Leningrad 1943 text is wrong

[TheHumanMage]

By this time, the Soviet pilots were getting more numerous and much better in combat. The Germans on the other hand while still excellent were becoming fatigued and were having much more difficulty in replacing quality pilots and aircraft.

Talk with the people who made CMBB it is wrong

1 The Luftwaffe still had many more planes then the Red Airforce and NO the Luftwaffe did not have any problems during winter 42-43 to replace men and material

2 Talk with the people who made CMBB

[Fred19]

[Guest Mike]

Why would you talk to someone who made a really cool detailed land combat game about an abstracted air combat card game?? :confused:

[Rastakyle]

Originally posted by Stalin's Organist:

Why would you talk to someone who made a really cool detailed land combat game about an abstracted air combat card game?? :confused:

One possibilty would be you aren't real smart.

Another possibility would be you aren't real smart. The last possibility would be you are a horses ass.

[TheHumanMage]

Because they made alot research into ww2 and know all the numbers

[Guest Mike]

No they do not "know all the numbers". There are many errors in CMBB that are still evident.

And when Rune has replied you have not accepted his numbers anyway!!

[TheHumanMage]

Ofcurse I have he said 6000 VVS in jan 44 vs 1500 Luftwaffe

But he hasent replied on aug 1941 to aug 1943 for every month

Runeis stuck in 1944 he needs a time warp bubble to go back

[rune]

By the time the United States entered the war in December 1941, the Germans had lost the equivalent in aircraft of two whole air forces. From the onset of major operations against Scandanavia and Western Europe in the spring of 1940, the Luftwaffe had faced an appalling attrition rate. In May 1940, a month during which the Germans lost 20.2 percent of their total force structure and 27.4 percent of their bomber force, the Luftwaffe lost more aircraft in three weeks of heavy fighting than it would lose in any other month of that year.3 By the end of 1941, sustained attrition of Luftwaffe units in Russia had brought German air power into serious straits, as production of new aircraft and the training of new crews proved incapable of keeping up with front-line demands for replacements. Adding to the seriousness of the situation was the fact that the German logistic system broke down in the depths of Russia. By January 1942, only 47 percent of bomber crews in front-line units were fully operationa1.4 "In-commission" rates had fallen to 52 percent for fighters, to only 32 percent for bombers, and to 45 percent for the whole force structure.

So much for not having problems.

Rune

[TheHumanMage]

Show numbers for both sides for each month during the conflict only then will you see with your own eyes that the Luftwaffe outnumbered the VVS for the majority of the time untill mid-late 1943

Rune stop jumping from periods

In 41 there were problems these were fixed the problems were not ignored

And do not forget that over Moscow on the 1 of october 1941 the Luftwaffe had 950 planes and the VVS had 677 planes

The Soviet Airforce lost 2000 planes in the first hours of the German attack, destoyed on the ground, then the rest of the airforce was destroyed within weeks also mostly destroyed on the ground

This meant that what ever problems the Luftwaffe had it was several times less then the VVS

And do not forget that over Moscow on the 1 of october 1941 the Luftwaffe had 950 planes and the VVS had 677 planes

Show numbers for both sides for each month during the conflict only then will you see with your own eyes that the Luftwaffe outnumbered the VVS for the majority of the time untill mid-late 1943

[Inigo Montoya]

To Rune,

There is no need for you to provide any numbers for 1941 or 1942. Your numbers for January 1944 (VVS 6000 vs LW 1500) is all that is required to prove your point. Here is the contested introduction:

Leningrad 1943:

"The siege of Leningrad continued throughout 1943. The Wehrmacht was suffering from shortages and the bitter elements, but it was nowhere near the extreme conditions the people trapped in Leningrad were going through. There were a few things that made life more tolerable, including a road of ice that during winter was the primary form of re-supply. The rest of the year ships brought in needed relief.

By this time, the Soviet pilots were getting more numerous and much better in combat. The Germans on the otherhand while still excellent were becoming fatigued and were having much more difficulty in replacing quality pilots and aircraft.

By the end of 1943 the Soviets would start to exact their revenge…"

The facts are that the Soviets *were* becoming more numerous during 1943. Your numbers of 6000 vs 1500 prove it. It's not like 4500 Soviet planes magically appeared Jaunary 1st, 1944. They were built in 1943 as the Soviets were becoming more numerous. Don't waste anymore of your time on TheHumanMage. He will not change his position, listen, admit he was wrong, or reach understanding.

[TheHumanMage]

Inigo Montoya you are so full of it

You still think the Soviets were nomours even though the axis had 2 times the labour force and 5 times the natural resources?

Who do you think was doing all the digging and all the makeing?

Alot of those people could have been sent to the army