fight!

====== (Sorry)

[KMHPaladin]

Excellent point - I'm a newcomer to this forum (though I've been a member of other forums for some time) and I can understand exactly what you're talking about. Thanks very much for the advice, I'll try to remember it.

------------------

KMHPaladin

KHarkins@voicenet.com

"We have the enemy surrounded. We are dug in and

have overwhelming numbers. But enemy airpower is

mauling us badly. We will have to withdraw."

-- Japanese infantry commander, SITREP, Burma

[Guest Germanboy]

There is also the risk, as Fionn rightly pointed out in another thread, that there may be people without the manual who try to get the info through the board. By answering obvious questions, we would then not only indulge people who are too lazy to open the manual, but might also harm BTS's sales. Maybe best point the people to the manual. I also wonder how much interest people really have who ask a question again for the second time a day (e.g. mortars). This is quite disrespectful of other people's time, I feel. Also adds to the background noise on the board.

------------------

Andreas

[hnh3_cm]

So, newbies are to be seen as pirates until proven innocent?! What has this board come down to!

Each day I see the 'established' members becoming more and more short with people who may not only be new to this game, but to forums in general. Many questions that could be answered very quickly are, instead met with a semi-rant about 'searching' that is five times longer than a simple answer would have been.

Sadly, I've seen many forums devolve into nothing but cults centered around a few prominent members that are considered too sacrosanct to question, with newbies being harassed so much that they, rightfully, think 'Screw this, I'll look for another game, mod, etc. to enjoy'.

I'm not saying that this forum is anywhere close to that bad, of course. But everyone should do their dead level best to remember that they were newbies at one time and then treat others accordingly.

If anybody has been involved with the ActionQuake2 or Counter-Strike forums, you'll know why I am so concerned. And you wouldn't want to be compared with the 'twitch' type, would you?

Hey! Smilie hired bodyguards!

[Guest herbjorn]

Perhaps someone would have the time to compile some of the old posts and make an enlarged FAQ similar to what was done with all the fixes and questions regarding the nvidia geforce 3D chip, quite impressive

http://www.geforcefaq.com/

it could be called www.cmfaq.com

[Guest Germanboy]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by hnh3_cm:

So, newbies are to be seen as pirates until proven innocent?! What has this board come down to!<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

That is not what I said, and I would be glad if instead of going into overdrive you could just read a bit more closely.

If you look at my history of posts you will see that I have (almost) always made a point of welcoming new members to the board and pointing them in the right direction with their inquiries.

Here I was referring to people who either:

a) waste other people's time (case in point the two mortar and AA fire threads in 24 hours) or

clearly don't have the manual or can not be bothered to read it.

So I don't consider anyone a pirate if they ask a relevant question, or even a question that was answered a long time ago. I know the limitations of the search function.

And yes, I was a newbie here a while ago and I have not forgotten that. But my first post was not in your face pointless like the two above mentioned examples. I think it works both ways.

------------------

Andreas

[Melloj]

With popularity comes all different types of vices. Of course the people who have been here from the "beginning" may have little patience for new players, or fellows who have read the review, and want to find out what the game is really like.

This isn't the traditional wargame, I would say that it is the "Half-Life" of wargames. In that I mean it will change the genre for sure. Since it isn't the traditional wargame, it will attract players that are not traditional wargamers. These may be viewed as "twitch types" etc. but isn't this what the wargamer community has been after?

Wasn't the dream to create a game that will not only satisfy the HIGH demands of die-hard wargamers (grognards) but more importantly attract all those who think "BORING" when they see anything resembling hexes.

Of course there is going to be a culture clash of sorts. Heck Im basically a newborn to this forum, but this is one of THE best forums I have read. Most forums degenerate into stupid mud-slinging by day 4.

Veterans, have patience with the newcomers...like Seanachai mentioned, dont be rude or condescending. The new players attracted to this game will most likley coming from those forums I mentioned before. They aren't used to searching, or being reprimanded. Just be cool, and explain it, and you will avoid all the Flame crap that goes one in gaming forums at large.

------------------

Why does the Air Force need expensive new bombers? Have the people we've been bombing over the years been complaining?

George Wallace

[This message has been edited by Melloj (edited 07-11-2000).]

[:USERNAME:]

I welcome the new influx and hopefully they will share any military experience they have. I just want people to start using the scenario,tips forums. Searching can bring you up to speed on why things are modeled the way they are. Threads get long and winding though and it does take a lot of time to get through them. Theres 7000 some threads here.

Lewis

[Guest dirkd1976]

I got a quick question. How do you become a member on this message board? Do you have to post a certain number of replys?

By the way, great job on the game!! I only have the demo, but I ordered the full version yesterday by check, and it turns out the mail order person is on vacation this week!!! So its gonna be a extra couple of days of waiting for me!! I know some of you out there waited alot longer than that, but damn, I WANT MY GAME!!! Good job BTS, keep up the good work!!

------------------

Never mistake motion for action - Ernest Hemingway

[Mark IV]

Member = 30 posts. No replies necessary.

[Berlichtingen]

dirkd1976,

You have 26 posts to go

[Xen-]

Whilst I understand the annoyance ( / indulgence) of the "old soldiers" of the forum should a newbie asked a repeated question / make a dumb post, IMHO the better treated all the visitors to this area are, the better the gaming experience will be for all. Of course there will be those that abuse the system, but that is unfortunately a fact of life. To be curt with a newbie will only spread annoyance thou those who read the post, and not just the newbie.

Anyway, v. good thread to have...alway good to have some introspection...

[Guest dirkd1976]

Thanks guys!! 26 more to go eh, I guess I could just spam the message board util i am a member, right? IM KIDDING!!, ITS A JOKE!!

(I'm probably going to get all kinds of letters about spamming from BTS now....)

Happy gaming!!

------------------

Never mistake motion for action - Ernest Hemingway

[Joe Shaw]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>I guess I could just spam the message board util i am a member, right? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Dirk, you wouldn't even be the first to do that

Joe

[EMAN]

Originally posted by Seanachai:

Okay, I'm neither experienced enough nor have been here for a long enough time to even be described as one of "the Immortals", but I can already see a pattern forming.

There's currently a large influx of new members due to the actual release of the game, combined with the proselytizing efforts of the Combat Missionaries, etc.

And many of you/us/them are asking the same questions over and over (sometimes on the same page of threads), and many of those questions have been dealt with previously on this board (some topics may actually have led to the extinction of the dinosaurs...)

For new members, please keep in mind that some of the people on this board (not me, mind you, I'm a relative newcomer) have been discussing some of these issues for over 2 years. Almost any issue you can think of has often been discussed, often at incredible length, and often to the point where some people sit in their foxholes, silent and brooding, and honing a finer edge on their bayonets and obsessing.

So, when you post, you newer people, you will find many, many helpful souls who will try to answer your questions. Sometimes they may be somewhat concise, or even brusque, but that's because you're getting an answer that's been refined down by endless argument and discussion. Sometimes you will be told, usually politely, to use the search function. That's not because people aren't trying to be helpful. It's because they're directing you to the most thorough-going and fully discussed answer to your question. And while there are so many threads and posts as to be completely daunting, it's still the most complete source you are going to find.

When I first showed up here, I quickly learned to withhold questions and to refine search terms to check on issues/tactics/bugs/ and info of every kind. True, I often had to wade through a ton of posts to find what I wanted, but sometimes I found info on other things I hadn't gotten around to asking yet, sometimes I found info it hadn't occured to me to ask, many times I found fascinating discussions on historical and/or game characteristics that made me appreciate the whole process of creating Combat Mission. And in many cases if led me to posts that were just a firking howl. You will find facts, wisdom, and knowledge, and you will find it about equally mixed with gibberish, inanity, and complete crap. But I've been forums, and I have to say that my searches here have resulted in the best collection of posts of any forum I've been on.

Beyond the info that searches will garner you, you'll begin to come up with a picture of the many, many people that have contributed directly, or indirectly through posts on this forum, to the process of creating Combat Mission. So you'll get a feel for what these people are like, and the variety of their experiences. And from this you'll develop a new terrain map: who will make good PBEM opponents, who won't; who's worldview you share, and those you don't (but many who still seem to be fine people with their own contributions to make). Who's the best source to go to for serious grognard info, and who's the best to talk to for bawdy songs. And more than any other forum I've seen, this one involves people from all over the world. And you'll discover a large world of books, URLs, movies, and even music that will interest you by searching this forum.

So, if you're new here, use search, unless your question is one that can be quickly and easily answered. And if you ask something and people seem to ignore you, or are curt with you, realize that this forum has been in operation for something like 3 years. And if you've played the game for 4 hours, and sign on to say you don't think that x factor is properly executed, and demand it be immediately changed, then don't be surprised if most people just laugh at you, and try using search. If you've seriously got a contribution to make, it will be listened to with great attentiveness. If you've watched every war movie ever made and aren't happy with how your last Quick Battle went, then please consider searching before posting here. Chances are, your question/demand/observation has been dealt with before, and the blind posting of uninformed opinions based on no experience, no research, and no true knowledge will only earn you amused contempt, at best. There are many people here with a vast amount of specialized knowledge. Right or wrong, you'd better be ready to meet it.

[/quote

WHAT EVER :ROLLEYES:

[EMAN]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EMAN:

Originally posted by Seanachai:

Okay, I'm neither experienced enough nor have been here for a long enough time to even be described as one of "the Immortals", but I can already see a pattern forming.

There's currently a large influx of new members due to the actual release of the game, combined with the proselytizing efforts of the Combat Missionaries, etc.

And many of you/us/them are asking the same questions over and over (sometimes on the same page of threads), and many of those questions have been dealt with previously on this board (some topics may actually have led to the extinction of the dinosaurs...)

For new members, please keep in mind that some of the people on this board (not me, mind you, I'm a relative newcomer) have been discussing some of these issues for over 2 years. Almost any issue you can think of has often been discussed, often at incredible length, and often to the point where some people sit in their foxholes, silent and brooding, and honing a finer edge on their bayonets and obsessing.

So, when you post, you newer people, you will find many, many helpful souls who will try to answer your questions. Sometimes they may be somewhat concise, or even brusque, but that's because you're getting an answer that's been refined down by endless argument and discussion. Sometimes you will be told, usually politely, to use the search function. That's not because people aren't trying to be helpful. It's because they're directing you to the most thorough-going and fully discussed answer to your question. And while there are so many threads and posts as to be completely daunting, it's still the most complete source you are going to find.

When I first showed up here, I quickly learned to withhold questions and to refine search terms to check on issues/tactics/bugs/ and info of every kind. True, I often had to wade through a ton of posts to find what I wanted, but sometimes I found info on other things I hadn't gotten around to asking yet, sometimes I found info it hadn't occured to me to ask, many times I found fascinating discussions on historical and/or game characteristics that made me appreciate the whole process of creating Combat Mission. And in many cases if led me to posts that were just a firking howl. You will find facts, wisdom, and knowledge, and you will find it about equally mixed with gibberish, inanity, and complete crap. But I've been forums, and I have to say that my searches here have resulted in the best collection of posts of any forum I've been on.

Beyond the info that searches will garner you, you'll begin to come up with a picture of the many, many people that have contributed directly, or indirectly through posts on this forum, to the process of creating Combat Mission. So you'll get a feel for what these people are like, and the variety of their experiences. And from this you'll develop a new terrain map: who will make good PBEM opponents, who won't; who's worldview you share, and those you don't (but many who still seem to be fine people with their own contributions to make). Who's the best source to go to for serious grognard info, and who's the best to talk to for bawdy songs. And more than any other forum I've seen, this one involves people from all over the world. And you'll discover a large world of books, URLs, movies, and even music that will interest you by searching this forum.

So, if you're new here, use search, unless your question is one that can be quickly and easily answered. And if you ask something and people seem to ignore you, or are curt with you, realize that this forum has been in operation for something like 3 years. And if you've played the game for 4 hours, and sign on to say you don't think that x factor is properly executed, and demand it be immediately changed, then don't be surprised if most people just laugh at you, and try using search. If you've seriously got a contribution to make, it will be listened to with great attentiveness. If you've watched every war movie ever made and aren't happy with how your last Quick Battle went, then please consider searching before posting here. Chances are, your question/demand/observation has been dealt with before, and the blind posting of uninformed opinions based on no experience, no research, and no true knowledge will only earn you amused contempt, at best. There are many people here with a vast amount of specialized knowledge. Right or wrong, you'd better be ready to meet it.

[/quote

WHAT EVER <HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

[Guest dirkd1976]

Hey Joe,

How do know that people have done that? Unless you where the onw who did it *wink* *wink* Hahahahah, I'm kidding man.

------------------

Never mistake motion for action - Ernest Hemingway

[Guest Germanboy]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by EMAN:

WHAT EVER :ROLLEYES:<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

Nuff said...

------------------

Andreas

[Joe Shaw]

Dirk, I think I can honestly say that I never once ... well okay maybe once ... at most three times ... well when I noticed I was at 24 I MAY have LOOKED for things to respond about ... but that was it!

There have been posts on this board that came right out and said "HEY I'm at 20 and going for 30, this makes 21 right?"

Don't forget, when you make member you get your secret Member's Only Decoder Ring and a semi-attractive Membership Certificate printed on Genuine Faux Paper and signed by the Mad Mattman himself or a reasonable facsimile of what his autograph would look like if he could actually write! So Don't Delay, Start Posting Today!

Joe

[KMHPaladin]

Well, working towards 30... hehe... In actuality, I think an "FAQ" of sorts would do the community a world of good. Being a total newbie I'm really not the one to write it... but I might suggest that someone with a goodly amount of experience do so.

Good luck,

------------------

KMHPaladin

KHarkins@voicenet.com

"We have the enemy surrounded. We are dug in and

have overwhelming numbers. But enemy airpower is

mauling us badly. We will have to withdraw."

-- Japanese infantry commander, SITREP, Burma

[Hakko Ichiu]

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Joe Shaw:

Don't forget, when you make member you get your secret Member's Only Decoder Ring and a semi-attractive Membership Certificate printed on Genuine Faux Paper and signed by the Mad Mattman himself or a reasonable facsimile of what his autograph would look like if he could actually write! So Don't Delay, Start Posting Today!

Joe<HR></BLOCKQUOTE>

I thought MadMatt just drooled on all documents in the approximate shape of an X.

Now you're confusing me Joe!!

------------------

Ethan

-----------

Das also war des Pudels Kern! -- Goethe

PS - EMAN, the second little icon from the right at the top of each post is an edit button. Saves having to copy long and pointless posts just to correct a smilie.

[This message has been edited by Hakko Ichiu (edited 07-11-2000).]

[Guest dirkd1976]

A decoder ring and a document from MadMatt? Oh man, if there was ever a reason for spamming, its definatly a decoder ring. If I keep up this mindless chatter I'm sure to be a menber soon!! Glory days, here I come!! (I also like Spam on whole wheat, not just on my my message board..... )

------------------

Never mistake motion for action - Ernest Hemingway