Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by David Aitken: Personally it reminds me of the Bible, I say at risk of upsetting any Christians hanging around. Stories like Moses parting the Red Sea - you can just imagine how the truth about a drought spanning maybe several months or a couple of years, allowing Moses and company to get across the basin, eventually turned into a story about him walking up, waving his stick and parting the water as if by some miracle. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> You need to read more about the Bible and watch fewer Cecil B. DeMille movies...and why do you feel it necessary to attack Christians on a wargaming forum? Henri (end of thread...I hope...)

I am sure that there are many incredible things that happen in the game. In an earlier thread I and others described incredible bad luck happenings such as having a bazooka shot bounce off the side of a tank at 20 feet or a Jabo failing to hit a single tank. Well this is about GOOD luck, at least in my case.And my bad luck DOES seem to have changed to good luck, after I killed two Shermans with two Pumas in two different games, and then the following. In a pbem game over the weekend, one of my PzIVs exchanged shots with a Sherman, both sides failing to get a hit, and both tanks retreated out of sight of each other. When I got the next move from my opponent, I was fabbergasted to find out that although my Panzer had missed its target, it had killed ANOTHER tank behind the one that he was firing at! In this case I was not told by the game that I had killed a tank, since I was not aiming at it, and I would not have found out if my opponent had not told me. Can anyone beat this for good luck? Warning to my pbem opponents: my luck has CHANGED! Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by *Captain Foobar*: Gamey recon is using the vehicles to do something blatantly unrealistic. Henri. The argument against suicide recon is not so much that the unit wouldnt obey, it is that the information he gives you as a player is very unrealistic. Just because he can see the 5 Shermans shooting at him, that were hidden a moment ago, doesnt mean that evry unit on your team would even have a clue, especially if the firefight was taking place far behind the front line. All your front line troops and commander would know is that Mr. Jeep didnt come home that night.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> What is unrealistic in this case is not the fast-moving recon, but the fact that in CM, when one unit spots an enemy, every friendly unit is informed of the presence of the enemy unit. Do we need to prevent realistic actions to correcrt for unrealistic (but necessary for speed of play) limitations of the game? It has also been mentioned that fast-moving recon is OK if the unit is darting from cover; unfortunately this is not possible either in CM: vehicles may not enter woods, and in scattered trees, have to enter very deep before they are invisible. In real terrain, there are many hillocks, dips and so on that a unit can use for cover and that are not available in the game.In the game and in open terrain, you either zigzag moving fast or you are dead.Of course any player in his right mind dong this will try to use buildings and hills(if any) to the best of his ability. Over the weekend, in two pbem games, I used a Puma to dart out of the woods and to zigzag through unknown territory to scout out the enemy. In both cases, in addition to spotting all the enemy vehicles, the Puma took out a Sherman with a side shot, and unexpected bonus. Now according to game lawyers, the tactic is gamey if my intention was to scout out the enemy positions, but it was not if my intention was to confuse the enemy and to get a side or rear shot on an enemy tank. Now are we going to start to judge player INTENTIONS in order to decide if something is gamey or not? Then it is said that this is suicide so that no one would do it. Bull, in both pbem games, when my Puma was finally hit, most of the crew survived and ran away to hide in nearby woods.Are we going to argue that a particular action is unrealistic because doing it can get one soldier killed? Hey, this is WAR!... Again, it has been said that the move is gamey if the purpose is to draw fire from enemy positions in order to expose enemy positions. Believe me, I would rather reveal enemy positions without being fired upon by the enemy, but that his HIS choice and not mine! I am moving fast because I assume that he is not happy having the enemy driving around near his positions exposing them. There are different methods of recon depending on circumstances, and what seems gamey to me is to put artificial limitations on what a player can or cannot do within the rules of the game, especially in circumstances where a real-life commander under similar circumstances and constraints would do the same thing. Does anyone believe that when the Germans were doing recon in the flat Ukraine plains, their recon vehicles did not move fast? Why the hell do you think that recon vehicles were made to go fast? So that they could move slowly and deliberately? Henri

I disagree about sending a vehicle running around through enemy territory as being gamey; I did it yesterday with a Puma: he shot out of the woods and zigzagged at "fast" through enemy territory. Three enemy tanks were shooting at him, but as he spotted a Sherman in front of him, he let him have it in the side and killed the Sherman (a bonus I didn't expect and that I coldn't count on)! After a few more zigzags, he was killed by a Jumbo, but he had exposed the whole enemy position, killed a Sherman, and had thrown the enemy into confusion. The argument about the crew refusing to do this in real life is specious; doesn anybody think that ordering a platoon to assault an enemy position protected by entrenched machineguns is "gamey" and that the soldiers would refuse to advance? Of course not, so why should it be any different for vehicles? Besides, the crew is unlikely to be killed if the vehicle is disabled, some have a good chance of escaping. There are many examples in WW2 of soldiers abeying orders to advance against impossible odds; the case that comes to mind is the Canadian Black Watch Regiment in Normandy, who were ordered to advance through clear terrain against entrenched German machineguns and who did so without flagging, most of them being ahhinilated in the advance. In war, you do whatever needs to be done, and sending units into enemy territory to scout out enemy positions was not an exceptional activity. Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Scott Clinton: AFAIK units using "SNEAK" will not stop or return fire UNLESS they are spotted by the enemy. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> If they are being fired upon, it should be safe to assume that they have been spotted... Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Degrees of Frost: My opponent assures me his guys were hiding when they bought it.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Here is what may have happened: the enemy soldiers were hiding, so you couldn't see them. As their casualties increased, they began to rout, but as soon as they got up, they were killed and fell over dead. In other words, what you saw was hidden enemy soldiers breaking out of hiding just before they were eliminated.At least that's what I would guess... There may be another factor in that what you see is not necessarily what is there: the game shows you what your side THINKS is there given the information available. However in my experience, once a unit is shown as dead, it stays dead. There is an outside possibility that there were TWO enbemy units where you only saw one, and the sequence of events that you saw did not all correspond to the same unit. Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mannheim Tanker: Is coffee gamey? I don't think that the US Army had their coffee in the middle of a pitched battle, so I reckon that this is a VERY gamey tactic, and I'll vehemently discourage it's use in all of my PBEM's! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> It's well known that the British in Africa in WW2 paused for tea. As a matter of fact, at one point, both sides agreed not to fight after dark to make it easier for everyone. A newly arrived British officer who was unaware of the agreement captured some Germans, but the embarrassed British gave them back with profuse apologies and promises to shoot the offending officer if he did it again. In the interest of fair play, when the British captured the only water truck of an Italian brigade in the desert, they gave it back to the italians so that they could fight without dying of thirst. Henri "God dammit, war is beautiful!..." (Patton)

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Daverino: Henri- sounds like just really bad luck overall, but this sounds like your tank got bogged in the grass. Was it a wet day that you were describing? This happens to me a lot, especially with the heavies on the grass. daverino<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Well, the German enemy had ONLY heavy tanks -five of them - and no infantry, and none of them got bogged down, so I think that the ground was dry. So I guess it was just part of my run of bad luck... Henri

There have been threads like this before, but I wonder if anyone can beat my streak of bad luck; if I didn't know better, I would swear that the game has been tampered with, but since this is happening against five different opponents, that is highly unlikely. In one pbem game this week, during the first two minutes, 3 of my Shermans bounce 11 shells off a Hetzer while the latter is picking off all three. Starting a scenario three tanks down is not conducive to victory. A couple of minutes later, my 4.5 inch mortar spotter, who was about to drop the roof on the topless Hetzer, is dispatched when the first shell of an enemy artillery barrage falls directly on him 10 seconds before his artillery is scheduled to begin firing.The barrage is canceled. There is worse: in another pbem game, I see that the opponent has picked only heavy tanks. Oh boy, I think, I can take the flags and hold him off with my Super Pershing, Jumbo and two Fireflies. As the scenario begins, my Jumbo is immobilized behind some woods for some mysterious reason before even trying to move and one of the German tanks picks off the Pershing with the first shot while another picks off a Sherman as soon as he shows his nose. A bit later, my Jabo appears and the enemy has no AA Despite not bing fired on, the Jabo fails to even immobilize any of the four German tanks standing in the open on top of a hill I am left with a single Firefly and an immobilized Jumbo and two platoons of infantry who hold most of the flags. A bit later, the Jumbo misses a King Tiger who has drifted into view from 300 m FOUR TIMES in a row before being killed... So one of the enemy King Tigers roos forward right by one of my bazookas, who takes a side shot from 20 m away, and the shell bounces off the side of the Tiger In another pbem this week, I have a lot of tanks and infantry. SEVEN of my tanks are disabled by gun hits from artillery, and four bog down while the enemy tanks waltz around the terrain without problems Only two or three of my tanks ever manage to move into combat intact, where they are killed without claiming any enemy tanks. A number of my vehicles are killed by an enemy AT gun, who remains invulnerable despite being fired at by my 105 artillery since the beginning of the scenario, in addition to being fired upon by infantry and machineguns from a half-dozen kangaroo-mounted machineguns. Last week I described the pbem incident where an enemy Hellcat successively dispatched my Tiger and Panther with initial frontal shots from a mile away. I have no beef against my opponents, but I am starting to think that somebody up there doesn't like me... These are only a few of the incidents related to my incredible bad luck.Need I say that I am been stomped into the ground in every one of my pbem games?... Can anybody beat my hard luck stories? Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Mark IV: So, where's the data on how often gun hits occur in CM? You "think" they're around 15% (of total armor hits, I guess?). You "know" that 8% is too high. .<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> In one pbem I am playing, I have had SEVEN TANKS (more than half my tanks) knocked out by gun hits from ARTILLERY!!! Now I freely admit that I am considerably more unlucky than most (especially after yesterday whe 3 Shermans bounced 11 shells in a row of a Hetzer who killed all 3 tanks, and after today when my Jabo flew over four enemy tanks unprotected by AA and failed to hit a single tank before running out of gas), but that doesn't seem very ralistic to me henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jshandorf: Okay, sure I can see that, BUT then all the crew has to do is eject the AP round and load a HE round for the AT gun. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Ho boy!...I'm not sure how long it takes to change the shell in the gun, but it must be close to 30 seconds. Talk about a rectum-tightening situation TC:Panther ahead! Loader...change to AP round...FAST! Loader: Removing HE shell, sir... Gunner: Git a move on! That Panther is traversing!...C'mon, c'mon.. TC: Gunner, suhaddup and aim the gun!... Gunner: Yeah yeah, it's aimed...ouch, ya dropped that HE shell on my foot, ya idiot!... Loader: Oops, sorry Jack, I wuz tryin' to hurry...OK, there ya go, Now...****... that shell is stuck..OK, got it...(puff, puff...) TC: C'mon...c'mon..c'mon... Gunner: AP loaded!... TC: Fi...BOOOOM!!!... (Panther TC: Mein Gott, I thought ve vere done for, he had his cannon pointed right at the mittel of our Panzer - und vith a side shot too...I vonder vhy he didn't fire?...) Henri [This message has been edited by Henri (edited 09-11-2000).]

In one scenario, I had 3 tank main guns taken out by enemy artillery In all 3 cases, the MG could still fire. Now this is not negligible: an armored machinegun is still a dangerous weapon, much more so than a stationary machinegun, because it can move fast and is impervious to everything by AP hits and lucky artillery top hits. I DO believe however that information concerning the state of the gun should not be given to the enemy: I like to use tanks with disabled main guns to run around the flanks of the enemy hoping to get slow-rotating AT guns from the side or rear, and lemme tell ya if the enemy didn't know whether or not that tank had a functioning main gun, he might get very nervous ... Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by jshandorf: In the game the AI screws up sometimes and doesn't fire at threats with the main gun that are real threats that can kill the tank. Period. To rectify this the tank should use the main gun until you tell it not to. Simple as that<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> In the case described, the gun was not visivle from the tank, and you would have liked the tank to appear from a hidden position with an HE round in the barrel. If I were commanding a tank and I was going to pop up somewhere unsure of what I am going to see, you an bet your bottom dollar that I would not have an HE round in the barrel! Look at the options: OK, so YOU want an HE round in the barrel; you come up over the hill, and there sit an enemy tank traversing towards you ...and you have an HE round in the barrel!... Now I have an AP round in the barrel, I come out of hiding,and there is an enemy tank traversing. WHAM!...I let him have it. OK, so let's say there ISN't an enemy tank, only an AT gun. No sweat, I machingun the hell outta them and hope that I can suppress them before they get off a shot. Anyway, going after an AT gun with a TANK is conducive to getting your ass shot off What do you think infantry is for? Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Olle Petersson: Otherwise they might shoot one smoke round before turning their attention to something else.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Heck, most o' da time, my tanks only HAVE one smoke round (if they have any at all) Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by 109 Gustav: Are there more AARs, other than the ones on CMHQ? They're great for picking up strategy tips. <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> I have posted some here and on the usenet war-historical forum. Henri

Which units does one have to choose in an a QB assault scenario in order to get smoke rounds? Right now I have 3 pbem games in which I am supposed to assault enemy positions defended by hordes of machineguns and AT guns, with nary a smoke round. Marching infantry across open fields in the face of machineguns is not very conducive to survival. Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Claymore: Henri, I don't know if you have changed ISPs or not but all of my email to you is getting bounced back. I keep getting an "unknown user" error.<HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Errr, which one of my opponents are you (what name are you using in our games)? Are you Murray? he is having the same problem with a different error. I have emailed my ISP to find out what the hell is going on. Anyway until this is resolved, you can send your moves to my other email <arseno@phy.ulaval.ca>

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Knaust: Reason: delivery not allowed to non-local recipient <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> One of my pbem opponents is having the same problem sending mail to me (there was no problem before today); does anybody know what that diagnostic message means? BTW, I sent a message to Iggi at 7 AM this morning with a move, and it got through all right (as far as I know). Henri

The addon scenario Lelorey can be really painful for the Germans. When I played the scenario against the computer, I got a decisive victory, but when I played against a human, I was massacred; when I played as the US against a human, he got the same treatment. If anybody won this against the following US tactic, I would like to hear about it.The ability of the US tanks to drive through the bocage and the inability of the Germans to do so gives the US player a decisive advantage, especially since the Panthers are outnumbered about 3:1 and all fighting has to be at relatively close range. The historical German "advantage" in the bocage was using a lot of infantry and AT guns, but the Germans have little infantry in this scenario and no AT guns. In this scenario, the Germans have to hold three victory flags with two platoons of infantry and three Panthers. The US force is assaulting with about three infantry platoons, some halftrtacks, and about 10 tanks, including 2 Hellcat tank destroyers that arrive just in time to be thrown into the battle at the critical juncture.The US have 3 roads that lead to the German positions, and one of them hugs the map edge on the US right flank. The initial US deployment places most US forces on this road far from the Germans. As the Germans, I didn't know how experienced my opponent was, and when practically nothing happened move after move, I thought I had to remind him that I held the victory flags and that this was an assault by the US! Little did I know that he was preparing an assault on three sides. Suddenly enemy tanks appeared from all directions simultaneously, and one of my Panthers exploded from a rear hit after dispatching a tank that had appeared at its front to smell out the position. One of my Panthers was left alone near the two main flags facing a half-dozen or more enemy tanks attacking from three sides along with infantry, while my other remaining Panther knocked off a couple of tanks going for the other flag across some fields to the left. One of the infantry platoons was near the latter tank, which meant that only a few squads of infantry were near the other tanks facing the onslaught. The tank near the left flag raced through a field towards a hole in the bocage to help the other tank, but it was to no avail, and the other outnumbered Panther was quickly knocked out, leaving the last Panther alone. It was quickly knocked out by a side shot by a US tank destroyer arriving on its flank before it had time to do much. When I had the US, I used a similar strategy, but this time the 3 Panthers were found all together near the two flags. They managed to knock out the first couple of tanks (one led a charmed life for a couple of minutes as a Sherman and a Priest bounced shells off its side only immobilizing it), but as my horde exited from the bocage from the front and side, two of the Panthers were quickly brewed up.The remaining Panther hid behind some forests, and as my tanks moved in from all sides, he made a run for it towards the German rear, but was bagged from the side as three or four tanks tried to nail it from the side and from behind. We're still playing it, but I guess this will be my first pbem victory It is my impression that the Germans MIGHT have a chance if they take the offensive early and try to catch the US piecemeal with their 3 Panthers. But if the US player realizes this early enough, his advantage of being able to drive tanks through the bocage could still give him a decisive advantage. Anybody win this against a competent human using this rushing strategy? Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by Master Bates: I had ten King Tigers hidden behind on top of to the left of this *big* hill. Suddenly, a Stuart half-tank comes along, then BOOM, it is gone! <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Congratulations!...Now go try playing with da big boys!... Henri

Yeah, this game has ruined my TV-watching activities; I used to sit and watch the History channel and A&E for hours eating peanuts, but now I have to go check every five minutes to see if a pbem move from one of my opponents has arrived. It's worse than crack! , and there is no cure Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by iggi: Oh Henri, I have room for another PBEM on my list. Up for a game? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> OK, send me your setup (played before or not, QB or scenario, I don't care) at h.arsenault@videotron.ca, my gaming address. I haven't won a game yet (two losses and a draw so far), but maybe my luck will change Henri

All right, we have plenty to drink, now how about some food? MacDonald here has "found" a nice quarter of beef, and he says he is going to make some nice hamburgers; the engine grill on those Kangaroo tanks is plenty hot for that (why is it that only the Canadians have tanks without turrets and guns?...). Col. Sanders over there says he found some stray chickens and and he knows how to cook them finger-lickin' good. Personally I would go for some nice Acadian Poutine rapees, but I guess I'll settle for a hamburger. OK, now that we have the drinks and food all settled, it's time for a little singsong. Let's go. (clears throat)... AAAALOUETTE, GENTIL ALOUETTE, AAAALOUETTE, JE TE PLUMERAI....(sounds of German accents singing along from somewhere down the hill...) Hey c'mon guys, let's hear it, those Germans in the fields down there are singing louder than you, if you don't raise the volume, I'm gonna start with Lily Marlene... Henri

<BLOCKQUOTE>quote:</font><HR>Originally posted by iggi: I didn't know 100% that the enemy's tank was damaged. I figured it out. Get it? <HR></BLOCKQUOTE> Maybe you figured it out, but that doesn't mean that your tank commander did; his job is to estimate what the most dangerous threat is, taking into account what he can see. What he saw was a Tiger firing on him stop firing and beginning to retreat. That doesn't necessarily mean that the Tiger is incapacitated, he might have decided that there was something more important elsewhere, or he could have been ordered to move somewhere else. Besides, your tank commander's attention was focused on the Tiger; in addition to the other reasons, he might have decided to try to kill the Tiger so that he could brag afterwards about how he killed a Tiger from the front. Just relax: in the game, the units sometimes have a mind of thier own, as in the real world, and men under fire don't always make the most rational choice. For what it's worth, if I had been commanding the tank, you can bet that Tiger would have received a couple more shells on the nose whether he was shooting back or not Henri