Canuck21

One thing I enjoy the most is making maps. I'm interested in making some for Quick Battles. I opened a QB map in Scenario Editor just to see what all was done on it in terms of AI, setup zones, etc. I see that all of those are actually part of the QB map. I'm not sure which one I pulled up (didn't want to hit myself with a spoiler ) but it looked like it was an actual scenario, except there were no units attached with it. It did have several AI plans associated, with a number of groups in each, both for the attacker and defender (this was an Assault QB). So my question is, if you're playing a QB with the computer playing one side, how/will it know to assign group designations to the troops on it's side? If you have an AI with 4 groups that the computer is controlling, but either you or the computer has selected the forces for that QB, will the computer divide the forces into groups, and if so, how would it know how to divide them up (it would be rather "difficult", for instance, to assign an off map mortar battery to a group that's conducting an assault on a bridge for instance)? So ultimately I guess I need to know exactly what I need to put into a QB map (AI, setup zones, etc.), or what? I know that's probably a little vague, but hopefully the answers will enable me to ask more pointed (and intelligent) questions. Many thanks!

Excellent idea John! I hadn't thought of that. Thanks.

Well, I'm not sure I agree about this scenario being gimmicky or silly. It is a plausible situation and who knows but this very thing didn't happen at the time. Personally, I find it quite challenging and very instructive but then I'm new to this type of operation. As you say too, it does demonstrate what the weaponry and vehicles are designed to do. Yeah, finding the best place to cross certainly is the main sticking point for sure. In one attempt I thought I had it made. Turns out I was wrong . I'm really enjoying playing this scenario I must admit. I suspect there's more than one AI plan in there because it's played differently each time. That definitely keeps me coming back for more (that's MR. Masochist to you, if you please ). Glenn

This is great - thanks people! I did try out some of the things you mentioned and I did much better. I never thought about staying way back on the ridge to begin with but that makes a lot of sense. So does the unbuttoning (these are things I never even thought of, so this really helps a lot). I did get my Schwimmobile across this time. Unfortunately, I got a very rude surprise when I got there (won't say anything more so I don't spoil it for those who haven't tried this yet). Anyway, back for another try later, but thank you people. This is really helpful! Glenn (hhmmmm, tried to "Like" John N's answer too but the forum is telling me I'm liking too many people. That's odd. Anyway, I'll try again later, but thanks to you also John .)

Thanks for this, that does help in general and I've taken note of this! Unfortunately for the Germans with this scenario, the halftracks are getting pounded before they get anywhere near the river. There's very little, if any cover approaching the river, and the Partisan forces seem to have AP ammunition at the very least. Also, the only thing that can go across the river is the Schwimmobile. The bridge is out and there is no ford for the halftracks. I'll have to check into the smoke thing though. The HT's may have that. I didn't think to look. Thanks again . Glenn

Oh, and I DO need help !!! Ok, for infantry assaults and tactics, I have a fair idea as to what I'm doing. I do need some advice on how to handle attacks using motorized vehicles though. I'm specifically speaking of the new scenario, "FR Out for a Schwimm", which is the first battle in the new (and really, really excellent - nice job people!!!) Fire and Rubble. I'm playing the Germans and attempting to cross the river in my "Schwimmobile" (my term - sorry ). So far I have got really, really good at one aspect of this scenario - getting my guys "somewhat" deceased (I'm thinking of opening my own funeral home, I'm that good ). I'm just not sure how to successfully approach this such that my guy has enough covering fire to get across the river (anyone know where I can buy a good used Schwimmobile? Mine seems to have... well, sunk ). I've not had much experience with halftracks, bren carriers, light armoured units, etc. in general so any advice on how best to handle them in a situation like this would be really appreciated. Thanks much for this. Now if you'll excuse me, I think my Kommadant wants a word with me... . Glenn

I'm not seeing it in the new version of Red Thunder (with or without FR activated), so it looks fine here now. I do not have this in any of my other WWII games (I have all the WWII titles). As you say Dave, it looks like this version coded it out. As I recall, the last Engine 4 Patch did not do CMRT because that was being done for F&R, so that would likely explain why I was seeing it in CMRT only. Fire & Rubble (or the Engine 4 Patch for that) has taken care of that, at least at my end. Glenn

Thank you JoMac! Yes, I've done now that and everything is set. When I purchased the WWII set, I got all the big bundles I could so this is my first module install. I'll know for next time (assuming I don't forget, but then I never forget anything... what were we talking about?? ). Anyway all good now. Really appreciate yours, @Redwolf and @Commanderski's help . Glenn

Bingo! Thank you very much. I figured it was my issue. Appreciate your help. Glenn

Ah yes, I do see that. BRB - thank you!

No, not in the game. It never asked for it as one normally sees when first booting the game up (I never saw the activation screen). Is that screen something I need to pull up manually?

G'Day all. I just purchased and installed Fire & Rubble. Everything went apparently normally (installed to the default location where RT is on the Mac). I did notice the download package said CMRT on it and not FR, but it was v2.10 instead of v2.02 so it is the upgraded version (plus the price tag was $35, not the $60 for the base game). I did download this from BF's games page for it. I figured the module was simply contained within a new CMRT installer (it was 8 GB in size so 3 GB larger than the RT installer). Anyway, opened it up and I can see all the FR scenarios, but they are greyed out and when I click on one it says I need Fire and Rubble to run that one. I loaded a CMRT scenario then quit the program, then restarted it just in case but nothing changed. The F&R scenarios are still greyed out. So, since no one else has reported this, I'm assuming there's something I missed somewhere. Can anyone clue me in here please or should I just raise a ticket? Thanks a bunch . Glenn PS - I just noted in my Orders window under My Account, the order status says completed, but the Shipping status does say "Pending". Perhaps the actual module is coming along a bit later while the D/L I received is the CMRT upgrade that F&R needs to run? Also the D/L Sharefile page does list the package as Red Thunder Full. Sounds logical that the module will come along later, but if anyone can confirm that, that would be great. Thanks.

@George MC - I almost fired off my scenario to you today. I couldn't for the life of me get the pixeltruppen to follow my AI orders. After the time came and went that they were supposed to move, they were just sitting there (probably having tea or something) like bumps on a log. I tried 5 times to get them moving, but nothing worked. Finally, I went back in and closely inspected the AI Orders. Yup, you guessed it - I had set the orders for the wrong side. Again. I'm really getting "good" at that . Sheesh. Anyway, what triggered me to look at that again was your post above about making sure you're programming the right side. You know, the thing I said I've **never** done (I hope you caught my sarcasm in that line when I wrote it) ? Oddly enough, when I reprogrammed it to the right side, it worked perfectly. Go figure . Anyway, thought you'd enjoy that little tidbit. Glenn

That's fine Dave. I definitely will be getting FR when it comes out (as in, the DAY OF ) so that will fix that, but as you say, it's not a big deal and definitely not worth spending any real time on. Really appreciate you looking into this for me though. All the best, and best of luck with FR. Glenn

Ahh, very good @Ultradave . Yes, that was one of the first things I did before raising a ticket was to totally move (move to a totally different directory outside the Application folder, just in case ) the duplicate folders out and then start the game. I just started it, then shut it down (I didn't actually do anything in there) and the subfolders all came back again. So the answer to your question is, "yes". It's really weird. Something must be generating it somewhere in there, but one fellow said he's seen it in a number of other titles as well. I only see it in the one so far. I also tried deleting the app alias I created to put on the dock and start the game from the main app icon in the Application>CMRT folder, but that didn't solve the problem (didn't think it would, but it was worth a try). I have noticed that all the Game File folders are alias' so there has to be a root folder somewhere that it links to. Could it be in there that the issue lies? Anyway, the titles all work really well, so this isn't hindering that at all. I'm tempted to ask if there's a full moon out as this is really weird . Many thanks for your help on this Dave, much appreciated. Glenn

@Lucky_Strike - No, not a Big Sur thing. PhilM has seen it for a while now well before Big Sur came out. @Ultradave, yes, I've deleted the (seemingly) duplicated folders a few times but as soon as I restart the game, they all reappear again. What you are saying about them just appearing to look like they are duplicated makes sense though. It's a bit befuddling though. John is working on what's going on as well, but he and his tech people are puzzled by this too. Thanks guys.

Ok, got it. I didn't realize you had to start the scenario (hitting the timer) before they'd move to their proper spots. This time as well, I picked the units in the Unit Editor but didn't manually deploy them, instead letting the AI do it. Worked perfectly. This is a very slick system . Another piece of the puzzle falls into place. Onward and upwards . Thanks again to all for the help. Glenn

Cool, thanks! Got a couple of things to try that should work if I read the replies right, but if they don't, I'll for sure send it along. Much appreciated .

Thanks @George MC! Really appreciate your time. Yes, I did make sure I had groups (and targets for that matter - the "[U...]" designation) set up and based my plan/orders on those. Good point though. On your second point about setting a plan for one side while intending to set it for the other side, no, I've **never** done that. Nope, not me. Ummnnn, gee, my nose seems to be growing. Rapidly... ! Being serious, if I had a nickel for every time I've done that, I could buy Battlefront <LMAO>. I'm a master at that! Ok, on 3. that's perfect! Exactly what I needed. Alrighty, it's back to work for me. Thank you again George. Glenn

Hey thanks for this @PhilM! Interesting it's happening on other games as well. For me, it's just the one as far as I can tell. I'll let John know. He hadn't noticed that before, but it's not surprising since it doesn't cause any issues with running the game. I don't think it's worth his time to go chasing this all over the place as long as the games do work. Really appreciate you getting back to me on this. Thanks! Glenn

Hi @benpark, and thank you for this (and the welcome ). Yeah, I'm loving learning this. Still on the steep part of the curve but enjoying it greatly. 1. Great - thanks. 2. In one case the "people" was me on my test scenario . I found one thing I did wrong in that I had painted the AI setup zones outside the map setup zones, so that was never going to work. However, I've fixed that, but the bodies still aren't moving to the AI setup zones. I just have one plan so far so maybe that's why? Not sure but I'll experiment. You are correct though - I did deploy the troops manually first. I gather from what you are saying I can simply select the units in the Unit Editor, but not physically place them, but letting the AI place them instead? That would be cool. I'll give that a shot, but if you have a minute to confirm that, it would be great. That also helps to know you make 3 plans. My goal also is to get not just good scenarios, but highly replayable ones so that helps me a lot. Right now I'm not doing Quick Battle maps, but I do plan to down the road (I love making maps!). Good to know about that deal. 3. I'm still a tad fuzzy on this one. The yellow AI zone is where you go to (for example), but if you paint another section (let's say 50 m away from the first one), this time in red, are your troops *going* there and firing from there, or staying in the yellow AI zone and firing *to* that red zone? Again, a huge thank you for this! It helps tremendously. Glenn

G'Day all. I've got a really bizarre issue with CMRT, and it's got me and the Helpdesk really perplexed. I'm wondering if you folks with Macs could check and see if you're getting a similar behaviour so we might be able to nail down this thing a bit. It's not causing any problems in running the game so people may not even notice, which is why it's kind of elusive. So here's the deal: In the Red Thunder folder under Applications, there are 2 folders, one of which is Game Files. In that folder, there are a bunch of other folders such as Scenarios, Quick Battle Maps, etc. That's all fine, but in Red Thunder (only), there is another Game Files folder as well (as a sub folder of the top level Games Files). In that you get a duplicate of all the folders in the top Games File folder (Scenarios, Quick Battle Maps, etc.). If you click on that Games Files folder, then that opens to yet another set of folders that also include another Games Files folder. In other words, the Game Files folder, contents and all, is getting duplicated as many as 5 times! And to answer the obvious question, no, I don't do drugs . I removed the excess Game Files folders (leaving only the top one) then started the game again, and then closed it. Those duplicates reappeared yet again. As I say, the game runs just fine, but there's a lot of space and duplication going on here that is not explainable. It would be really helpful to know if anyone else is seeing this as well. Again, it seems to only be on the Mac (in my case an iMac, Big Sur). So for those with that system (and others because it might be useful to know where it's *not* occurring) could you have a quick look using Finder and see if you're seeing this as well? I have Game Engine 4 (downloaded a couple of weeks back) with the installer last updated in 2019. I have, as I say, raised a ticket and John is working on it, but it's not something he's seen before (not surprising), so I'm trying to get as much info as I can to help with the troubleshooting at my end. Thanks a bunch. Now, if you'll excuse me, I need to get my new jacket refitted (the one these nice men brought me when I told a couple of friends about this - nice coat but the sleeves are too long and they are full of heavy leather straps and metal buckles - go figure ). Glenn

So, things are going pretty well at the moment. I'm studying the manuals, looking at scenarios that come with the sim/games in the Scenario Editor, and also watching a very good YouTube video by "proambulator" on AI Triggers, so things are starting to become more clear. I've also made/setup a couple more testbeds (so to speak) to test out what I'm learning and that's helping as well. I do have 2 questions for now, if you don't mind: 1. I saw in one or two unit editors for scenarios that come with the game, the designation "[R2...]". I understand [U"n" and A"n"] ("n" being number values for targets and groups respectively), but I've not found the meaning for the "R" designation. Can someone fill me in on that please? 2. Setups in the AI pane can be painted in on the map, but in the pre-made samples I've seen, they aren't painted. I do see them for Order 2 (and onward) if a unit is moving (these are the yellow painted squares I'm referring to). Is this a case where you would only paint in the setup zones if you have multiple plans where a given unit(s) might start from a different location in each plan? I do have a test scenario where I painted in a setup zone for a group but when I started the battle as the other side to test it, those units were still in the original place I placed them when deploying them. I only had one plan for the test group and it was set to Used Frequently. So I'm not sure why they didn't take up the new setup position in this case. Any clarifications on setup zones would be helpful in terms of when you paint them in. 3. (I know, I only said a "couple of questions" - there are 3 kinds of people in this world - those who can count, and those who can't ) In the same vein as 2 above, you can also paint a setup area (or destination) for orders in red (fire), cyan (retreat I believe) and one other one. Does this mean that if instead of painting a square(s) in yellow where a unit would advance to, that instead if painted in red, it will fire into that area instead of moving to it (or retreat to it, etc.)? Ok, that's it for now. Any/all help would be very much appreciated. Thanks hugely! Glenn

Thanks man

Thank you both. This has been a *huge* help to me, not to mention inspirational. I'm working on a scenario now for Red Thunder which isn't as much about figuring out the mechanics of how the AI works as it is about the message above. I'm sure I'll have some questions about the AI coming up soon, which I'd like to throw out here when I get to them if that's ok. Anyway, the map is done (more true to the area than my "test" scenario was - I love building maps!) and the setup zones set, so the real work starts tomorrow I expect. Anyway, thanks again for the help. I really appreciate it. Glenn