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GMG Launcher Ammo Reload/Sharing


c3k

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Pitching in here. I haven't even read the last few posts in the thread completely, but I am 99.9% sure I know what is happening (partially) in c3k's test. Here goes:

Det 5 in the first example, as they run away from the scene, gains a total of 50 rounds HEDP in two steps. This is because they are running towards the HQ unit carrying those 50 rounds (and the HQ unit is running towards them, I think), at least in the beginning. The reason for the two increments is that each man in the 2-man HQ unit comes into ammo sharing range at a slightly different time. The first man to come into range is carrying 30 rounds, the second man 20 rounds. Make sense?

The same thing happens to Det 6 in the 2nd example - as the HQ unit nears their position, the two men come into ammo sharing range one by one, adding 30 and then 20 rounds HEDP respectively.

As for the vanishing PPHE, I believe this is due to the fact that Det 6 never had any PPHE rounds on them to begin with - those rounds were being carried by Det 5 and showed in Det 6's ammo count as long as Det 5 was close enough to share. As Det 5 runs away, Det 6 loses access to those rounds.

Remember that rounds being shared show up in the inventories of all units within sharing range. This means that the total number of rounds shown in the GUI (adding up the numbers for all the units within sharing range) is in fact higher than the amount physically carried by the units. If unit A and unit B are both carrying 50 rounds, and they are within sharing distance, both units will show 100 rounds in their inventory (if all the men in both units are within sharing distance, that is - see above with the 2 men in the HQ unit).

Maybe c3k could do another test to prove me right but like I say, from my own experience with GILL missiles I am quite sure this is how things work.

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Let's forget about the PPHE vs HEDP issue as I think that is complicating the issue. Let's just focus on ammo sharing.

AKD: "edit: Just tested and a GMG team will not share its final 32 rounds of HEDP. This is why the total HEDP shown available for sharing is not the actual total of all the HEDP carried by the teams. So sending an empty team to acquire ammo for the purposes of sharing would be pointless."

Am confused as usual... I thought you showed that 2(+) teams would share ammo. So, if 2 teams were in proximity each with 32 rounds, both teams show 64 rounds and one of the teams could fire all 64 rounds(?).

Also, did you show that the "Command element" (that's their HQ correct?) can carry 50 (or more?) rounds, and can give ALL of those rounds to a GPMG team.

The proviso is that the HQ and sub unit remain in proximity till all 50 rounds are expended. ie: if the HQ unit moves away immediately before the GPMG unit fires, the GPMG unit will only have acquired 32 rounds.

Presumably, if the GPMG unit fires 18 rounds and stops firing, it will grab the rest of the ammo from the HQ, so if the HQ moves away immediately after the 18 rounds are fired, the HQ will have 0 rounds.

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akd and stoex: thank you both for your reasoned and supported analyses. I concur with all you've written.

As I stated earlier, this was an experiment conducted in the midst of a playtest scenario. As such, the conditions were not the best for a specific test on ammo sharing. Additionally, having 4 ammo bearing units, 2 of which can utilize the ammo, all within a small space complicates the interactions.

The long-range ability to share ammo was also a complicating factor. The distance between Det 5 and Det 6 when ammo sharing occurred was 24 meters; LOS measured as a TARGET line from Det 6 to the specific terrain location where the leading Det 5 soldier was located when Det 6's ammo count went up. If ammo sharing is NOT based on a per soldier basis, but rather based on the UNIT location, then the ammo sharing range would be greater by several meters.

I will run an isolated test; something quite a bit more controlled than hurling various units together at the end of a battalion level battle. :) I fully expect to get exactly the same results as akd.

Ammo sharing summary thoughts:

1. The inclusion of ammo sharing by BF.C is a huge benefit which outweighs all the following shortcomings.

2. Ammo sharing ability is opaque to the player. This is a game manual/information shortfall. It could be remedied by an addendum to the manual or by modifying the GUI.

3. Ammo carrying and ACQUIRE command leaves room for improvement. In the above example, both the platoon HQ and the non-affiliated pioneers acquired ammo. Neither unit SHOWED that ammo. Only one unit could share the ammo with the GMG unit.

4. Abstraction involved in ammo sharing is fine. Lack of sharing between non-affiliated sub-units is understood to prevent gamey behavior. I.e., how could a just entered rifle squad know that the ATGM squad 1.5km away needs more missiles? Unless they're all in command... (leaving open the ability to modify sharing if all units are in command with a common HQ.)

Thanks,

Ken

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