SC2 - Korean War Scenario

[Edwin P.]

It seems to me that SC2 would be perfect for modeling the Korean war as the technology used ws the same as used in Korea.

The proposed Weather effects for SC2 also correlate closely to what happened in Korea.

The Major Powers would be North Korea, South Korea, the United States, China and Russia. The Sides - Allies and Communists.

Russia - could only give MPPs- aka Lend Lease- via a rail line and Air units.

China would only enter if Allied Units got too close to the Chinese Border.

The only difference is that in the Korean War Roads were very important and controlled the main avenus of attack. In addition most supplies to Korea came through rail lines. It would be interesting if SC2 include the ability to draw roads and rail lines from one hex to another for use in this and similar scenarios and allowed Air Units to destroy rail Line hexes which engineer units could repair.

The Map at 10 miles per hex would be about 90 TILES wide (Korea accounts for about 62 TITLES) of this with an area at the Map bottom for Japan, a staging Area where US Units can be built be built and transported to Korea.

[ April 25, 2004, 02:21 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[JerseyJohn]

It would be very difficult to reproduce the Incon Landing considering the tidal anamolies and other factors. On a strategic level it wouldn't much matter, treating it with generalities would be good enough.

The original request post for an expanded scenario editor with a map creator specifically cited the Korean War as one of those things we'd most like to simuate.

Again, the scale would be smaller, divisional and lower instead of armies and corps, but I don't think that should be a problem.

[Edwin P.]

JerseyJohn, Excellent point, I was thinking of how to Handle Inchon.

Also I think that Korean war scenario would closely emulate the ebb and flow that occurred in WWII. Rapid North Korean Advances > US Halts the Advance > US Advances > Chinese Enter War > US Pushed Back > US Advances > Stalemate

The game system would also need a way, I believe, to prevent North Korea from Building Transports.

But the map should make things relatively interesting as the terrain is very mountainous. Providing for natural channels of attack and favoring foot soldiers over armor.

Note: Cetain Terrain Types should be impassable to Armor. I am not sure if the current game system will allow this restriction to be factored into the Unit or the Mountain terrain hex.

I would also like to see Bridge Tile-Sides to reflect the importance of controlling major bridges and illustrate the importance of destroying/bombing those bridges, which engineer units can rebuild.

[ April 25, 2004, 02:42 PM: Message edited by: Edwin P. ]

[Night]

Why would N Korea have to be stoped from building transports? All you really have to do is give the U.S. it's navy and historicaly N Korea has little or no Navy so any transports they do send would be blown out of the water.

[Edwin P.]

Historically N Korea attacked S Korea with a massive attack over land where the Allied forces fought a valiant holding action until reinforcements could arrive from the States at Pusan. I would hate to see N Korea player instead send all of those units south via transport to Pusan, The S Koreans and the Americans, even with the Navy ships in the area could never stop them all and at this scale you would not be able to Operate units.

[Night]

I guess you could give the North no ports. Or prehaps reduce their ports to Zero so that by the time they recharge up to 5-10 (where they can load transports) the U.S. should have arrived.

[JerseyJohn]

The North Koreans did attempt to slip some infantry amphibiously along the eastern coast during the initial campaign. A Navy destroyer on routine patrol sank the old slow ships being used, I believe there were two of them literally stuffed with troops. Eyewitnesses described it as murder in the form of a military action.

Edwin

Excellent ideas -- agreed all the way around.

The three or perhaps even four stages of the Korean War are almost like four different conflicts!

It's hard to say what would have happened if the perimiter hadn't held at Pusan. I guess Inchon would have proceeded anyway, but I'm not convinced the U. N. wouldn't just have ended it; and possibly that would, in the long run, have been best for everyone.

Great idea -- have to go off, we've got company -- looking forward to seeing how this develops and especially when it gets to topics like Mig Alley!

[Edwin P.]

Originally posted by Night:

I guess you could give the North no ports. Or prehaps reduce their ports to Zero so that by the time they recharge up to 5-10 (where they can load transports) the U.S. should have arrived.

I like this idea as it would also give the Americans time to bomb their ports.

I would also increase the cost of transporting troops for North Korea to reflect the fact that they had few transport ships.

[Shaka of Carthage]

Korea is a good scenario to discuss because it was bascially fought with WWII technology.

Scale would have to change... but Edwin's suggestion of 10 miles per tile is a good a place as any to start with.

At that scale, it would appear that the ground units would be Divisions and Regiments. For all those fans who want to convert Rockets into Artillery units, you now have a valid reason. The Rocket units can be changed into Corp artillery units, which where Regimental or Division sized units.

We've already been informed, that we can modify or create our own terrain (if I remember rightly). So creating a terran tile that has a road on it, wouldn't be a big deal. But I think whats of more importance, is the ability to create a terrain type for impassable terrain. At worst, I assume you could always make the AP cost the max value (ie 99 or 9). Then, when you create the map, you can recreate those avenues of advance, by placement of the impassable terrain tiles.

The new Engineer unit would now become a Combat Engineer unit, but don't lose site of the fact that its still an Engineer Regiment/Brigade sized unit.

The bridging problem is one of those things that many have mentioned as a design problem when you start taking SC and scaling it down. In SC, if I remember correctly, once you place a unit on a river hex (or maybe next to it), the organic engineers in the unit bridge the river. This is reflected by the next unit paying a reduced AP cost when it crosses the river. It will be interesting to see how you solve that at a lower scale.

Air Units would be around 200 aircraft. And the tech levels, moving from prop to jets, would fit in just fine here.

The multiple nations in SC2 would be good, because now you would have the ability to represent all the various UN forces, not to mention North Korea and ChiComm. Looking forward to how you assign the various experience levels per force.

I would suggest you rename the sides to United Nations and Communists.

[Edwin P.]

I agree Shaka of Carthage that renaming the Side to United Nations and Communists would be much better and your views on developing this scenario is most insightful.

And the impassable terrain address a key issue.

I just wonder if terrains can have one cost for armor units and another cost for infantry units?

Now I will have to start looking for circa 1950 maps of Korea or use some exisiting Korean War Game maps.