DirectDraw expired

[Cpl Carrot]

I just downloaded what I thought was the latest driver for direct x. It was 8.1. However when ever I try to run anything 3D I get a message saying that DirectDraw has expired and to update it. I tried turning the clock back under the control panel to say it was August but no avail. I tried installing 8.0a but they did not over write. I cannot uninstall because 'why would anyone want to' . Does anyone out there have any ideas of what I might try.

One worried Carrot who does not want to become Private.

[Schrullenhaft]

You're running a DirectX 8.1 beta, which has a built-in expiration date. It won't stop working, but it will put up messages to remind you that you need to 'upgrade' to the released version (which still hasn't come out yet).

Unfortunately I don't know of any way to downgrade DirectX. The files that are installed are considered important to the OS and downgrading them could cause compatibility problems - at least that's Microsoft's reasoning on why they won't allow the files to be over-written and subsequently downgraded.

Since the software is still beta and Microsoft usually has testers 'jump through hoops' to get the beta software from them - the DirectX betas downloads are unwanted by Microsoft. Microsoft typically requests web hosters to remove downloads from their sites if they have them posted. So some sites may offer the download for only a short time before Microsoft requests them to take them off.

Here's a location for a DirectX 8.1 beta download. I don't know which build it is or what its expiration date would be. Some betas out there will expire in January 2002, so if these are among them, maybe they'll last that long so you can eventually upgrade to the release version before the expiration messages start to come up.

DirectX 8.1 Beta Win9x/ME (links on the bottom will download from different locations - which may or may not be up):

http://www.filevault.co.za/files_detail.asp?PID=830

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok I will try this version. At the moment the computer just hangs at a point where it has to start using 3D graphics and all I get to see is a black screen and no response. Any way I will give this a go and get back to you. The last thing I need to to right now is reinstall Winblows - then again it has been 2 months

[Cpl Carrot]

Just realized that this is the place I got the thing from in the first place. Any more suggustions?

Cpl Carrot

[Mal Elder]

Although I would never try it myself (: you can do a search on "directx" and "remove" on any decent search engine (i like Google)...there are some people out there that wrote their own programs for ripping out directx components, you may find one for removing dx8.1, although I kinda doubt it...it's too new (: The problem with these is I've never seen one that doesn't break something else :/

On that note, MS doesn't recommend using a beta piece of software on any computer you aren't prepared to format and start over with :/ Thats the problem with 3rd party sites that release this stuff, they usually don't give all the disclaimers that MS does :/ You have to apply to a MS beta program to get it legitimately, which includes you agreeing to all sorts of things, sending emails back and forth, and usually connecting to the beta site with a special password...nearly every step of the way you are reminded that "this is test software only, do not use it on a computer that cannot be wiped out...cuz that's where you are probably headed (:" (not an exact MS quote (; ).

The main reason that directx can't be uninstalled is there shouldn't be a reason too (: Each DX is backwards-compatible with the previous version, and officially, I've never seen a real issue that you could blame directly on DirectX...in every case I've come across (and thats alot of them) it's been driver incompatibilities that cause the issue. Compared to other MS products, DX has an almost clean track record, especially since version 5+

Not to beat a dead horse (actually, I like too (: ), but since DX8.1 is beta (officially unreleased), no driver's are probably out there to support it, and definately no software that would take advantage of any new features that are included.

Edited In: If it comes down to reinstalling Windows, you should do it from a command-prompt, not inside Windows itself...a reinstall inside of Windows won't overwrite new files, while installing from a command prompt should overwrite any windows files with the version from the CD...

[ 09-07-2001: Message edited by: Mal Elder ]

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok so I have done a dumb thing.

When (not if) it come to reinstalling Windows (I was joking about the two months) do I need to deltree Windows or do I just run the install program off the cd and it will overwrite the copy of the HD? (all from the command prompt of course.

On a semi related note - what does run32dll do and is it bad that it always preforms an illigal operation on startup. It has just started giving me this message straight after installing my new video card. ( Which is the reason for installing 8.1)

I guess in the time being it is Moria and Stars! for entintainment.

[Mal Elder]

hehe, not a dumb thing, I love having the newest/coolest stuff too (; DX just has that darn time-limit thing, so you've ran into more of a "limitation" than an actual problem...although not getting into CM is a problem (;

yeah, from the command prompt should be good (: it should overwrite any new files with the old (original files), plus keep your current registry, which will keep you from having to reinstall all your other stuff...you'll need to get any Windows-related Updates (like from the Windows Update site) again, but anything non-Windows (not a file that came from your Windows CD) should remain behind intact. Your mileage may vary (: Some of the newer programs have files that tell Windows Installer that they are new, so not to mess with them...in my experience, DX is not one of those packages, but I've been suprised before. Win95/98 doesn't do this checking, WinME and 2k can if they want too (: I'd stick with a normal reinstall from the command prompt, if it works, you'll be back up and running in no time, if not, well, you'll have to do the wipe-out/startover part :/ (:

.dll's are made up of many functions, and rundll/rundll32 is the program that "runs" those functions. An example I'm real familiar with: IE5 has a maintenance option, it makes sure all your IE5 files are the right size, date, and version. Usually you just click the Maintenance option in the IE Installer...but sometimes it's missing. Well, it turns out that there is a .dll (setupwbv.dll) that controls that part of IE. Inside setupwbv.dll is a function called "IE5Maintenance"...you can actually access that option by going to the Run line (on the start menu) and typing "rundll setupwbv.dll,IE5Maintenance", which basically says to Windows "run the IE5Maintenance function in the setupwbv.dll file". so rundll and rundll32 are only the workhorses here, usually with a rundll error, the problem is a missing target, not a problem with rundll itself.

so in this case, I'd be curious what the rundll message states, it should imply another .dll that it is having an issue with. This is why version conflicts are bad...a program tells rundll it needs a function from a certain .dll, and say the .dll with that name is older than the one the program expects...rundll might not find the function called in that .dll, and you get a rundll error message (:

oops, gotta get back to work...these short breaks are gonna get me (;

[Cpl Carrot]

The dialog box that comes up after the run32.dll error, says that it can't load g66task.dll. The thing is it did not (as far as I know) affect CM or any other game so what does it do. It must (?) be related to my new video card as this is the first time it has come up with this error. The card is a TNT 2 BTW.

[Schrullenhaft]

I'm not familiar with the g66task.dll being used with NVidia chipsets. The only task.dll related file I can find on my Win98 & Win2K systems is mstask.dll which is the .dll for Task Manager. Maybe an utility program loaded up some replacement interface files, but I don't think it is video driver related (but it most likely is related to going back to an earlier registry). You can search your registry (with REGEDIT) for any enteries with g66task.dll and see what they may be related to (by looking further up the registry structure to a recognizeable name of some sort in the left-hand pane). If it is a long-gone program then it may be safe to delete the whole key (for the program), but that may be a little confusing depending where in the registry you find the reference to that .DLL.

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok I have found it in two places.

The first is in windows/run. Has the name G66TASKBAR and data value of: RUNDLL32.EXE G66TASKBAR.DLL,NvTaskbarlnit

The second is in System/Known16DLLs called G66TASK.DLL and data of the same.

I assume it must be the second as there was no ` symbol initacting windows had truncated any info in the error message. I have no idea what they are reffering too

[Mal Elder]

hehe, actually, it should be the first...the "run" keys in the registry are items that run on startup...so you got rundll calling g66task.dll to call the NvTaskbarInit function.

probably something left over from an old video card, or an old driver if you've switched to new (reference) drivers...

you can safely remove that item from the "run" key (folder) and that should solve the problem on startup... (:

[Cpl Carrot]

I have deleted the item and I no longer get the message. So that small problem has been delt to. So I guess now I bit the bullet and reinstall windows. Unless some one else another idea to fix the direct x problem? Please?

Cpl Carrot

[Schrullenhaft]

This is a DirectX uninstaller, but I have no idea if it will work with DirectX 8.1 beta or not (it's geared for v. 5 - 8). It may trash your system, so there are some safeguards you need to perform before running it.

ebrink's DirectX Uninstaller 0.13:

http://www.tweakfiles.com/misc/directxuninstaller.html

Here's a German program call DirectX Buster. I believe that the references on the page to "DirectX 6.1 beta" are actually 8.1 beta. There's some discussion boards listed near the bottom, but they may be in German.

http://www.directxbuster.de/index_e.html

As Mal pointed out earlier, it may not work since the 8.1 beta is too new and I don't know what the file and registry differences are between 8.1 and 8.0a.

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok I will try these a bit later on once I've got some sleep. Don't really feel like staying p all night if I balls something up

[Cpl Carrot]

Well I had finally plucked up enough courage to try to 'rip' Direct x out but have hit a possibly small snag. When ever I try to start in safe mode (as per instructions) I get a nice little message saying HIMEM has dectected at error in XMS (and gives location) hit ENTER to continue. All 'fine and good' Then it says it cannot find HIMEM.SYS (it was just running it!!!) and to restart my computer. Nothing is ever easy. :confused: :mad:

[Schrullenhaft]

You may need to either adjust some of your memory timings in your CMOS/BIOS setup (like reducing CAS/RAS to 3, etc.). Or you may need to pull out and either reseat or remove some of your memory to see if this changes the error.

The HIMEM.SYS file is located in C:\WINDOWS directory and it is probably still there despite the message. I wouldn't necessarily assume that the file itself has become corrupt, but it is a possibility. If you can boot back into Windows normally you may want to make a Boot Disk (which may require the Windows CD).

I wouldn't think that it would be necessary or actually have any effect on anything, but you may want to disable any Anti-Virus protection in the CMOS/BIOS setup. I can't see why it would work, but it may be another option to try.

[Cpl Carrot]

HIMEM.SYS is difenately there - I looked. It only gives the message when booting in Safe Mode (I guess because it can ignore it in normal boot).

I am not very confident about poking around inside my computer so I guess I will just reinstall windows next weekend. (Holidays you see - lots of time to spend fixing what arn't broke

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok holidays are here. Just so I get this right, am I to shut down to MS DOS mode or do I just open the MS DOS Prompt. If I shut down to MS DOS mode how do I go about getting the computer to find my D drive (CD ROM) as it says it is an invaild drive spec. Do I have to find the driver in my config.sys or my autoexec.bat and copy this across to whatever runs when shuting down???

Thank you in advance.

Cpl Carrot

[Schrullenhaft]

You need to load up a real-mode CDROM driver in your CONFIG.SYS file and the matching MSCDEX.EXE line in your AUTOEXEC.BAT (you have to 'Option 5', Step-by-Step Through your boot and load up these lines). You can create a Boot Disk in Windows, which I believe will include a generic real-mode CDROM driver that may work. You can also find this driver in the C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\EBD as the OAKCDROM.SYS file.

You'll need to edit your CONFIG.SYS file and insert the following statement:

DEVICE=C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\EBD\OAKCDROM.SYS /D:IDECD

The following line will be needed in your AUTOEXEC.BAT:

C:\WINDOWS\COMMAND\MSCDEX.EXE /D:IDECD /M:10

The 'M:' value doesn't really matter, but the '/D:' value does - it needs to match the '/D:' value in the CONFIG.SYS.

With these two lines inserted into your startup files on your next reboot select Option 5, Step-by-Step and say yes to your HIMEM.SYS and the above two lines at the least. You should now be able to see your CDROM drive and perform your Windows installation.

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok got that going. I guess the moment of truth has arrived. Good bye cruel Directx 8.1.

Ok now don't laugh but

I need more memory to run setup. I have 412000 bytes and I need at least 442368 bytes.

I think the world is against me in this endevour

[ 09-20-2001: Message edited by: Cpl Carrot ]

[Schrullenhaft]

When you step through your config.sys & autoexec.bat files don't load up anything more than the himem.sys and the two necessary lines for the CDROM. The PATH statement and other variables are OK, but don't load up any other device drivers or executables.

If necessary, put a DOS=HIGH,UMB line in your CONFIG.SYS. This may require EMM386.EXE to be loaded.

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok I now have Win 98 reinstalled and Direct X 5.0 drivers installed. That is the good news. Unfortunately I can not get my display to go above 640x480x16. The computer knows that I have a TNT2 and has the right drivers installed but the computer will not accept anything above safe mode res. Also in the list of things now broken is my modem. When it starts to dial it somehow causes the computer to restart.

Any ideas or is it time for a rather big sledgehammer

Cpl Carrot

[Schrullenhaft]

What version of the NVidia drivers did you install ? I'm not sure how well anything above the 3.xx series works with anything less than DirectX 6.1 (which is also needed for CM). I suggest installing DirectX 7.0 or 8.0a and then installing your particular Detonator driver of choice.

[Cpl Carrot]

Ok installed Direct X 8.0 and no luck. The only display setting it 'likes' is the safe mode one. I know for my old 2D card (intel 740) I had to install a driver to tell my mother board that it had some more dispaly options. I have had a look on my CD and there are no Nvidia type (that I can tell) on it though.

Now I just hope you have not gone to bed and I have to wait until tomorrow to get some more help

[Schrullenhaft]

What chipset is your motherboard based on (i.e VIA, Intel, ALI, etc.) ? If it isn't an Intel chipset, then you'll most likely need to install at least the AGP driver for it. Hopefully this will be what is missing.

If you don't know what chipset you have and can't tell from the manual or looking at the chips, let us know the manufacturer and model of the motherboard and we can point you to the download for the driver.