MG section team breakdown

[YankeeDog]

HMG/MMG sections of various flavors in the game (HMG42, M1919A4, M1917A1, M2HB, etc.) are usually represented in the game as two units: An MG unit of 3-7 men that actually carries, mans and fires the MG, and often (but not always) an accompanying ammo bearer unit composed of 2-4 riflemen that carry ammo for the MG. While I am no expert, based on what I do know of the actual TOEs, this division of MG sections into two separate units is generally not an “official” TOE thing, it’s an in-game abstraction to better represent how MG sections actually deploy and fight.

Most of the time, I think this structure works fairly well. But since MG sections in the game can not be split and merged the way rifle squads can, there are a couple of drawbacks. First, since this is a “hard split”, soldiers from the ammo team can’t help man the MG if the MG team takes heavy casualties. Second, the MG team always uses its own ammo first and won’t start to use the ammo team’s until it is completely dry; there’s no way to “push” ammo from the ammo unit to the MG unit.

Ideally, it would be great if MG teams behaved more like rifle squads, and could be split and re-joined, even up their ammo and head counts when joined, etc. However, my understanding from comments Steve has made on this subject is that this would require some substantial code changes, so we are not likely to see major changes in this area until CM:Bulge or later.

So, given that the MG section hard split is something we’re going to have to live with for a while, I think it’s important that the MG sections are split in the most useful way. If the MG team is small, only 3 men, it loses effectiveness very quickly if it takes a casualty or two. But if the MG team is large, 6 or 7 men, then it becomes very crowded in the action spot and this increases the chance of taking multiple casualties from a single automatic weapons burst or HE shell. Large teams in a single action spot are also easier to spot, and sometimes have difficulty finding enough cover for all soldiers, which further increases casualty risk. Watching a 7-man team try to find cover in an action spot of open ground with a single shell crater is just comical.

Right now, the exact way MG sections in the game are divided varies widely. For example, most M1917A1 HMG teams have a 5-man MG unit and a 2-man ammo bearer unit. But some M1919A4 teams have a 3-man MG unit and a 4-man ammo bearer unit. 7 total men for the MG section in both, but a very different split. And there are some MG sections in the game (some HMG42 sections, for example) that have 7 men in just an MG team, with no ammo bearer team at all.

Based on my play experience to date, my opinion is that the ideal size for an HMG/MMG team is 4-5 men. This is large enough that the MG team can take a couple of casualties and still remain effective (assuming they maintain morale), but not so large that they’re really tightly packed in the action spot, which looks weird graphically and is a disaster waiting to happen.

I’m guessing that this isn’t something that can be changed for TOEs in the base game, since this would probably screw with the already published scenarios. But I encourage BFC to consider this for future TOEs and follow a guideline of a 4-5 man MG team, with any additional men being put in an accompanying ammo team.

Cheers,

YD

[Battlefront.com]

The sizes of the MG part of the Squad is optimized based on the total number of men, the needs of the weapon, and the ammo type that needs to be lugged around. Until we can code in personnel swapping (something that is on our list of things to do for the next major release) it's about as good as it really can be.

Steve

[YankeeDog]

The sizes of the MG part of the Squad is optimized based on the total number of men, the needs of the weapon, and the ammo type that needs to be lugged around. Until we can code in personnel swapping (something that is on our list of things to do for the next major release) it's about as good as it really can be.

Steve

Ya, I understand the current state of the engine and compromises that have been made. You've explained this well in the past and I think the way MG teams are organized in general is a reasonable way of doing things given what can and can't be done right now.

I just don't understand why currently in the game there exists a 7-Man HMG42 section which is all in one unit and therefore must deploy onto one action spot, and a 7-man M1917A1 team which is split into a 5-man MG team and a 2-man ammo bearer team and therefore can deploy across 2 action spots.

Between the two teams, Gun load w/tripod is basically similar. Ammo load and type is basically similar. But, IMHO, the latter section's 5/2 split is vastly more practical, tactically speaking.

Just one example, there are others.