Operations question

[ThomasZ]

**SOME SPOILERS ABOUT OPERATION ISLAND HILL**

A friend and I are playing "Island Hill" and are about to begin battle 3, greatly surprised to see that the map didn't scroll. Last night (game time) I made a large defensive fortification atop the hill, he probed it twice but decided he'd just go by so he called a cease fire (I had since turn 1) when his forces were fully pressed up against the edge of the map.

We had both thought that this meant the map would scroll. Anyone care to explain why it didn't? Does he have to come up the hill and kill my men to get it to advance (The briefing certainly implied to him that he could go on by). Finally is there some way for me to withdraw off the hill? There isn't any exit zone for me to do so.

Thanks in advance for any insight you guys can provide.

P.S. Anyone know a good sight for user created operations. We generally enjoy them but are running out.

[Kingfish]

3 sites I would recommend for Ops:

Der Kessel

Boots and Tracks

The scenario depot

[ThomasZ]

ok, thanks for that.

Any ideas about my particular operations question. Do I misunderstand how they function? Shouldn't they scroll when the enemy reaches edge of map at days end?

[Kingfish]

Some Ops are 'static' meaning you view and play on the entire map, and it does not scroll. I'm not sure if Island Hill is such an Op.

Did the map scroll for the battles 1 & 2?

[ThomasZ]

no it did'nt but I"ve opened the file and seen that there is a ton of map behind use. The real question I have is what is the criteria that makes a map scroll?

[Kingfish]

There are several, including size of no-man's land and also the size of the battle window, both of which are set by the designer.

[ThomasZ]

Hmm, so there isn't any real way to know what creates the scroll huh? It's just odd in that he's flanked me and wants to go by the the game won't seem to let him.

[imported_no_one]

I do not have CMAK and have not played the operation in question,so I will be taking a stab in the dark here.

You say that your opponent was flanking you,right?In CM operations,so as to prevent map edge hugging,forces along the sides of the map will not move the map as much as the same number of troops in the center of the map and properly spaced out.IOW,mind the frontages that your forces can control--don't spread too thin,don't bunch up.

It is also important to maintain a sense of something like advancing in a line across the map.You will want to have all your units spaced out properly,too.A large group of bunched-up forces will oftentimes have a box around them.

I am not good at explaining these things,so I hope this helps.If not,I can try and explain better.

[ThomasZ]

ok, so you think that if he'd deployed his for differently it would have scrolled? Or maybe because I had to manymen still?

I guess I could open the operations files and see what criteria someone might have set no?

[imported_no_one]

It is not an issue in regard to how he deployed,but how his forces end up at the end of each battle.That is when/where all the setup zones and map advancement takes place.

For example:

Lets say you have to funnel your forces through a bottle-neck in the terrain.It is important to get your forces spread out once they get past the obstruction.Not just for the obvious concerns for arty,but also setup zone and map advancement manipulation.Think about "linking" all your forces up at the end of each battle.

Another example:

Lets say you are advancing all across the map.However,your right flank runs into some significant entrenchments.You know better than to fight through,so you go around.Don't simply go around!Kind of surround the area on your right flank,try and break any contact,and flow any additional forces in the area around the obstruction.Just have your forces lay there and wait for the enemy to attack or fall back.

Unfortunately,it is not a matter of where your forces have been or what they have cleared out,but instead it is how they end up at the end of each battle.

Can you post a screen shot?You can use ImageShackfor free.

[ThomasZ]

sure..I think I can

http://img73.echo.cx/my.php?image=finalmap0oz.jpg

that is allied side, looking at the hill.

and this is axis

http://img154.echo.cx/my.php?image=axis2io.jpg

up on that hill you see in distance.

So you see allied had huge bulk of force on map edge by my flank..why didn't it scroll you see.

[imported_no_one]

Eh,you got me.Not entirely sure I have all necessary information,but even if I did I still may be no help.

How many total battles were there?

Had the map advanced--at all--after any of the previous battles?IOW,are you sure you are not up against the back of the map?

What were the forces involved?Like,was it a battalion attacking versus a company?No need to be exact,just trying to see if maybe it is a build-up type operation in which your starting forces are much larger than the attackers.

What do you mean by; "he probed it twice but decided he'd just go by so he called a cease fire (I had since turn 1) when his forces were fully pressed up against the edge of the map."

Are y'all using the setup zones to move stuff around?IOW,could/should he have actually gone around you instead of calling for a ceasefire?

Maybe the operation designer is around and can help.

[Kingfish]

This is just a guess, but the fact that he is leaving the vast majority of your own forces alone and in their defensive positions may be the reason the map isn't scrolling.

It may be that the computer is calculating the two force's strengths, and determining that his force isn't strong enough to oust your own men simply by scrolling the map.

Just going around them isn't going to do any good if the force he flanks is as big as his own. He needs to force you off the hill the old fashioned way - infantry and artillery.

[ThomasZ]

Some questions answered:

The pics you see is the end of battle 2 of 5.

The map is yet to move at all.

It looks pretty clear to me (I'm axis) from what I've seen (I've not looked at the allied screen shot in truth) I think yes he has probably 3 to 1 or greater force parity. So yes I thin it is a build up operation.

By he probed me twice I mean he sent men close to my defensive position, I slaughtered them and he never sent a more significant force.

He couldn't go around me because we are at maps edge..my defense is built around this fact.

Kingfish..I like your theory, though I'd like to know that was the reason. I guess I could open the old play file and try.

All this said I THOUGHT the map would scroll and we'd get to deal with my being on his flank.