Tanks in street fighting

[Lars H]

Which kind of tanks are recommendable in fights in towns, and i'm thinking of close support and anti-tank fighting inside the town

Lars

[Bimmer]

Turretless AFVs are pretty useless in urban combat, except in ambush. Fast vehicles with fast turrets are a must for the attacker. Armor is kind of a moot point since many threats will appear at less than optimal angles, and unless you have one of the few types with universally heavy armor, most AFVs are done for once hit from close range. Guns with good HE capability and a decent ammo load of both main gun and MG ammo are helpful for blasting the enemy and demolishing buildings.

As usual in CM, as in life, failure to sanitize the area with infantry will lead to dead AFVs no matter what you buy. Tactics are the first thing to consider.

[109 Gustav]

For the Americans, I recommend a mixture of sherm 76s and sherm 105s. The 76s have enough anti-infantry firepower to more than defend themselves, and the 105s are great at taking out buildings.

The ultimate city fighting tanks, however, are the crocidiles. Take your pick, sherman or churchill, depending on how much armor or speed you want. They're terrific for setting buildings on fire, flushing the enemy infantry out into the open.

For the Germans, I recommend PzIVHs. They have the fastest turret of the IV series, which is critical in reacting to ambushes. You may want to support them with StuHs, which are about your only infantry support tank. Do not ever get tigers. Yes, they're excellent for work against infantry, because the 88 has such a great blast and their sides can frequently deflect zook shots. However, they're just too slow, and their turrets are just too slow for city fighting. The AI has handed my xxx to me more than once with equal numbers of sherm 75s and tigers in city fighting, when I had the tigers.

Oh, and those cheap marder IIIs are really nice on the defense. Put them in alleys and ambush enemy armor.

In general, I would avoid getting open topped vehicles like the US TDs, Priests, and wespes. They're just too vulnerable to grenades, and you can expect to have lots of grenades thrown at your AFVs in urban combat.

Be sure to get a sharpshooter or two to button up enemy tanks. If they're buttoned, they lose the first shot, and in close range city fighting, that's the only one that matters.

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Well my skiff's a twenty dollar boat, And I hope to God she stays afloat.

But if somehow my skiff goes down, I'll freeze to death before I drown.

And pray my body will be found, Alaska salmon fishing, boys, Alaska salmon fishing.

-Commercial fishing in Kodiak, Alaska

[This message has been edited by 109 Gustav (edited 02-10-2001).]

[Thimoty]

Well, you should try to avoid taking tanks to fight in cities. Even if those at teams miss, they'll let buildings collapse often enough (happened to me a lot of times)

But I guess some decently armored, big gunned tank is good. the AVRE or something. Also, flametrower tanks are lovely

[Gremlin]

If possible, it's better to identify targets in the town with your infantry, and then blast them from the outskirts of town with your AFV's. Geography and urban planning aren't always so accomodating, of course

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"90% of the crucial decisions in this business are made by idiots who don't even play games." Cliff Bleszinski

[Thermopylae]

Actually, turretless vehicles work pretty well....point them down an alley and you've got everythign except it hevay front armro coverd by buildings, and the lack of a turret doen't matter...

[Cos]

Originally posted by Thermopylae:

Actually, turretless vehicles work pretty well....point them down an alley and you've got everythign except it hevay front armro coverd by buildings, and the lack of a turret doen't matter...

Until the infantry flanks you by going house to house

[Cybeq]

For the American's I like a 75mm Sherman due to it's fast turret. It's faster than a 105mm but still packs a decent blast. Mortar halftracks are a fave due to high ammo load.

[Matt the Paladin]

Panthers and Tigers can also give a decent performance. A good gun and thick armor, and the slow turret isn't nearly as much of a disadvantage. Make sure you keep an eye out for flanking maneuvers, and you'll do just fine.

You could also just buy a lot of arty spotters and pound the city flat.

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"War is like a cat, it is easy to let out of the bag, but hard as hell to put back in!"

-Me

[Wisbech_lad]

Crocodiles in the town.

Sexton/ Priest located outside the town, methodically reducing it block by block.

[Guest hal9000]

why not use the tanks to level the city first, and then send in the infantry?

[Sig]

Originally posted by hal9000:

why not use the tanks to level the city first, and then send in the infantry?

A way to counter (as the defender) the "Flattening Method" is to use the "Monte Cassino Method": wait till the building is reduced to rubble and occupy it again with infantry.

As the defender, a good timing is needed as when to leave your position in the targeted building and when to come back.

Drawback of this method: if the attacker uses artillery to level the town, it can be very unwise to leave a building... OTOH the attacker will probably use most of his artillery asset.

Advantage of the method: a nasty surprise for the attacker who now faces intact (or at least not too damaged) entrenched infantry instead of a bunch of poor shaken remnants of a platoon

Sig

[This message has been edited by Sig (edited 02-23-2001).]

[This message has been edited by Sig (edited 02-23-2001).]