womble
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Posts posted by womble
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Let me rephrase woeful to ( as expected ) but you see what I mean when you get direct fire happening you never go back to indirect fire again, it then make indirect fire woeful.
I see what you're saying about the difference, but don't see why that's a sticky point? I'd've thought you'd expect a degradation in effect due to the inherent inefficiencies of calling in support via radio (usually from further away) rather than having the mortar gunner firing over 'open sights'...
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@womble:
that is a plausible explanation...
on the other side this couldn´t be the solution for all...
especially if you think of the option that the german 8-wheeled PSW armored car is spotting and aiming via the paralell gun-optics after the commander close the turret hatch...
You mentioned the PSW was shooting at a building. I believe there may be a bug with at least one type of building, and have reported it to the tech support guys. Perhaps that's why your AC couln't area target a particular structure.
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I finally found a flaw in CMBN - and a big one at that
In the training mission game I order my Sherman to hunt forward down the road - and the crew decides to leave the tank and do this on foot. WTF?? The tank hasn´t even been under fire, so it is no "auto bail"
I guess I must have hit the "K" key when in the "special" menu (bail out) instead of in the movement menu (hunt).
BUT NO MATTER WHAT I DO I´M UNABLE TO CANCEL THIS??
Seems you've accurately diagnosed the cause, and correctly determined that there's no post-hoc rememdy for it. Shame that changed betwen SF and BN (IIRC in SF, a Bail command set a waypoint for the crew to bail, which could be backspaced). The only solution (other than simply taking more care, which will only reduce, not eliminate the problem) is to move away from the 'relative' command arrangement. The 'alternate' hotkeys file doesn't have Bail mapped to a keystroke at all.
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I'd suggest this last is down to small (so far) sample size, as I've fired all my 60mm indirect so far, and been, by and large, more than happy with the results (I gave up on mortars in CMx1, except where I had to have them). I will have to try them DF, though, cos if my experience of their indirect fire performance seems 'woeful' in comparison, I dread to think of the shredding the Jerries will be on the end of if I can just get 'em in LOS without the crew getting their heads shot off...
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Which is why I always advocated using at least two or three tanks at once. That way, while one is getting shot at, the others are free to engage the ATG.
If they can see it, of course
'Tis going to be fun getting to grips with this non-borg spotting... Something I hadn't anticipated is the various units that get a '?' contact seeing the target in different places. -
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you say the trajectory of every bullet is exact...
so why i am not allowed to give exact shooting order with my tank ?...
why it is most time incomprehensible that i have a direct line of sight to my supposed target but not allowed to set the firing order?
Addressed elsewhere: because it is exact. If your tank commander can see (that is, has a direct line of sight), it doesn't mean that the gunner can lay his sights on it. Thinking about it, if you've got a tank with a commander's pintle-mounted gun, there might be instances when you can Target Light, but not Target, because the main gun might be obstructed while the higher-up cupola weapon can see. There are German Tank Destroyers with 'periscope' optics on their roof; the parallax between those and the gun axis can leave the TD shooting at the cover they're behind if care isn't taken.
...for example a house...It is always gambling what unit is allowed to give suppress fire on a special place or house...I've had some issues which seem to be due to firing at (and around) some types of building, specifically, the "barn" type with one big door on one side and a couple of windows and a person-sized door in the back. I think the 'walls' of the barn may be obscuring the 'interior' which is where the targetting point wants to be.
It isn´t conceivable in this game for me where a unit is allowed to "see"/shoot!
It's important to remember that Line of Sight (LOS) and Line of Fire (LOF) are not, necessarily, the same in all cases.
It's been known for quite some time now that there would be no co-operative MP in the game, and there has never been an option to pause RT play vs another human.
A lot of what you're missing is down to your perceptions or inexperience with the game. For example: Mortars behave differently to what you expect from CMx1; neither is ever going to be a precise, accurate, model of what really happened, so arguing about the difference is, frankly, pointless. Arguing about the relative points cost of American 60mm, British 2" and German 50mm mortars, based on their actual effectiveness in-game is valid, as are discussions on how to get the current model changed to be closer to 100% accurate. Beyond that, you're arguing 'taste', about which there will never be agreement and if you don't like the new flavour, the original will always be there.
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Who else but a fanboy would spend hundreds of hours researching the details of Panzer IV (Panzerkampfwagen IV to you) and then spend dozens of hours arguing the relative merits of the Ausführung F1 and Ausführung F2 variants (and then spend hundreds of hours arguing about whether the correct designation of the "Ausf. F1" is "Ausf. F1" or "Ausf. F").
Fanboy != Grog. Obsession with detail does not preclude constructively criticising the product, whereas being an uncritical True Believer does...
Hold on, why am I helping necro this thread? Oh well.
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In the training scenario, the AT gun took a ton of area fire from three Shermans and was never knocked out. When my infantry overran the position, there were still three healthy crew members manning it! AT guns were way easy to knock out in CMx1.
When I played the Road to Berlin, the ATG died to the first 75mm HE that went in on target. And it had pinged 3 rounds off the Sherman that killed it with only 'spalling' to show for it, and no noticeable effect on the tank or its crew. Just goes to show that results can vary considerably.
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This isn't a good idea for either, as you can end up suppressing your own men, causing them to change orders in some circumstances, or even wounding or killing them with ricochets or shards thrown off by nearby impacts.
I think this is one of the things people will start having to have a feel for to get good: when should you stop your support fires on the assaulting team's target? Playing WeGo, judging exactly how long it'll take your assaulting team to get into the danger area is going to be critical.
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In this pic the bar is showing as YELLOW notating he is a Veteran currently on the 4th floor.
I've said it before, and I'll obviously have to keep saying it: I would not have known what colour that blob was if you hadn't told me. Could've been green, could've been yellow. About 10% of this game's constituency suffer from some sort of colour vision deficiency. A plea to all interface designers, on behalf of that 10%: please don't rely on colour to impart or highlight important information.
The second version uses colored letters ousing the same spectrum except conscript, and green both show as a red "C" or "G"Keeping a letter code is a good example of how not to rely on colour alone
I vote for this one.The 3rd feature uses the best of both worlds for the unit ammo; intergers for when more precise information is needed, and color for more general information at a glance. This system uses red, yellow, green.GREEN = ammo is at least at 50% of what max load out can be for that unit and type of ammo
Type turns to YELLOW when ammo drops below 50%
Type turns to RED when ammo drops below 15%
What this does is alert the player at a GLANCE of the ammo SITREP. If type turns red it will catch the attention of the player...
Not necessarily. As above, colour blind players will barely be able to see the red-on-black, but even for colour-perfect vision, red-on-black isn't a very high contrast pair of colours. It would be better if you could use something like a different background colour (white, even) for when the situation becomes critical.
Cmx2 has a very good GUI.I'd say that's laying it on just a little thick. The UI just about does what it absolutely must. It's "adequate", not "very good". Which is cool, cos it gives them lots to work on for the next game
These are just some of those tweaks that make it that much better. Unfortunately these changes cannot be modded and will have to be implemented by Battlefront.[
(and no, I'm not requesting a unit portrait of Clint Eastwood too.
That is from a mod i made.) -
What I find odd about the targetting is that the spotting rounds can land, seemingly, pretty much anywhere. Makes spotting them a pain, and even if they are half the map away, the 'effect' fire can still be right on the money.
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I'm pretty sure, from recent experience, that friendly .50cal (at least) can cause casualties, and friendly small arms fire can pin. Just re-ran a turn after carefully removing all area fire that might be near friendlies (one tank and a 3-4 BARs) and all 7 elements that had gotten pinned on the first runthrough survived unscathed in the re-run turn and no casualties were sustained, rather than taking 2 or 3.
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...eh...well and don´t even think of supporting your men with close smokelayers from your tankguns...could hurt a little...
Butchered a good group until i noticed that my casulties came from those near impacting smokeshells instead of enemy fire.
Do these shells really fragment that strong on impact or what is the reason ?
They're White Phosphorus. Bad, burny Juju. You do not want to be nearby when they go off.
I had a Rhino light up my own guys in "Breaking the Bocage". Squad was assaulting toward a hedgerow and my tank decided to help them out by firing into said hedgerow, resulting in two friendly KIA and one WIA.
It's possible those casualties came from enemy fire from the hedgerow, but as I watched the replay I was convinced it was the not-so-friendly HE.
Dumb move by the Rhino gunner, but realistic results.
Eminently possible, even likely, since HE will definitely cause FF casualties (lost a couple to a 75mm HE bursting >15m away from them...). IIRC, thrown grenades won't, due to the difficulty of modelling their correct use in building fighting, but rifle grenades will cause blue-on-blue. Always a good idea to check your HE throwers either lift their barrage or switch to "Target Light" when your assault teams go in.
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I'm starting to think that split squads are the only way to go in the hedgerows. You seem to get more suppression points and you get pinned a team at a time, rather than a squad at a time.
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Thanks for the reply Pandur. As a first time player of the series i would of liked to had as much time as i wanted to complete the missions. Each to there own i guess hah
Unfortunately, changing the time available for a mission isn't as simple as you might think.
First-off, it's a scenario, and the duration of it is part of its parameters. If you had longer, things might be easier, and Victory Points would have to be handed out in a different way to remain meaningful.
Second, and more technical, the AI runs according to a "Plan", which has certain things happen after a certain length of time. If you had more time, the Plan would have to be different.
Third, it's a demo. In the full game, you could edit what you liked in the scenario editor, but there have to be some restrictions.
Fourth, it might make no darn difference in any case. The longer you futz about, the longer Jerry has to drop 81mm on your head. Snooze = Lose...
If you want time to fiddle, play WEGO, or just abuse the Pause button. Try something and reload if it doesn't turn out quite how you expected. It doesn't matter how many goes it takes you to beat the intro scenario, or how many hours it takes fine-tuning your moves, so long as you're enjoying it
It's not like it locks itself unplayable once it finishes the first time, or you can't go back to a previous save and try a different tack (I've taken to saving before submitting the turn and then saving a replay, so I can try things like breaching, fire mission adjustments or complicated maneuver evolutions and get some idea of how long such things can take). -
There's no 'show all target lines' like there is for 'show movement paths', AFAIK. You have to click through each unit to see where you've told it to fire. If they're firing due to their own reaction to the enemy, rather than due to an explicit command, the only way is to watch them and see what they're pointing at.
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once you're comfortable with the UI it all becomes second nature. One glance and you see green lights and a radio icon, or you see a red light in the chain and nothing but a distant figure icon. Time to either shift your commander or find a nearby jeep with a radio to restablish comms.
Tis true though that you have to look at every unit, whereas with Command lines you just click the HQs and see what colour and how many lines.
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Hi, simple old guy request ... what's the best method for blowing tank-sized holes in bocage in the tutorial? A simple point by point explanation of the best one or two methods please would be most helpful, if someone could help me out, thanks!
I think the reasons there are no Bocage-busting tools in the tutorial are:
- You don't need them. There are enough gaps for you to be able to advance without them against the opposition in this scenario if you apply any suppressive fire.
- Having Rhinos would make it toooo easy on the right. The claustrophobia of the Bocage would be mostly missing.
- Having people try and use demo charges in the introductory scenario would be cruel and wicked
- You don't need them. There are enough gaps for you to be able to advance without them against the opposition in this scenario if you apply any suppressive fire.
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edit: and now, trying the tutorial mission I just sent a rifle squad to the first hedgerow on the left. They instantly spotted several Axis teams behind the wall on the other side of the map. Is there some huge discrepancy between the two sides' spotting ability or am I missing something?
Someone from BF was discussing the creation of that map, and they said something to the effect that low walls give good cover, but not as much concealment as hedgerows. That wall's intent is to be a place the Germans can fight from, while a rookie player actually gets to see the opponent, rather than get frustrated at being bled by rounds from unseen shooters.
So, in this case, it's not necessarily about differences in spotting ability.
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if I may tag on to this topic: question about targetting. how do you get the unit to target the next target it sees? in CMX1, I could hit one key and it would target the next thing the unit sees. The manual targetting or just using hunt is a bit tiresome.
I've not seen any problems yet with troops engaging threats as they appear. Sometimes they even overestimate a threat (or don't account for the fact that their friends are already dealing with it) and abandon their assigned area fire mission for something well out of their 'frontage'.
"Cover Arcs" seem to me to be more of a method of restricting fire than of assisting it.
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If you go to the spotter, then go to his artillery menu and select the firing unit you should see an 'adjust mission' option next to the 'cancel mission'. Theoretically, if you don't adjust too far from the original you'll get a shorter countdown than a full cancel/replot. In my experience it's not a particularly great discount adjusting instead of canceling/replotting but you take what you can get. You can't add or subtract guns, just adjust the target.
It counts for more in WEGO, when any "ceasefire" uses up an entire minute before you can replot.
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Yeah, I love the OT vehicles, I just wasn't prepared in the slightest to see interiors in the others.
I suppose the guns function too? God, I'm going to lose my fair share of battles simply because I'll be obsessively following my vehicles around.
Play some in WEGO, so you can marvel at your tanks' innards at leisure
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My tip for this scenario is: "Don't hang around." If you think you've got 'em suppressed, go for it. It'll probably lose you less than hanging around to get mortarated, even if they're not quite as suppresed as you thought, or your suppression slackens a little because of moving. It has the added advantage of finishing things off quicker, so you don't, as I did, start running out of ammo.
Something I discovered, which I don't know will apply to other scenarios is that just because you can't see a hedgerow, doesn't mean you can't suppress it. The fields on the right, there's a slight downslope away from you which means if you fire at the front hedge, enough high/grazing rounds go through and reach the next hedge that the poor quality troops in the intro scenario seem to start panicing before you've even focused any fire on the hedge they're behind, one back from the one you're targetting. Keeping your tempo up here will catch them still withdrawing.
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So there are a lot of defended linear obstacles to clear in this game
One approach (the one I'm starting off with) to fighting through them (cos you surely can't go around 'em; they're everywhere!) is to suppress the entire hedgerow, since I can't be sure there aren't Jerries lying doggo behind, waiting to pop up and nail my dogfaces as they scuttle across the open ground. As I can't see any targets, I have to area fire. If I keep a squad intact, I get to suppress one point, whereas if I split them into teams, I get some suppression on more points per squad and can bring their firepower together once I get something behind the hedge to twitch and show itself.Is this an unnecessary process? Does a full squad spread its area fire over a wider frontage than a team?
'Tis going to be fun getting to grips with this non-borg spotting... Something I hadn't anticipated is the various units that get a '?' contact seeing the target in different places.
That is from a mod i made.)
Mortar question
in Combat Mission Battle for Normandy
Posted
Have a search around, jonp. This has been addressed in a number of posts in the last few days, and described far better than I can.
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=96575&highlight=mortar+LOS
http://www.battlefront.com/community/showthread.php?t=96575&highlight=mortar+LOS