Guest Guest Posted July 19, 2008 Share Posted July 19, 2008 deleted per user request 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Guest Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 deleted per user request 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JasonC Posted July 20, 2008 Share Posted July 20, 2008 Nothing much has changed, you are just comparing apples to oranges. The weight of the guns themselves isn't the weight of the guns and ground mounts. A German 151/20 aircraft cannon (20mm, used in the Focke Wulfe etc) weighed about 43 kg. The 30mm used in the propeller hub of the Me-109 weighed 58 kg. The heavier MK 103 30mm, with a higher muzzle velocity, was larger at 145 kg (used for tank busting, in a gun pod). The "gun" in the BMP-1 is a launcher for a round the same as in the SPG-9. Its closest cousin during WW II would be the puppchen, which weighed only 100 kg with the ground mount included. Neither is a true full velocity cannon. The 20mm Flak with ground mount was 450 kg, but nearly all of that is the mount, not the barrel, and the weight is comparable to modern ground mount AA systems. Nobody uses full PAK anymore, as towed guns, since missiles do a better job for less weight. (Much more expensive per round, though). If you want to compare the weights of the guns themselves, though, you have to look at aircraft armament weights for WW II era figures on similar autocannons, to those used on modern IFVs. In vehicles, there has been a reduction in weight at the low end, for the same size, by using materials other than steel. M113s are aluminum hull. BMPs use magnesium metal (and burn too easily as a result). Strykers use ceramic composites. All would have been prohibitively expensive in WW II. But full main battle tanks are of comparable weight to their WW II counterparts, even running toward the high end. Bradleys are the weight of Shermans, and M-1s are the weight of Tigers. Russian MBTs are in between, roughly the weight of Panthers (and of IS-2s). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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JasonC Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Well, the 75mm howitzer mounted in the nose of some B-25 strafers weighed 400 kg. I've seen similar weights (somewhat higher actually) for German air mounted 50mm PAK. Those are decent indicators of actual gun weight, for tube, recoil mechanism, breech, etc. Ammo is extra and could run 150 kg more. The BMP-1 gun is lighter because it isn't a true gun, it is a smoothbore mount for a rocket that launches itself once fired. Like a recoilless rifle, basically (though it is closed breech and therefore not true recoilless - same with the puppchen). 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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SgtMuhammed Posted July 21, 2008 Share Posted July 21, 2008 Weight is not the only consideration. Size was also a factor as was role. They didn't intend the BMP1 to have a high velocity gun. It was to support infantry so needed to be more of an HE chucker. They also wanted to squeeze the thing into the tiny BMP turret. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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Field Marshal Blücher Posted July 23, 2008 Share Posted July 23, 2008 Yup. The BMP-3's main gun fires its non-missile projectiles at quite low velocity. 0 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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