1.04 and Early Turkish Entry

[Ludi1867]

Before the fourth patch I had not ever heard of the Ottomans entering the war early. Now, since the patch appeared, I have both heard of it and experienced it, and it seems highly problematic as currently configured.

The CP now (with patch 1.04) appear to start with two diplomatic chits in Turkey. If these succeed quickly, then the Ottoman Empire can enter the war very early. While in and of itself this counter factual result is not that hard to see as a possibility, the problem is with the ABSOLUTE lack of any Entente response. NOTHING changes in response to the early Ottoman entrance, with the exception that the Decision Event concerning Basra is apparently now eliminated.

Why is this significant? Well, any time that counter factuals are dealt with anything can be argued. But if the Ottomans had entered early, it is really hard to see the British Empire, with the entire resources of India close by, not responding in any way. Nor would the Russians, likely, adhere to a mobilization schedule that appears to be broadly historically based. But the Entente does NOTHING other than the usual while Turkish troops flood the map much earlier than usual.

Is this reasonable? I would argue no. As it stands the British Empire has one decision that is (in my case) made before the diplomatic chits operate, as to where a single Indian corps lands – France or Egypt. I mistakenly chose France, not being aware of the Ottoman entrance at that point. The British 'garrison' that arrives coincident with the hordes of Turkish troops is two measly detachments...not nearly enough to bar the Suez Canal – a level that is difficult to understand given the significant historical failure of the Turks to capture the canal. The Caucasus is just as bad, where two Russian corps and a Russian detachment try to stare down the Turks until the 'real' Caucasus mobilization finally happens.

What can be done? Lots of options exist. An early Turkish entrance could result in slow Turkish troop deployment, or more rapid Entente mobilization. The disappearance of the Basra option might be partially offset by a more muscular Indian option to Egypt. But the current status quo for the Entente even after the world dramatically changes as a result of the early Ottoman entry? Ridiculous.

The possibility of an early Ottoman entry is perhaps OK. The complete lack of Entente reaction if that happens is wrong. Either the option of early Ottoman entry is removed OR a reasonable Entente reaction if the Ottoman's enter early is added - but having one without the other is simply wrong.

[lettowvorbeck]

I agree. Changes to the game tied to events happening earlier (see my earlier post about v104 Bulgarian entry) tend to have no corresponding changes to the counteractions (e.g. an earlier Greece option to go with MUCH earlier Bulgarian entry, and like you say earlier reaction at Basra and Suez). That said, I thought that Turkey started with two diplo chits in earlier versions as well.

Basically, the problem as I see it is we have fluidity in timing for a given event but rigidity on the response event, instead of them being in a sequence of some kind.

[Kommandant]

Agree here. There should be something britain can do to work better in a situation like this, maybe, the best sollution, is to add a corp unit in egypt, if basra is not taken, the quantaty of brit troops in egypt is nearly everything brit needs to halt any ottoamn advance, unless you focus all ottoman forces there, like this, you might be able to do something... maybe.

[Bill101]

Hi

Thanks for this, and I have had this reported to me by others as an issue in 1.04.

The interesting thing is that nothing material to Ottoman entrance has been changed since probably v1.2, so I am a little puzzled as to why it's become a possibility now.

I will work on resolving this. The point of the diplomatic chits has always been to provide some variation in the date of the Ottoman entrance into the war, but not to have it happen at such an early date as to cause massive problems to the Entente.

I'm on the case, and may just have to work in an alternative method of providing some variation. It's probably the simplest solution.

Bill